Real Science Friday- Caterpillar Kills Atheism

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SUTG

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This is interesting, not being an entomologist, I cannot say more than grasshoppers or locusts are good to eat. A little trail mix and a few dozen of these makes for a good days out meal. It helps keep you out all day without carrying a pack.


I'll take your word for it. ;)
 

chatmaggot

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One answer [talkorigins]

Insects produce quinones for tanning their cuticle. Quinones make them distasteful, so the insects evolve to produce more of them and to produce other defensive chemicals, including hydroquinones.
The insects evolve depressions for storing quinones and muscles for ejecting them onto their surface when threatened with being eaten. The depression becomes a reservoir with secretory glands supplying hydroquinones into it. This configuration exists in many beetles, including close relatives of bombardier beetles (Forsyth 1970).
Hydrogen peroxide becomes mixed with the hydroquinones. Catalases and peroxidases appear along the output passage of the reservoir, ensuring that more quinones appear in the exuded product.
More catalases and peroxidases are produced, generating oxygen and producing a foamy discharge, as in the bombardier beetle Metrius contractus (Eisner et al. 2000).
As the output passage becomes a hardened reaction chamber, still more catalases and peroxidases are produced, gradually becoming today's bombardier beetles.


So if it was God's design, and God didn't have death in his creation, then why design a self defence mechanism such as this... or did god Re-Create after the fall ?

You can SUTG keep tossing this word "evolve" and "evolution" around as if that explains something. You two are explaining nothing!

You really do believe this stuff don't you?
 

SUTG

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You can SUTG keep tossing this word "evolve" and "evolution" around as if that explains something. You two are explaining nothing!

You really do believe this stuff don't you?

Doogie and I believe all sort of crazy stuff. The Earth is round, matter is composed of particles, light is composed of electromagnetic waves, etc. I guess we're just funny that way.

You believe alot of it too! If you had a terrible disease, what would you do? Go to a hospital where you could receive the best care using the results of the latest in medical science (based on evolutionary theory), or go to a church where a pastor could pray for your recovery? I think I know the answer.
 

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
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Doogie and I believe all sort of crazy stuff. The Earth is round, matter is composed of particles, light is composed of electromagnetic waves, etc. I guess we're just funny that way.

You believe alot of it too! If you had a terrible disease, what would you do? Go to a hospital where you could receive the best care using the results of the latest in medical science (based on evolutionary theory), or go to a church where a pastor could pray for your recovery? I think I know the answer.

This post is yet more proof that you have NO idea how YECs think.

People in Biblical times knew the Earth was round BTW...
 

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
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Does anyone else notice the irony in Enyart appealing to an evolutionist like Brower?


No. Real science is real science. Brower's conclusion about origins may be wrong, but that does not mean he is wrong about the process and details of metamorphosis. What is ironic is how evolutionists are so "absolute" about everything yet they don't generally believe in God.

IE: YEC's can acknowledge when a evolutionary scientist is correct about real science, but an evolutionary scientist will not even consider the YECs arguments for a Creator.
 

Granite

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Perhaps because those "arguments" lack scientific basis and are a matter of faith.

Brower actually knows what he's talking about. But it's intellectually dishonest to cherrypick the man's considerable body of work to make a point at total odds with what he believes. Creationists, lacking bona fide scientific qualifications of their own, have no choice but to appropriate actual science.
 

Ktoyou

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I'll take your word for it. ;)

Now that you take my word here, see if you will take it further. We do not live on food alone, but the bread of life. Have faith in Jesus, it has no pain, it is not a darkness that makes life less free, it is the beauty of thought and makes the vision of a pastoral day profound. Have faith and do not fear, as faith in Jesus Christ will bring the gift of Grace. It is the Grace from God that makes possible a true work in the name of God. You do not have to work for it, as that is a vanity, all you need to do is have faith in Jesus, the rest follows.
 

Toast

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Perhaps because those "arguments" lack scientific basis and are a matter of faith.

Brower actually knows what he's talking about. But it's intellectually dishonest to cherrypick the man's considerable body of work to make a point at total odds with what he believes. Creationists, lacking bona fide scientific qualifications of their own, have no choice but to appropriate actual science.

That's absurd, why is it dishonest? Truth is truth; it doesn't really matter where it came from.
 

Granite

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That's absurd, why is it dishonest? Truth is truth; it doesn't really matter where it came from.

Enyart wants to use evolutionists to make a point then turn around and continue to denounce evolution. That's convenient but also downright schizophrenic.
 

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Perhaps because those "arguments" lack scientific basis and are a matter of faith.

Brower actually knows what he's talking about. But it's intellectually dishonest to cherrypick the man's considerable body of work to make a point at total odds with what he believes. Creationists, lacking bona fide scientific qualifications of their own, have no choice but to appropriate actual science.


Why do you suggest that YEC's creationists don't have scientific qualifications? They just don't line up perfectly with what evolutionists believe is the origin of our existence. There are so many holes in your theory, it is hilarious!

Anyway, it seems all these threads turn into this argument instead of answering the original questions in the OP. Us YECs have our answer, this complex creation was created by an extremely intelligent Creator and as we progress in real science, the more we understand the creation.

Hey, that reminds when you said this:

The idea that complexity requires a creator is downright puerile.:yawn:
 

chatmaggot

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Doogie and I believe all sort of crazy stuff. The Earth is round, matter is composed of particles, light is composed of electromagnetic waves, etc. I guess we're just funny that way.

You believe alot of it too! If you had a terrible disease, what would you do? Go to a hospital where you could receive the best care using the results of the latest in medical science (based on evolutionary theory), or go to a church where a pastor could pray for your recovery? I think I know the answer.

Just when I thought you couldn't say anything more stupid than you already have you state the above.

You use the word evolution to not just describe but to explain the process of metapmorphasis. Now the same process explains how illnesses are treated? Wow, your theory of evolution does explain everything doesn't it.
 

Servo

Formerly Shimei!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Enyart wants to use evolutionists to make a point then turn around and continue to denounce evolution. That's convenient but also downright schizophrenic.


Enyart used the truth that was stated by an evolutionary scientist. Get over it already.

Hey Granite, is it possible for a YEC to state something that is true?
 

SUTG

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Yes please, I'd be interested in whatever examples you have in mind.

Since you are asking for examples of complex things build themselves from raw unorganized elements, here are a couple of examples:

-Snowflakes and other crystals
-Chemistry in general
-Sand on a beach being ordered by size due to the action of the waves.

Evolutionary algorithms are also used quite a bit in engineering today, so most engineers will be familiar with these concepts.

There are more examples to be had, but any of these are an example of complexity arising from simple processes.
 

chatmaggot

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Perhaps because those "arguments" lack scientific basis and are a matter of faith.

Brower actually knows what he's talking about. But it's intellectually dishonest to cherrypick the man's considerable body of work to make a point at total odds with what he believes. Creationists, lacking bona fide scientific qualifications of their own, have no choice but to appropriate actual science.

Do you really believe that there are no creationist with your so called "bona fide scientific qualifications"?

There are people that believe in creation that do not have scientific qualifications just as there are people who believe in evolution that do not have scientific qualifications. So what? Does that mean that those that don't can't read and use the results of those that do?
 

Granite

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Why do you suggest that YEC's creationists don't have scientific qualifications? They just don't line up perfectly with what evolutionists believe is the origin of our existence. There are so many holes in your theory, it is hilarious!

Anyway, it seems all these threads turn into this argument instead of answering the original questions in the OP. Us YECs have our answer, this complex creation was created by an extremely intelligent Creator and as we progress in real science, the more we understand the creation.

Hey, that reminds when you said this:

I don't consider tax dodgers who get their degrees from diploma mills or other mediocrities with degrees from a silo college to be qualified scientists. Hardly the best brains on campus, as it were. Creationists are hardly qualified to practice phrenology, let alone offer "insight" on paleontology, archeology, physics, or anthropology.
 

SUTG

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Just when I thought you couldn't say anything more stupid than you already have you state the above.

You use the word evolution to not just describe but to explain the process of metapmorphasis. Now the same process explains how illnesses are treated? Wow, your theory of evolution does explain everything doesn't it.

I notice you didn't answer the question. :wazzup:
 
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