Murderers Should Be Punished... debate?

Jacob

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Shalom.

Today is Rishon (First), Aviv (the first month, from the Torah) 23. It is evening, night. Tonight we count the omer, Omer 8, according to the Torah.

I live in Tacoma, Washington, at Park Place. I would like to be President of The United States of America some day. I would also like to make aliyah to Israel. Only God knows what will happen, occur, or take place in my life. I do not have any great plans.

A friend of mine was murdered by family. I went to his funeral. He was a Street Preacher. I knew him from church. Apparently he committed adultery. Which family murdered him I do not know. Anyhow, whether I knew by him or someone else, I have known that there have been abortions in Europe. I am thinking England. I guess England is Europe. Maybe not by all or to all. In any case, abortion is always wrong. If there is adultery, or incest, the woman may die along with her baby, and the man. We need to read God's Law to understand these things.

From a Torah Observant Jew in The United States of America, a proselyte and a convert to Israel and Judaism, I have learned of abortion in Israel and in The United States of America. Now what about England. Murder is a punishable offense or crime. I do not know the word. It is a capital offense. Murderers should be put to death. It is God's Law. It is Torah. If you disagree you can address me here with your reason from Torah, the TaNaK, or the Bible, but I can tell you that I do not believe you will be able to do so. I do not believe that you can find anything of the sort. I have been a pacifist and against war. I still am against war. I also don't want to kill anyone. I don't believe I am still a pacifist, only because murders in other countries with witnesses in our country still need to be tried, but it is not a cause for war it is about witnesses and our national boundaries or our nations' borders. In other words, love and pacifism break when there is murder, as with other crimes punishable with death as found in The Torah and in the Laws of our Nations. And this is different from war or killing people without a cause. Like taking the life of an innocent unborn in the womb.

A judge should not debate this matter, only execute the law or have the criminal executed execute the criminal. But there needs to be witnesses according to Torah Law.

The only reason this is open for discussion, sometimes debate, or debate, is because people do not always understand God's Law. We should have a right understanding, and we should seek to have or obtain it.

I am an Israelite, a Jew, I have chosen the tribe of Levi. I am of Israel. I am a Citizen of The United States of America. Israel and The United States of America.

Shalom.

Jacob
 
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Squeaky

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The Jews are the ones who had Jesus crucified on the cross. You are self condemning. The same measure of judgment that you use on others is the same measure that God is going to use on you on judgment day. Remember you made the choice to join the Jews.

[Luk 6:37-38
37 "Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.
38 "Give, and it will be given to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you."
 

Jacob

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The Jews are the ones who had Jesus crucified on the cross. You are self condemning. The same measure of judgment that you use on others is the same measure that God is going to use on you on judgment day. Remember you made the choice to join the Jews.

[Luk 6:37-38
37 "Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.
38 "Give, and it will be given to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you."

Today is Rishon (First), Aviv (the first month, according to Torah) 23.

No murder should ever take place. There should be no murderers. To say so does not make one self-condemned. However, if one is a murderer and is against murder they will find themself at odds with themself.

murderer

1 John 3:15 KJV - Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Numbers 35:31 KJV - Moreover ye shall take no satisfaction for the life of a murderer, which [is] guilty of death: but he shall be surely put to death.

John 8:44 KJV - Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

murder

Psalm 10:8 KJV - He sitteth in the lurking places of the villages: in the secret places doth he murder the innocent: his eyes are privily set against the poor.

Psalm 94:6 KJV - They slay the widow and the stranger, and murder the fatherless.

Jeremiah 7:9 KJV - Will ye steal, murder, and commit adultery, and swear falsely, and burn incense unto Baal, and walk after other gods whom ye know not;

Hosea 6:9 KJV - And as troops of robbers wait for a man, [so] the company of priests murder in the way by consent: for they commit lewdness.

Matthew 19:18 KJV - He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

Mark 15:7 KJV - And there was [one] named Barabbas, [which lay] bound with them that had made insurrection with him, who had committed murder in the insurrection.

Luke 23:19 KJV - (Who for a certain sedition made in the city, and for murder, was cast into prison.)

Luke 23:25 KJV - And he released unto them him that for sedition and murder was cast into prison, whom they had desired; but he delivered Jesus to their will.

Romans 1:29 KJV - Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,

So can a murderer repent of murder or no?
 

Jacob

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Galatians 5:19-21 KJV - 19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
 

Jacob

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Can and should a murderer be forgiven? What about punished?

If a person is forgiven can they be punished for what they have done?

Does a person pay the penalty for their crime before they are forgiven, people and God?
 

Jacob

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Now what about this?

1 John 4:18 NASB - There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love.

How are we to understand this verse?
 
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