The Wonderful Dispensation of Grace

[thelaqachisnext]

Grace flows from the Mercy Seat to all in Adam, which Mercy Seat is the Throne of Grace; and that Mercy Seat is the Word of God come in the New Man creation human being body as Kinsman.

YHWH committed the message of Grace to the Jews in the Living Oracles, and the High priest in Israel put on the full dress "pattern" of Christ's garments of glory and serving in Christ's office, sprinkled himself with the blood of Atonement and entered the Oracle, the Secret, where the Glory dwelled in the earthly pattern of the heavenly, which was made below to teach us the Truth of the One Way into the kingdom of God.

Christ's New Man body, as Firstborn and our Kinsman, is the Mercy Seat: the really honest true Mercy Seat patterned by Moses in the tabernacle.

Grace for all in Adam -backwards to the beginning and forward to the last seed of Adam who will be multiplied, is only received at the Throne of Grace, which is the True Mercy Seat, the Living Mercy Seat; who covers we who are adopted into His New Man Spirit and places us under Him as the really true "Ark of the Covenant" which Moses saw in heaven and made the copy of, to teach.

He came for "Glory".
He had the Glory before the world was.
He left the Glory and donned the garment of Kinsman to Adam.
He came to do the Father's will.
The Father wills all to be saved -but they don't will it for themselves, and so they won't all be.
He became sin for us.
He tasted our death of separation from the Father's Spirit, on the cross.
The Father laid our sins and iniquities on Him.
"Lifiting our eyes to gaze on Him, on the "pole" as the brazen serpent, we are healed.
He died of a broken heart, bearing our sins and iniquities, He departed as our Scapegoat, into the wilderness -Sheol below.
The vale of the temple [which represented His flesh, when He tasted our death of separation] was split at His death. His blood was sprinkled upon His body, our Mercy Seat, and upon the earth before His body -fulfilling the law, ransoming the earth by that sprinkling- and the Father shook the heavens and earth in a great quaking; and by that shaking He destroyed forever the wall of partition in heaven, which was copied in the pattern of it below by the dividing wall which kept Gentiles out of the sanctuary -on pain of death.

He rose from the dead, and ascended, leading captivity captive. That means that he led all the righteous souls who were held in the captivity of the first death of separation from the Father's glory, who were held as 'prisoners of war' [though in comfortable 'sheep pens', so to speak, below] out of Sheol below when He ascended, and He took them as born again justified in His Spirit souls to Zion above; which Zion above, is founded on "Himself" as the Firstborn Son of the Second human being Creation.

Grace is an OT word, and the Mercy Seat is the means of the Grace to all in Adam.

Glory is what He came to bring us to, by that Grace which we are given at the Mercy Seat .

 

[patman]

You are uninformed about the history of the book and the Church. and you are uninformed about the Mercy Seat New Man body of the second human being creation where the Grace is given to all men for all time; which was planned from the beginning, and has come.

How do you know?

And you have no ability to make a judgment on the book of 1 Enoch as inspired or not, not having been famaliar with the history of the book, the contents, or with the Scriptures well enough to recognize those things written in the OT and NT which are direct references to that which is taught first, in 1 Enoch and not taught in detail about again, as He does not have to repeat the things He revealed through Enoch.

But the point is that MAD doctrine is totally refuted by the book and that book was used by the LORD Jesus and oft quoted from by Him, and in no other place will you find the particular things about His kingdom and His coming and His person, but there, as He gave deference to those things written about Him in that book -as well as quoting from it.

And Paul was a walking expositor on the Book of 1 Enoch, a 'scribe' who quoted the book and gave the sense of the meanings, loosely, from that book many, many times; in which book he read about the Son of Man/Son of God who was to be revealed to the elect in His times, but who was "hidden in God, concealed, kept secret", and whose name was secret, who was "with God and who was God", and who is "the Messiah", "the Creator" and the "coming Judge" of all, who revealed Himself to Paul on the road to Damascus.

Jesus is the "Gospel"; His coming in human being flesh of the second Creation as Kinsman/Redeemer is the Good News to all men.

So where in the accepted canon is the Scripture of Truth which the angel revealed to Daniel in chapters 11 and 12? -Just where is it found? Why is it not in the accepted Canon? -Explain that one, please!

And why is the book of Job so filled with the things found in 1 Enoch in detail, but which are no place else, since Job is supposed to be the oldest book in the OT? -How do Job and his 'comforters' know all the things to talk about which are explained in 1 Enoch -and esp Job knew about the resurrection of the body and the Kinsman/Redeemer who will stand on the earth in the last day and who"lived"; and he knew that Kinsman/Redeemer is/was God, and whom Job knew he would see with his own eyes in his own body, resurrected?

Where to begin... I can know it was uninspired because the book isn't 5000 years old. Even if Job did quote it, everyone in Job spoke sin about God except for Elihu. If there really were quoting from this book, and not visa versa, the ideas they got from it were wrong.

Paul said his message was given to him first and to no one else and was hidden from prophets in the past. Enoch, therefore, couldn't have predicted grace.

Your using another book to explain the Bible cannot work.

 

[Lighthouse]

Dear Lighthouse,
Thank you for your reply.

What part of
God so loved the world
That He gave His one and only Son,
That whosoever believes in Him
Will not perish but have everlasting life
does not directly teach eternal security?

It doesn't show that God will not let go of those who walk away. Not directly.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

How do you know?



Where to begin... I can know it was uninspired because the book isn't 5000 years old. Even if Job did quote it, everyone in Job spoke sin about God except for Elihu. If there really were quoting from this book, and not visa versa, the ideas they got from it were wrong.

Paul said his message was given to him first and to no one else and was hidden from prophets in the past. Enoch, therefore, couldn't have predicted grace.

Your using another book to explain the Bible cannot work.

-sin about God?-better read the book. Job and God Almighty speak in the book and Job's 'comforters' spoke things Solomon collected as "Wisdom" and which David wrote in the Psalms. So no, they weren't speaking lies about God, but they were wrongly applying wisdom's sayings, "without knowledge", or "understanding", making Job one of the 'wicked', when he was not.

To have wisdom without knowledge is worthless, for what good is it if one has a tool and cannot perform the function the tool was made to do without the understanding of what it was made to do, in the first place.

I can tell you do not know world or biblical history because of your illiteracy on the subject.

Paul said no such thing as you say; you have a MAD doctrine which is not found in the Scripture.
Paul was given "sight" to "see" Jesus Christ as the One who was the Hidden in God from the beginning Son of Man, who, as the Word -even the solemn Word, the Oath of God, who created all things by His power- was to come in human flesh of the second human being creation; in whose very image Adam was made, as "Adam, son of God [Luke 3:38 & Romans 5:14; Adam is the "image -tupos- of Jesus Christ; who was to come and is come and shall come]

As to Enoch not being '5000' years old: by that reasoning, the Bible you read is not '2000' years old, nor does it date back to '3000' years old -so your 'point' is without value.

Paul would be a liar if he brought in a new doctrine which was not from Moses' five books -the Oracles.
There is nothing that can be added to Moses writings or taken away until all is fulfilled.

The Day of Atonement is fulfilled for the world by the Passover Lamb -for whosoever will, but Paul, the Jew, kept Moses' all his days, though he knew Atonement was fulfilled and would never be done again.
Paul, the Jew said not to become uncircumcised if called circumcised, and not to become circumcised if called uncircumcised; but Paul, the Jew, kept the law all his days.

Paul, the Jew, in whom the Son was "revealed" got his orders from Ananais and learned from the disciples with Ananais about Jesus' doctrine and about the Great commission, even about the Passover Lamb's last supper with His Apostles.

Paul, the Jew, had as a traveling companion Barnabus, the brother of Mary, whose son was Mark, who wrote one of the Gospels of Jesus Christ, in whose home the Church was praying for Peter's release from prison after James was killed -and in whose home the Passover Supper was held, says tradition.

Paul, the Jew, learned his calling from Ananais, because Jesus told Paul to go into the city and it would be told him what to do.

Paul, the Jew, said Christ is the Passover Lamb, and the Set Forth [openly displayed to the world] Mercy Seat of God.

Paul, the Jew, did not address one word to you and you do not even believe what he did address to those to whom he wrote, for you forbid to speak with tongues, and you do not earnestly seek to prophecy -and other things Paul wrote.

Paul, the Jew, repented and was baptized in water and preached the faith he once tried to destroy.

Paul, the Jew, circumcised the Believer Timothy, with his own hands, whom he called his son in the faith.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

I can tell you do not know world or biblical history because of your illiteracy on the subject.

Paul said no such thing as you say; you have a MAD doctrine which is not found in the Scripture.
Paul was given "sight" to "see" Jesus Christ as the One who was the Hidden in God from the beginning Son of Man, who, as the Word -even the solemn Word, the Oath of God, who created all things by His power- was to come in human flesh of the second human being creation; in whose very image Adam was made, as "Adam, son of God [Luke 3:38 & Romans 5:14; Adam is the "image -tupos- of Jesus Christ; who was to come and is come and shall come]

As to Enoch not being '5000' years old: by that reasoning, the Bible you read is not '2000' years old, nor does it date back to '3000' years old -so your 'point' is without value.

Paul would be a liar if he brought in a new doctrine which was not from Moses' five books -the Oracles.
There is nothing that can be added to Moses writings or taken away until all is fulfilled.

The Day of Atonement is fulfilled for the world by the Passover Lamb -for whosoever will, but Paul, the Jew, kept Moses' all his days, though he knew Atonement was fulfilled and would never be done again.
Paul, the Jew said not to become uncircumcised if called circumcised, and not to become circumcised if called uncircumcised; but Paul, the Jew, kept the law all his days.

Paul, the Jew, in whom the Son was "revealed" got his orders from Ananais and learned from the disciples with Ananais about Jesus' doctrine and about the Great commission, even about the Passover Lamb's last supper with His Apostles.

Paul, the Jew, had as a traveling companion Barnabus, the brother of Mary, whose son was Mark, who wrote one of the Gospels of Jesus Christ, in whose home the Church was praying for Peter's release from prison after James was killed -and in whose home the Passover Supper was held, says tradition.

Paul, the Jew, learned his calling from Ananais, because Jesus told Paul to go into the city and it would be told him what to do.

Paul, the Jew, said Christ is the Passover Lamb, and the Set Forth [openly displayed to the world] Mercy Seat of God.

Paul, the Jew, did not address one word to you and you do not even believe what he did address to those to whom he wrote, for you forbid to speak with tongues, and you do not earnestly seek to prophecy -and other things Paul wrote.

Paul, the Jew, repented and was baptized in water and preached the faith he once tried to destroy.

Paul, the Jew, circumcised the Believer Timothy, with his own hands, whom he called his son in the faith.

The Word come in human flesh of the second Man creation was that "Secret, hidden, concealed, Son of Man/Son of God; until His incarnation, He was "Hid in God" -and Enoch saw Him there, as the companion of the "Head of Days" [YHWH, the Word who was to come in that second [New] Man body prepared for Him to indwell '-from the foundation of the world', as the Lamb who was slain]], and the secret, whose name was secret, who was the Messiah, the coming King, and the Oath of God who made all things and who upholds all things by the power of His Name.

And the OT says, about Him;

Hab 3:3 ¶God came from Teman, and the Holy One from mount Paran. Selah. His glory covered the heavens, and the earth was full of his praise.
Hab 3:4 And [his] brightness was as the light; he had horns [coming] out of his hand: and there [was] the hiding of his power. "nogahh 'owr qeren yad chebyown `oz"

Isa 49:1 ¶Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.

Isa 49:2 And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished ARROW***; in his quiver hath he hid me;
Isa 49:3 And said unto me, Thou [art] my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.

God's Hidden "ARROW" -His Word- was to come, is come and is coming.

He is YHWH SEEN, whom Abraham saw the Day of and rejoiced in:
in Genesis 22, acting as a prophet of YHWH, Abraham acted out the Day of His Atonement as a living oracle, when he named Mount Moriah "YHWH SEEN";

And when He comes as Lightning, He comes as the One who was the ARROW Hidden in the HAND of YHWH, from the beginning:

Zec 9:14 And YHWH shall be SEEN over them, and his ARROW shall go forth as the LIGHTNING : and the YHWH ELOHIM shall blow the trumpet, and shall go with whirlwinds [Cherubim***] of the 'south' -Ezekiel 1, the throne of His Glory is carried by those Cherubim, "Whirlwinds".
Eze 1:4 ¶ And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself, and a brightness [was] about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.

Eze 1:5 Also out of the midst thereof [came] the likeness of four living creatures. And this [was] their appearance; they had the likeness of a man.
Eze 1:6 And every one had four faces, and every one had four wings.
Eze 1:10 As for the likeness of their faces, they four had the face of a man, and the face of a lion, on the right side: and they four had the face of an ox on the left side; they four also had the face of an eagle.
[Eagle faces are on the South].

Eze 1:13 As for the likeness of the living creatures, their appearance [was] like burning coals of fire, [and] like the appearance of lamps: it went up and down among the living creatures; and the fire was bright, and out of the fire went forth lightning.
Eze 1:14 And the living creatures ran and returned as the appearance of a flash of lightning.
Eze 1:15 Now as I beheld the living creatures, behold one wheel upon the earth by the living creatures, with his four faces.
Eze 1:16 The appearance of the wheels and their work [was] like unto the colour of a beryl: and they four had one likeness: and their appearance and their work [was] as it were a wheel in the middle of a wheel.
Eze 1:17 When they went, they went upon their four sides: [and] they turned not when they went.
Eze 1:18 As for their rings, they were so high that they were dreadful; and their rings [were] full of eyes round about them four.
Eze 1:19 And when the living creatures went, the wheels went by them: and when the living creatures were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up.


...
...
...
Eze 1:28 As the appearance of the bow that is in the cloud in the day of rain, so [was] the appearance of the brightness round about. This [was] the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. And when I saw [it], I fell upon my face, and I heard a voice of one that spake.

Mat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Luk 17:24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one [part] under heaven, shineth unto the other [part] under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.
Mat 24:28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

 

[thelaqachisnext]

Hannah, the mother of Samuel, was well aquainted with the writings of 1 Enoch -as Moses was- and when she was given her heart's desire, she produced a hymn of praise which is truth she read from 1 Enoch, esp about the Son of Man who was to come as the King of Kings, the Anointed One.
Israel had no king when Hannah rejoiced in the Anointed King who was to come, is come, and shall come.

Hannah's Prayer
(cf. Luke 1:46-55)
2And Hannah prayed and said:

"My heart rejoices in the Lord;
My *horn is exalted in the Lord.
I smile at my enemies,
Because I rejoice in Your salvation.

2 "No one is holy like the Lord,
For there is none besides You,
Nor is there any rock like our God.

3 "Talk no more so very proudly;
Let no arrogance come from your mouth,
For the Lord is the God of knowledge;
And by Him actions are weighed.

4 "The bows of the mighty men are broken,
And those who stumbled are girded with strength.
5 Those who were full have hired themselves out for bread,
And the hungry have ceased to hunger.
Even the barren has borne seven,
And she who has many children has become feeble.

6 "The Lord kills and makes alive;
He brings down to the grave and brings up.
7 The Lord makes poor and makes rich;
He brings low and lifts up.
8 He raises the poor from the dust
And lifts the beggar from the ash heap,
To set them among princes
And makes them inherit the throne of glory.

"For the pillars of the earth are the Lord's,
And He has set the world upon them.
9 He will guard the feet of His saints,
But the wicked shall be silent in darkness.

"For by strength no man shall prevail.
10 The adversaries of the Lord shall be broken in pieces;
From heaven He will thunder against them.
The Lord will judge the ends of the earth.

"He will give strength to His king,
And exalt the horn of His anointed."

 

[lightninboy]

thelaqachisnext,

Say, how is "thelaqachisnext" pronounced? Somehow, I can't help but think of "the Loch Ness Monster."

Say, what is your opinion of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit in Mark 3:22-30 and Matthew 12:22-32?

 

[lightninboy]

It doesn't show that God will not let go of those who walk away. Not directly.

:bang::doh::sigh:God won't let go of those who walk away because they shall not perish but have everlasting life!

:sigh:Let's get this over with.

 

[lightninboy]

Lighthouse Proven Wrong

Lighthouse Proven Wrong

lightninboy has proven Lighthouse wrong.

*David holds up Goliath's head.*

:guitar:

 

[patman]

:chuckle: :chuckle:

-sin about God?-better read the book. Job and God Almighty speak in the book and Job's 'comforters' spoke things Solomon collected as "Wisdom" and which David wrote in the Psalms. So no, they weren't speaking lies about God, but they were wrongly applying wisdom's sayings, "without knowledge", or "understanding", making Job one of the 'wicked', when he was not.

To have wisdom without knowledge is worthless, for what good is it if one has a tool and cannot perform the function the tool was made to do without the understanding of what it was made to do, in the first place.

I can tell you do not know world or biblical history because of your illiteracy on the subject.

Paul said no such thing as you say; you have a MAD doctrine which is not found in the Scripture.
Paul was given "sight" to "see" Jesus Christ as the One who was the Hidden in God from the beginning Son of Man, who, as the Word -even the solemn Word, the Oath of God, who created all things by His power- was to come in human flesh of the second human being creation; in whose very image Adam was made, as "Adam, son of God [Luke 3:38 & Romans 5:14; Adam is the "image -tupos- of Jesus Christ; who was to come and is come and shall come]

As to Enoch not being '5000' years old: by that reasoning, the Bible you read is not '2000' years old, nor does it date back to '3000' years old -so your 'point' is without value.

Paul would be a liar if he brought in a new doctrine which was not from Moses' five books -the Oracles.
There is nothing that can be added to Moses writings or taken away until all is fulfilled.

The Day of Atonement is fulfilled for the world by the Passover Lamb -for whosoever will, but Paul, the Jew, kept Moses' all his days, though he knew Atonement was fulfilled and would never be done again.
Paul, the Jew said not to become uncircumcised if called circumcised, and not to become circumcised if called uncircumcised; but Paul, the Jew, kept the law all his days.

Paul, the Jew, in whom the Son was "revealed" got his orders from Ananais and learned from the disciples with Ananais about Jesus' doctrine and about the Great commission, even about the Passover Lamb's last supper with His Apostles.

Paul, the Jew, had as a traveling companion Barnabus, the brother of Mary, whose son was Mark, who wrote one of the Gospels of Jesus Christ, in whose home the Church was praying for Peter's release from prison after James was killed -and in whose home the Passover Supper was held, says tradition.

Paul, the Jew, learned his calling from Ananais, because Jesus told Paul to go into the city and it would be told him what to do.

Paul, the Jew, said Christ is the Passover Lamb, and the Set Forth [openly displayed to the world] Mercy Seat of God.

Paul, the Jew, did not address one word to you and you do not even believe what he did address to those to whom he wrote, for you forbid to speak with tongues, and you do not earnestly seek to prophecy -and other things Paul wrote.

Paul, the Jew, repented and was baptized in water and preached the faith he once tried to destroy.

Paul, the Jew, circumcised the Believer Timothy, with his own hands, whom he called his son in the faith.

:chuckle:

 

[patman]

If someone happens to find this and wonder what the loch ness monster is saying, allow me to answer.

I do know a bit about history, Especially Jewish history and the Bible. I respect all it's words, unlike ol' 'nessy.

Enoch was written before he flood, the flood happened around 4000 years ago, Enoch was two generations or so older than Noah putting his life to be around 5000 years ago. Enoch spoke the original language of man, the language Adam and Eve spoke, not Ge'ez, the language the book of Enoch was written in. That language is not even 5000 years old at all.

Using this book, and rejecting books of the Bible is foolish.

Loch Ness Monster knows some things about Paul, but her tendency to read Enoch into scripture and ignore entire books confuses her perspective and causes her to misunderstand what is happening.

Paul, for example, circumcised Timothy ONLY because he was pressured into it by other Jews. Acts 16:3 He baptized almost no one. He gradually stopped healing through out his ministry, and preached grace, not law.

Just overlook such confusion from thelaqachisnext. At least until thelaqachisnext starts acknowledging the entire Bible. Thanks.

 

[godrulz]

:bang::doh::sigh:God won't let go of those who walk away because they shall not perish but have everlasting life!

:sigh:Let's get this over with.

Believes is a present, continuous tense in the Greek. The condition is for those who believe and continue to believe, not those who cease to believe and become unbelieving apostates (see other relevant verses instead of proof texting).

 

[Lighthouse]

:bang::doh::sigh:God won't let go of those who walk away because they shall not perish but have everlasting life!

:sigh:Let's get this over with.

I know that. I just said it doesn't say it directly. And the only reason I say that is because plenty of people can read that, and not get it.

 

[lightninboy]

I personally have nothing to lose in an Acts 2 Dispensationalism vs. Acts 9 Dispensationalism debate.

If Acts 9 Dispensationalism is right, I still have eternal security according to the Pauline verses.

If godrulz is right about saving faith needing to be continuous, that affects the Pauline verses also and MAD has no eternal security and is false.

If Lighthouse is right about saving faith not needing to be continuous, godrulz is wrong.

I think that MAD and Arminianism don't glorify God as much as Acts 2 Dispensationalism.

 

[Lighthouse]

I personally have nothing to lose in an Acts 2 Dispensationalism vs. Acts 9 Dispensationalism debate.

If Acts 9 Dispensationalism is right, I still have eternal security according to the Pauline verses.

If godrulz is right about saving faith needing to be continuous, that affects the Pauline verses also and MAD has no eternal security and is false.

If Lighthouse is right about saving faith not needing to be continuous, godrulz is wrong.

I think that MAD and Arminianism don't glorify God as much as Acts 2 Dispensationalism.

There is only one saving faith, and that is the faith of the Son of God [Gal. 2:20], and it is continuous.

That is the glorious truth of God, and Acts 2 Dispensationalism is completely false on that subject.

 

[lightninboy]

Are the following eight statements true or false?

1. In the dispensations before Christ called the Apostle Paul, there was no eternal security.
I can't answer this with a simple yes or no, because there were dispensations without eternal security, and only one dispensation other than the current one where I believe they had eternal security.
2. Jesus offered eternal security in the Gospel of John.
Not until after He rose.
3. John 6:47 and John 3:16 look good, but in that dispensation, even after they believed, they could fall away.
In that dispensation, true.
4. Continual belief is a necessary condition of salvation.
False. It is an effect of salvation.
5. God must honor His word by giving everlasting life to one who believes upon Christ for it. Salvation comes instantaneously with saving faith.
True.
6. "God"-the greatest person
"So loved"-the greatest devotion
"The world"-the greatest number
"He gave"-the greatest act
"His only begotten Son"-the greatest gift
"That whosoever believeth"-the greatest condition
"Should not perish"-the greatest mercy
"Hath everlasting life"-the greatest result
True.
7. John 3:16 says that everyone in every dispensation who believeth in Him hath everlasting life, and thus eternal security.
False.
8. If Nicodemus had taken Jesus at His word and believed on Him for everlasting life, he would have had eternal security.
Not until after the resurrection.

Notice that in Pauline verses also words for saving faith are said to be in the continuous state. How can you push aside John 3:16 without pushing aside Pauline verses?
See above.

II. FIND THE FAITH OF CHRIST TO BE FAULTY
Whereas the first step removed the basis of salvation--grace, the second step is necessary to reverse the method of salvation--faith. Contrary to popular belief, you are not saved by producing enough faith so that God will accept you. Oh yes, you must believe. But your belief is completed by the faith of Christ. Again, the Bible must be the authority. Look once more at Ephesians 2:8:
For by grace are ye saved through
faith; and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God:
You are saved by grace and through faith. But that faith is not of yourself; it is the gift of God. Does this mean that we are saved apart from our own decision to believe? Not at all! Read carefully Galatians 2:16
Knowing that a man is not justified
by the works of the law, but by the
faith of Jesus Christ, even we have
believed in Jesus Christ, that we
might be justified by the faith of Christ,
and not by the works of the law: for by
the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
You cannot be justified by the works of the law. But you can be justified by the faith of Jesus Christ. This is not faith in Christ, but the faith of Jesus Christ. But in order to be justified by the faith of Christ, you must believe in Him. Sound confusing?
Look at Romans 3:22:
Even the righteousness of God which is
by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon
all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Notice the wording carefully. The righteousness of God is received on the basis of the faith of Jesus Christ. The faith of Jesus Christ is given “unto all and upon all them that believe.” (See also Philippians 3:9.)
Although you must believe to the best of your ability, the perfect faith which provides for you a perfect salvation is the faith of Christ. This means that there is no need to “pray through” or “hold on” in order to get saved. We come to God in simple belief, and He completes our faulty faith with the perfect faith of Christ. This also means that you cannot become lost by losing faith. Although your faith may waver at times, your salvation is based on the faith of Christ. Therefore, the only way to lose your salvation is to find the faith of Christ to be faulty. That completes the second step.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

thelaqachisnext,

Say, how is "thelaqachisnext" pronounced? Somehow, I can't help but think of "the Loch Ness Monster."

Say, what is your opinion of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit in Mark 3:22-30 and Matthew 12:22-32?

Gen 5:24 And Enoch walked with God: and he [was] not; for God laqach*** him.
laqach {law-kakh'}
1) to take, get, fetch, lay hold of, seize, receive, acquire, buy,
bring, marry, take a wife, snatch, take away
a) (Qal)
1) to take, take in the hand
2) to take and carry along
3) to take from, take out of, take, carry away, take away
4) to take to or for a person, procure, get, take possession of, select, choose, take in marriage, receive, accept
5) to take up or upon, put upon
6) to fetch
7) to take, lead, conduct
8) to take, capture, seize
9) to take, carry off
10) to take (vengeance)
b) (Niphal)
1) to be captured
2) to be taken away, be removed
3) to be taken, brought unto
c) (Pual)
1) to be taken from or out of
2) to be stolen from
3) to be taken captive
4) to be taken away, be removed
d) (Hophal)
1) to be taken unto, be brought unto
2) to be taken out of
3) to be taken away
e) (Hithpael)
1) to take hold of oneself
2) to flash about (of lightning)


AV - take 747, receive 61, take away 51, fetch 31, bring 25, get 6,
take out 6, carry away 5, married 4, buy 3, misc 26; 965

In the Hebrew Scriptures:
Adam is laqach out of the ground and placed in the Garden of Eden.

YHWH laqach a rib from Adam and made a woman.
Enoch was laqach -to heaven.
The Church will be laqach to heaven before the great tribulation.
Psa 75:2,3 When I shall laqach 03947 the congregation 04150 I will vindicate*** 08199 with equity*** 04339. Psa 75:3 The earth 0776 and all the inhabitants 03427 thereof are dissolved 04127 : I bear up 08505 the pillars 05982 of it. Selah 05542.

The dead bodies of Believers will be laqach out of the grave.
and so on and so forth.

Gen 2:15 And the LORD 03068 God 0430 laqach }03947 the man 0120, and put him 03240 into the garden 01588 of Eden 05731 to dress 05647 it and to keep 08104 it.

~~~~~~To deny His name in wilfullness, not in ignorance, is blasphemy against His Holy Spirit. To blaspheme the Name you first have to "know" [not know about, but know] the Name, by revelation of the Spirit given to you, which you turn from in denial.
He cannot be crucified twice. Backsliders take words and return to Him, but denyers of His name are reprobates, twice dead.

 

[thelaqachisnext]

If someone happens to find this and wonder what the loch ness monster is saying, allow me to answer.

I do know a bit about history, Especially Jewish history and the Bible. I respect all it's words, unlike ol' 'nessy.

Enoch was written before he flood, the flood happened around 4000 years ago, Enoch was two generations or so older than Noah putting his life to be around 5000 years ago. Enoch spoke the original language of man, the language Adam and Eve spoke, not Ge'ez, the language the book of Enoch was written in. That language is not even 5000 years old at all.

Using this book, and rejecting books of the Bible is foolish.

Loch Ness Monster knows some things about Paul, but her tendency to read Enoch into scripture and ignore entire books confuses her perspective and causes her to misunderstand what is happening.

Paul, for example, circumcised Timothy ONLY because he was pressured into it by other Jews. Acts 16:3

Just overlook such confusion from thelaqachisnext. At least until thelaqachisnext starts acknowledging the entire Bible. Thanks.

You are in error. -And Grace is an OT word and is patterned as the "River of LIfe" which flows only from the Temple -through the Mercy Seat [Ezekiel 47; Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.]; which True Mercy Seat [the True Stone laid in Zion is the second human being Firstborn of the Father] for the second "Temple", was patterned by Moses in the oracles, and is the "New Man" -YHWH come in flesh- which Human Being body of Jesus Christ received the blood of sprinkling], and which River was made so wide in the fifth millennium [when the Seed of the Woman came in flesh] that "a man cannot cross over" -if you would be a student of Scripture you would know that the Grace of God is only available through the Acceptable Atonement offered once, for all in Adam, which ended the remembrance of sin forever and is taught in the Oracles committed tot he Jews.

I do not reject the inspired Word of God -I do reject the Song of Songs as inspired and believe it is trash; and the same people who banned Enoch in the 4th century placed that trash in the Word.

Those who accepted 'Songs' also accepted other books when they banned Enoch, so do you accept the other books they accepted which are not in your Bible today -why not, if not, and when did you decide they were in error about those other books you do not accept, if in fact you do not accept them?

However; you err about the languages. First: you do not have the original Hebrew of the OT -how do you even know what Moses' five books were first written in? -He was raised in "all the learning and science of the Egyptians",
and the Hebrews were slaves in Egypt, and the language of Egypt is the language of the Ethiopian Coptic Church's book of 1 Enoch -which is "Canon" in their Bible, and has been for almost two thousnad years; and it is placed after Job, there.
Second: you do not have the original Greek of the NT. and neither Greek nor Hebrew are your spoken languages, anyway.


Second, as to the languages being confounded, Noah and Shem -for just two, were alive at the time of the confounding of the languages and so was Abram. And Abraham learned all seventy of the languages the nations were divided into, at Babel -so says Jubilees -or Jasher [the Book of the Upright].
Abram was born 60 years before Ussher placed his birth, as is proved in the reading of the ancient "Book of the Upright", which cross references with Genesis continually, proving all ages given in Genesis, and giving them exactly [there are false "Jasher's so called" which are proven false, however]; and the exact year of the confounding of the languages is in Jasher, cross referenced with all dates from Genesis, coming out exactly to what is revealed in Genesis.

And parts of Enoch have been found in Hebrew and in Aramaic -more complete copies in Aramaic than in Hebrew have been found, and in Greek, so you have a nonsense approach to the writings of 1 Enoch, which Book totally rebukes the MAD doctrines on the Son of Man/Son of God, who is shown in Enoch to be the Hidden in God, now revealed One, whom Paul saw last [and he was least] of all the Apostles".

And why are you ignoring the question put to you about the Written Scripture of Truth; which has written in it the things the angel spoke about in Daniel 11,12?

Dan 10:21 But I will shew thee that which is inscribed; written*** in the scripture of truth: and [there is] none that 'binds' with me in these things, but Michael your prince.

Where is the Written Scripture of Truth the angel referenced in Daneil 10:21??????????
And where is the Book written which Jesus called the Wisdom of God, which I asked you about already, from Luke?


And why did Hannah quote from 1 Enoch words which Moses had not written, and which show the Anointed Messiah as the King, who raises up the poor and causes them to inherit the throne of glory? and why did Hannah quote about the wicked's end, about being silent "in darkness", from Enoch, which is not referenced again until Jesus references it in the NT and then which Jude references -and all from Enoch?

 

[lightninboy]

Dear Lighthouse,
Thank you for your reply.

If salvation today were by works and not by grace, do you think you'd make it to Heaven?

Is it likely that anyone would make it to Heaven?

Today man can have no part in his salvation because he has no holiness.

How would things before Christ be any different from now?

Is not any theology that says man can and must have a part in his salvation an insult to the holiness and glory of God?

 

[godrulz]

I personally have nothing to lose in an Acts 2 Dispensationalism vs. Acts 9 Dispensationalism debate.

If Acts 9 Dispensationalism is right, I still have eternal security according to the Pauline verses.

If godrulz is right about saving faith needing to be continuous, that affects the Pauline verses also and MAD has no eternal security and is false.

If Lighthouse is right about saving faith not needing to be continuous, godrulz is wrong.

I think that MAD and Arminianism don't glorify God as much as Acts 2 Dispensationalism.

Most Arminians are Acts 2 dispensationalists (my Pentecostal fellowship is Arminian and Acts 2).