The Wisdom of "Eye for an eye" theology
- Thread starter Ecumenicist
- Start date
Huh? :darwinsm: I see you've managed to veer off into yet another universe of your own creation.aikido7 said:
Hasan_ibn_Sabah
New member
Frank Ernest said:
So whats Jesus saying if we dont repent buildings are going to fall on us? What does that verse have to do with the topic? Please stay on topic.
eccl3_6 said:
If you feel better forgiving the rapist, murderer, child molester, fag and Leo the lion, have at it. You're foolish to do so. Except in the case of the Leo. The lion is not a human, doesn't make or understand laws. I'm sure it doesn't understand much but maybe his name, and that's doubtful. All Leo might get is "blah blah blah, Leo, blah blah blah, Leo." Sorry rebuking someone to show them their sin against you is too much like work. Maybe you're right: maybe you're just not worth it.
Hasan_ibn_Sabah
New member
Rimi said:
You must have a low opinion of Christ and His teachings...Christ commanded us to love our enemies, do you have any problem with that command?
SOTK
New member
Let's look at logic for a minute. Doesn't it make sense to all of you that one should repent before being forgiven? For example, can any of you forgive someone that sins against you on a daily basis? Let's say you have a co-worker that is just nasty and goes out of his way to sin against you on a daily basis. Are you guys saying that it's logical to forgive him on a daily basis. In other words, you forgive him for the same thing day after day. That just doesn't make sense and it's also dishonest. It's impossible to really and truly forgive someone when they continue to remain in their sin and are harming you.
In the above scenario, the loving and logical thing to do is to softly rebuke the person and give him the opportunity to repent. If he doesn't, you treat him as nicely as you can and give the matter to God.
Seriously, some of you are completely missing the boat on this. The way I'm laying it out is Biblical, logical, and loving.
In the above scenario, the loving and logical thing to do is to softly rebuke the person and give him the opportunity to repent. If he doesn't, you treat him as nicely as you can and give the matter to God.
Seriously, some of you are completely missing the boat on this. The way I'm laying it out is Biblical, logical, and loving.
Hasan_ibn_Sabah
New member
Rimi said:
God doesn't have any enemies.
The wayward son in Jesus' parable we have called "The Parable of the Prodigal Son" was forgiven without repenting. We are talking about grace. If you want to bring in a set of requirements in order to be forgiven, you may do that. But then you are talking about something other than grace....SOTK said:
To be an "insider" in the kigndom one must be an "outsider." That requirement is never rescinded.SOTK said:
A sinner is an "outsider"--from the standpoint of those who thought they were insiders.
In Jesus' vision of the Kingdom of God, Christians may be insiders but they are without privelege. Christians (insiders) are never superior to non-Christians (outsiders).
Christains are not the exclusive brokers of God's grace. The irony is that many Christians claim superiority and monopoly in the name of Jesus who never claimed anything for himself--and who insisted that his disciples ask nothing for themselves.
Jesus did not dispense grace, but spoke of a Father who shed grace on all equally. And Jesus did not demand a quid pro quo for salvation.
"The Father makes the sun to shine on both the evil and the good and sends the rain upon the just and the unjust."
aikido7 said:
God willnot forgive without repentence. Period.
If unrepentent is still unrepentent, he will not receive forgiveness because he doesn't want it, or else he wants it with no change on his part (ya know, like repentence) He gads about say, "Hey, God, I'm gonna rape/kill/sodomize/steal and You just forgive me. See ya in heaven!" He is still in his sin and enjoys it if he thinks God must forgive no matter what.
The repentent is still "outside" until God forgives and not a moment before.
Step 1.: Repent
Step 2 : Receive forgiveness.
The authentic Jesus behind the gospels teaches a Rule (Kingdom) of God in which rewards and punishments are inherent in the acts and thoughts to which they are related. Jesus seems to be unlike John the Baptizer, who called for repentance and threatened with God's wrath.Rimi said:
Make no mistake--Jesus could be highly critical, sometimes caustically so. But he did not condemn. He advised his disciples to beg God to forgive obligations to the same extent that they forgive the debts owed to them--"Forgive and you'll be forgiven."
In the everyday secular world--now and in the first century--people expect reward for good behavior and punishment for bad. Notions of reward and punishment are all-too-human, and the themes have a fairly prominent role in Matthew--and in Revelations.
The two approaches stand side-by-side--in strong contrast to each other--throughout the Bible. Both cannot represent the same wise mind.
Which one stems from the real Jesus?