The constitution and the laws of the United States are not Basted on Scripture.

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elected4ever

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I have been doing quite a bet of thinking on this subject and cannot support the notion that the laws of United States are basted on Scripture. Nether can I support the notion that the founding of this country was intended to be Christian. I think the United States was intended to be moral and the constitution and the laws were meant to enforce what was a moral code of conduct at the time. Christian men cannot make a Christian government.
 

Gerald

Resident Fiend
Not to be a pedant, but I think you mean based, not basted.

Turkeys get basted, not constitutions.
 

Granite

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Hall of Fame
Re: The constitution and the laws of the United States are not Basted on Scripture.

Originally posted by elected4ever

I have been doing quite a bet of thinking on this subject and cannot support the notion that the laws of United States are basted on Scripture. Nether can I support the notion that the founding of this country was intended to be Christian. I think the United States was intended to be moral and the constitution and the laws were meant to enforce what was a moral code of conduct at the time. Christian men cannot make a Christian government.

:thumb:

Well done, elected. You and I agree on this one.
 

PureX

New member
The founders clearly stated why they created the United States in the Declaration of Independance. And according to what they wrote, there, they were creating the nation because they believed in the fundamental rights and freedom of all men.

They wrote this:

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

Since their time, we have come to understand that by "men" they were implying all human beings, but that because they were shrouded in the prejudices of their day, they were not able to accept this idea fully, yet. And we have been struggling to overcome their (and our) prejudices ever since, to clarify "all men are created equal" to mean 'all human beings are created equal'.

It's clear that whatever their moral concerns were, these concerns were based on the principal of rights and freedom rather then on any religious doctrines, though I'm sure that most of the founders did not see these as mutually exclusive concepts, and the fundamentalist Christians are claiming they are, today.
 

Nineveh

Merely Christian
The first document penned, on which the United States claims it's base, was written by Puritains and signed by all the men.

The Mayflower Compact 1620

"In the name of God, Amen. We, whose names are underwritten, the Loyal Subjects of our dread Sovereign Lord, King James, by the Grace of God, of England, France and Ireland, King, Defender of the Faith, e&.

Having undertaken for the Glory of God, and Advancement of the Christian Faith, and the Honour of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the northern parts of Virginia; do by these presents, solemnly and mutually in the Presence of God and one of another, covenant and combine ourselves together into a civil Body Politick, for our better Ordering and Preservation, and Furtherance of the Ends aforesaid; And by Virtue hereof to enact, constitute, and frame, such just and equal Laws, Ordinances, Acts, Constitutions and Offices, from time to time, as shall be thought most meet and convenient for the General good of the Colony; unto which we promise all due submission and obedience.

In Witness whereof we have hereunto subscribed our names at Cape Cod the eleventh of November, in the Reign of our Sovereign Lord, King James of England, France and Ireland, the eighteenth, and of Scotland the fifty-fourth. Anno Domini, 1620."

cite

I think Christian men tried, but they pointed out early on it takes a moral society to keep what they came up with, which is why we have lost a good deal of our freedom so far.
 

billwald

New member
1. The Mayflower Compact has no direct connection to much of anything in the year 2004.

2. The American Revolution was about money, not religion. It was forbidden by the NT.

3. The Articles of Conferedation may have been semi-Christian but the Constitutional Convention produced a second Revolution. Our origional Constitution was not "Christian."

4. Lincoln's revolution made the Supreme Court our rulers. This was confirmed by FDR's administration.

5. The USofA is NOT governed by the Constitution but by case law. Has been since Lincoln.
 

Granite

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Originally posted by billwald

1. The Mayflower Compact has no direct connection to much of anything in the year 2004.

2. The American Revolution was about money, not religion. It was forbidden by the NT.

3. The Articles of Conferedation may have been semi-Christian but the Constitutional Convention produced a second Revolution. Our origional Constitution was not "Christian."

4. Lincoln's revolution made the Supreme Court our rulers. This was confirmed by FDR's administration.

5. The USofA is NOT governed by the Constitution but by case law. Has been since Lincoln.

Bill, not picking a fight or anything, but how did Lincoln make the Supremes our rulers? Considering the court barely sat in session during the Illinois tyrant's reign in office...
 

billwald

New member
Lincoln revoked habius corpus (sp?) and other constitutional protections and was backed by his court. Congress never reversed the situation.

Since WW2 we have been governed by the War Powers Act and hundreds of secret laws. The latest anti-terrorist garbage contains secret provisions.
 

Granite

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Originally posted by billwald

Lincoln revoked habius corpus (sp?) and other constitutional protections and was backed by his court. Congress never reversed the situation.

Since WW2 we have been governed by the War Powers Act and hundreds of secret laws. The latest anti-terrorist garbage contains secret provisions.

True, true. The copperheads and newspaper editors were among hundreds arrested by Lincoln for challenging him.
 

elected4ever

New member
The constitution became null and void when the Congress of the United States went home without adjournment.. Lincoln did not do that congress did.
 
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