Liberal & Conservative Political Spectrum Claims

Jefferson

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Liberal & Conservative Political Spectrum Claims

This is the show from Tuesday June 10th, 2014

Summary:

Bob Enyart presents the conservative and the liberal descriptions of the political spectrum, both being incorrect of course. Next week, Lord willing, Bob plans to do a full show on the true political spectrum.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
Bob says mentioning our first and second amendment rights is "silly," that our right to free speech and to own guns doesn't come from "a bunch of guys who got together and wrote a constitution."
 

Granite

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Bob says mentioning our first and second amendment rights is "silly," that our right to free speech and to own guns doesn't come from "a bunch of guys who got together and wrote a constitution."

These seem to be the only two a lot of folks care about anymore: The right to swing a gun around and the right to run your mouth.

Can we just drop this liberal vs. conservative bunk and try to do better?
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
These seem to be the only two a lot of folks care about anymore: The right to swing a gun around and the right to run your mouth.

Can we just drop this liberal vs. conservative bunk and try to do better?

Their "better" is a theonomy.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
Theocracy, m'dear.:e4e: But yeah, point taken.


I wasn't sure if I had that right or not. I thought theonomy was the ideology, and theocracy was the system of government based on that ideology. But whichever one makes the point works for me.
 

Jukia

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Bob says mentioning our first and second amendment rights is "silly," that our right to free speech and to own guns doesn't come from "a bunch of guys who got together and wrote a constitution."

Wonder where our right to own guns comes from. Guess I have to wait till next week.
 

Granite

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Two swords for twelve guys and he promptly healed the one person who was wounded.

"Blessed are the peacemakers" just doesn't seem to resonate the same way as "Buy more ammo!" does these days.
 

Lighthouse

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I wasn't sure if I had that right or not. I thought theonomy was the ideology, and theocracy was the system of government based on that ideology. But whichever one makes the point works for me.
It is theonomy. Granite just has a bug up his butt. Must be the fact that he's now twice divorced.

Anyway, a theocracy dictates that all subjects obey religious laws, such as worshiping the god the government decrees, and worshiping said god exactly as they command.

Israel was a theocracy. Of course they were actually run by God so they're not an example of how it could go wrong, at least not by looking at the laws God actually commanded.

A theonomy only dictates and enforces the laws that are not religious/symbolic in the laws of the god they decree. So a Christian based theonomy would criminalize murder but not working on the Sabbath, for instance.

Once again, you can justify anything by a particular verse in your Holy Book.

Based on your interpretation---where can I get a bazooka?
If you're trying to imply that we think it should be illegal for a private citizen to buy a bazooka you are gravely mistaken.
 

Christian Liberty

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It is theonomy. Granite just has a bug up his butt. Must be the fact that he's now twice divorced.

Anyway, a theocracy dictates that all subjects obey religious laws, such as worshiping the god the government decrees, and worshiping said god exactly as they command.

Israel was a theocracy. Of course they were actually run by God so they're not an example of how it could go wrong, at least not by looking at the laws God actually commanded.

A theonomy only dictates and enforces the laws that are not religious/symbolic in the laws of the god they decree. So a Christian based theonomy would criminalize murder but not working on the Sabbath, for instance.

I don't really understand this distinction.

The violent/not-violent distinction is obvious. Murder is violent, drug use is not. Thus, murder should be illegal, and drug use should be legal (in a non-theocracy, that is.)

But "religious/nonreligious?" That distinction makes no sense. You are getting all of your arguments from scripture here. Which I am OK with, I agree that political arguments should be made using scripture. But, how is, say, homosexuality, a non-religious law, but blasphemy is religious? What if someone's religion requires them to be a homosexual? What if someone wants to blaspheme for a non-religious reason?

Here's the bottom line. Here's what homosexuality and blasphemy have in common. Both actions lack any provable harm to a non-consenting party, but both actions are offensive to God. I don't even see how you can say one is more offensive to God than the other. Both were punished by death in the OT.

Outside of the theocracy, Biblical principles are to be applied, and the specific penal commands God gave Israel are not to be applied. Proverbs 3:30 says not to strive with a man unless he does you harm. That verse applies to all of the followers of God, you cannot make an exception because one happens to work for the government. One can make an exception if God specifically says the principle should not be followed in a given situation, so this verse would not apply to a community who was stoning a homosexual in the OT Israeli theocracy, much like the principle "the ant stores up food for himself in the winter" wouldn't have applied to that rich guy who God commanded to sell all his goods.

There's also Romans 12:18, which tells you to live at peace with all men as much as it depends on you. Are you able to live at peace with the homosexual? Yes, so you should, just like the blasphemer. Does this mean we agree with his actions? Of course not.

If you're trying to imply that we think it should be illegal for a private citizen to buy a bazooka you are gravely mistaken.

I should hope not. Buying a bazooka should actually be legal.

Just out of curiosity, should it be legal, in your view, to buy a nuke? I'm not saying the two are comparable, and I'll give you my answer in a minute, but I'm curious what you think. Would a strict theonomist have to say nuke ownership should be legal since no OT law forbids it?
 

Granite

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I wasn't sure if I had that right or not. I thought theonomy was the ideology, and theocracy was the system of government based on that ideology. But whichever one makes the point works for me.

Understood. Some people just can't seem to get this right.:chuckle:

So, how many people here have expressed their hatred for democracy? Most of those who would are on my ignore list, but I'm curious.:deadhorse:
 

Christian Liberty

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