ECT The Two Programs of 2P2P Don't Meet

SaulToPaul

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You are completely misinformed.

Become a believer,

Ezekiel 37
24 And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them.

25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.

26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

27 My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

28 And the heathen shall know that I the Lord do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
 

Interplanner

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Have you come to the point of believing what He plainly says or are you just content to continue twisting Biblical definitions so you think you don't have to believe Him?


He "plainly" says there is nothing about Israel in order for the 2nd coming in judgement to happen, or after it happens. They put together modern Israel on their own because they believed the necessity of the basics of Judaism to hold them together. That's fine, but it is not NT faith, and there's some conflict with it.

There is "plainly" nothing in the NT about a restored Israel, nowhere near as clear as the mission to the nations, which goes on to the end of time. Then there is the NHNE and there is nothing Judaic about it, in 2 Pet 3.

How "plain" is 2 Peter 3?
 

steko

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He "plainly" says there is nothing about Israel in order for the 2nd coming in judgement to happen, or after it happens. They put together modern Israel on their own because they believed the necessity of the basics of Judaism to hold them together. That's fine, but it is not NT faith, and there's some conflict with it.

There is "plainly" nothing in the NT about a restored Israel, nowhere near as clear as the mission to the nations, which goes on to the end of time. Then there is the NHNE and there is nothing Judaic about it, in 2 Pet 3.

How "plain" is 2 Peter 3?

2Pet 3 is plain enough.


For the third time:

What do you mean by 'the end of time'?
 

steko

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He "plainly" says there is nothing about Israel in order for the 2nd coming in judgement to happen, or after it happens.

It's plain that there is:

Act 3:12 ... Ye men of Israel, ...
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
Act 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
 

Interplanner

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It's plain that there is:

Act 3:12 ... Ye men of Israel, ...
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
Act 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.


It is really simple Steko. The times of refreshing were for those in the Spirit of God and his mission already, and yes, the NHNE could have come very quickly (that's the restoration of all things). after the Gospel event (if we were to pretend we could be there) I don't think the DofJ had to happen and I do think the NHNE could have. But that's the tragedy of Israel, isn't it? always wrestling with God. No wonder the letter to Hebrews is the most formidable warning to any generation that ever lived. That one that saw Christ resurrected. You would think they would have believed...
 

Interplanner

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It's all through Isaiah, sir. That's why the middle of Rom 10 has the expectations that it does, and quotes Isaiah. You are not very familiar with such passages.

Paul wanted all of his countrymen to be like him (a missionary) except for the chains, Acts 26.

The Spirit of God's work in the last days (the coming of Messiah) was indeed refreshing. We know this from Acts 2 as Peter used it to explain the launch of the church and its mission.

"All the prophets spoke of these (refreshing) days" v24. There is nothing new offered to Israel as potential missionaries when compared to 2's appeal. What is new is that this is the sustained view of history until Christ changes the whole scene in the NHNE, completely apart from anything in Israel needed.

It is that unnecessity of a theocracy in Judea that PO'd the leaders and made them silence the apostles. Or try.

"Anyone who does not listen (to the appeal of the apostles) will be disinherited from his people" which is exactly what happened as the generation rumbled along to the DofJ. The same thing was said in Mt 21 in the vineyard parable; disenfranchisement, extirpation. What's the question?

There is no 2P2P; there is the messianic mission and it was kick-started in chs 2 and 3, to bless all nations, and Jewish missionaries were to have been the leaders in it.
 

Danoh

New member
It's all through Isaiah, sir. That's why the middle of Rom 10 has the expectations that it does, and quotes Isaiah. You are not very familiar with such passages.

Paul wanted all of his countrymen to be like him (a missionary) except for the chains, Acts 26.

The Spirit of God's work in the last days (the coming of Messiah) was indeed refreshing. We know this from Acts 2 as Peter used it to explain the launch of the church and its mission.

"All the prophets spoke of these (refreshing) days" v24. There is nothing new offered to Israel as potential missionaries when compared to 2's appeal. What is new is that this is the sustained view of history until Christ changes the whole scene in the NHNE, completely apart from anything in Israel needed.

It is that unnecessity of a theocracy in Judea that PO'd the leaders and made them silence the apostles. Or try.

"Anyone who does not listen (to the appeal of the apostles) will be disinherited from his people" which is exactly what happened as the generation rumbled along to the DofJ. The same thing was said in Mt 21 in the vineyard parable; disenfranchisement, extirpation. What's the question?

There is no 2P2P; there is the messianic mission and it was kick-started in chs 2 and 3, to bless all nations, and Jewish missionaries were to have been the leaders in it.

70AD was NOT the DofJ.

And quit being a hypocrite - you are the one who starts thread after thread deriding Mads; only to cry foul when anything harsh is said to you.

It is time you left your Terrible Twos behind, you childish hypocrite.
 

SaulToPaul

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It's all through Isaiah, sir. That's why the middle of Rom 10 has the expectations that it does, and quotes Isaiah. You are not very familiar with such passages.

Paul wanted all of his countrymen to be like him (a missionary) except for the chains, Acts 26.

The Spirit of God's work in the last days (the coming of Messiah) was indeed refreshing. We know this from Acts 2 as Peter used it to explain the launch of the church and its mission.

"All the prophets spoke of these (refreshing) days" v24. There is nothing new offered to Israel as potential missionaries when compared to 2's appeal. What is new is that this is the sustained view of history until Christ changes the whole scene in the NHNE, completely apart from anything in Israel needed.

It is that unnecessity of a theocracy in Judea that PO'd the leaders and made them silence the apostles. Or try.

"Anyone who does not listen (to the appeal of the apostles) will be disinherited from his people" which is exactly what happened as the generation rumbled along to the DofJ. The same thing was said in Mt 21 in the vineyard parable; disenfranchisement, extirpation. What's the question?

There is no 2P2P; there is the messianic mission and it was kick-started in chs 2 and 3, to bless all nations, and Jewish missionaries were to have been the leaders in it.

Nah, the times of refreshing are at the 2nd coming.
 
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