Is there a risk of death from the covid vaccine?

[expos4ever]

I will wait a little longer before even considering taking the virus. Six months' worth of tracking is not enough time to guarantee its effectiveness or safety.

It is sad to say, but guaranteed to be true - some people will needlessly die by waiting this extra six months.

You guys always bend the truth about this. Yes, the vaccine is almost certainly not tested as much as would be ideal. And yes, the vaccine will kill some people. But we are in a pandemic! Hundreds of Americans die every day! You are trying to frame this is as solely an issue of vaccine safety. Of course it is not - the real question is the tradeoff between the risk of the vaccine and the risk of covid.

But, of course, you cannot afford to address that issue, since the facts, as always, are against you.

 

[marke]

You're a liar, Marke. These two sentences are you telling an intentional lie.

I don't know who it is you're trying to convince with this stupidity but you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

You call me a liar for pointing out that there have been no trials longer than 6 months' duration to verify the long-term safety and effectiveness of covid vaccines which are not even a year old. The real question is who are you trying to fool?

 

[marke]

I can just about guarantee you that you are no longer immune.

That is, if you ever were to begin with. The way this is starting to go, with you just saying things for effect that have no basis in reality, I have my doubts that you ever had the virus at all.


So now you cite the exact same science with the exact same "up to 8 month" immune response that you just got through blowing off as an opinion and try to use it to tell me that "there is no cause for concern" over a year after you supposedly had the virus.

You're either a liar or your delusional and stupid.

Either way, you're a complete waste of time.

Clete

An ignorant leftist with an agenda: 'I don't believe anyone gets immunity from the virus itself, but that vaccines are 100% safe, effective, and permanently protect those who take it.'

 

[ok doser]

An ignorant leftist with an agenda: 'I don't believe anyone gets immunity from the virus itself, but that vaccines are 100% safe, effective, and permanently protect those who take it.'

:doh:

Calling Clete a leftist?

Them's fighting words

 

[marke]

You're a freakishly gigantic waste of bandwidth. Why are you even here?

I never claimed that Polio had been eradicated but only nearly so....

Wild poliovirus has been eradicated in all continents except Asia, and as of 2020, Afghanistan and Pakistan are the only two countries where the disease is still classified as endemic.​

​

Recent polio cases arise from two sources, the original 'wild' poliovirus (WPV), and mutated oral vaccine strains, so-called circulating vaccine-derived poliovirus (cVDPV). There were 140 diagnosed WPV cases worldwide in 2020, a decrease from 2019's 5-year high, an 81% reduction from the 719 diagnosed cases in 2000 and a 99.96% reduction from the estimated 350,000 cases when the eradication effort began in 1988. Of the three strains of WPV, the last recorded wild case caused by type 2 (WPV2) was in 1999, and WPV2 was declared eradicated in 2015. Type 3 (WPV3) is last known to have caused polio in 2012, and was declared eradicated in 2019. All wild-virus cases since that date have been due to type 1 (WPV1). Vaccines against each of the three types have given rise to emergent strains of cVDPV, with cVDPV2 being most prominent, and such strains caused over 1000 polio cases in 2020.​

In the last 12 months (5/19/20 - 5/18-21) there have been a total of 980 cases world wide. Source

Your chances of getting Polio are many times smaller than getting struck by lightning twice unless you live in Pakistan where there is no health infrastructure! Pretty much everywhere else in the world your chances drop basically to zero because, as I said in my previous post, it has been all but completely eradicated.

And, incidentally, the near eradication of the virus has been accomplished because of the vaccines. Many many hundreds of thousands, even millions of people, mostly children, don't have to be crippled and die young thanks to a vaccine that is significantly less effective against Polio than the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are against COVID19.


Clete

The chance of an American dying from covid today is about 3 in 100,000,000. The chance of an American, and especially young Americans, dying from an alcohol-related traffic death is 3 in 100,000. Go figure. Should we ban alcohol and quarantine those with alcoholism for the safety of others?

COVID Data Tracker Weekly Review

The week’s key data, narrative interpretations, & visualizations.

www.cdc.gov

*Historical deaths are excluded from the daily new deaths and 7-day average calculations until they are incorporated into the dataset by their applicable date. Of 14,470 historical deaths reported retroactively, 213 were reported in the current week and 236 were reported in the prior week.

Drunk Driving Fatality Statistics

Since 1982, drunk driving fatalities on our nation's roadways have decreased 37%, while total traffic fatalities have declined 2%. Among persons under 21, drunk driving fatalities have decreased 83%. Despite this progress, we still have ...

www.responsibility.org

In 2018, the drunk driving fatality rate was 3.2 per 100,000 population nationally. In 24 states and D.C., the drunk driving fatality rate per 100,000 population was at or below the national level.

 

[marke]

:doh:

Calling Clete a leftist?

Them's fighting words

What type of shoe fits Clete, a left one or a right one?

 

[marke]

It is sad to say, but guaranteed to be true - some people will needlessly die by waiting this extra six months.

You guys always bend the truth about this. Yes, the vaccine is almost certainly not tested as much as would be ideal. And yes, the vaccine will kill some people. But we are in a pandemic! Hundreds of Americans die every day! You are trying to frame this is as solely an issue of vaccine safety. Of course it is not - the real question is the tradeoff between the risk of the vaccine and the risk of covid.

But, of course, you cannot afford to address that issue, since the facts, as always, are against you.

You can test a vaccine every ten minutes, twice a day, three times a month, or however many times you like, but a test record less than 6 months long is poor proof of long-term safety and effectiveness.

 

[Clete]

You call me a liar for pointing out that there have been no trials longer than 6 months' duration to verify the long-term safety and effectiveness of covid vaccines which are not even a year old. The real question is who are you trying to fool?

No, I call you a liar for calling valid scientific research an "opinion" and then turning right around and citing the exact same research as though it were entirely valid.

You're either intentionally lying or your stupid as a brick. Bricks can't type.

 

[Clete]

An ignorant leftist with an agenda: 'I don't believe anyone gets immunity from the virus itself, but that vaccines are 100% safe, effective, and permanently protect those who take it.'

Who was the fool who said that?

 

[Clete]

The chance of an American dying from covid today is about 3 in 100,000,000. The chance of an American, and especially young Americans, dying from an alcohol-related traffic death is 3 in 100,000. Go figure. Should we ban alcohol and quarantine those with alcoholism for the safety of others?

What in the world are you even talking about?

COVID Data Tracker Weekly Review

The week’s key data, narrative interpretations, & visualizations.

www.cdc.gov

*Historical deaths are excluded from the daily new deaths and 7-day average calculations until they are incorporated into the dataset by their applicable date. Of 14,470 historical deaths reported retroactively, 213 were reported in the current week and 236 were reported in the prior week.

1,000 deaths per month divided by a population of 329 million gives us a monthly death from covid rate of 1 for every 329 thousand. That means the chance of dying from an alcohol-related traffic accident is 1,000 times greater than dying from covid.

Yeah, so what?

Drunk Driving Fatality Statistics

Since 1982, drunk driving fatalities on our nation's roadways have decreased 37%, while total traffic fatalities have declined 2%. Among persons under 21, drunk driving fatalities have decreased 83%. Despite this progress, we still have ...

www.responsibility.org

In 2018, the drunk driving fatality rate was 3.2 per 100,000 population nationally. In 24 states and D.C., the drunk driving fatality rate per 100,000 population was at or below the national level.

How is this at all relevant to anything we've been discussing?

 

[marke]

No, I call you a liar for calling valid scientific research an "opinion" and then turning right around and citing the exact same research as though it were entirely valid.

You're either intentionally lying or your stupid as a brick. Bricks can't type.

This is from the NIH:

Lasting immunity found after recovery from COVID-19

The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection.

www.nih.gov

After people recover from infection with a virus, the immune system retains a memory of it. Immune cells and proteins that circulate in the body can recognize and kill the pathogen if it’s encountered again, protecting against disease and reducing illness severity.
This long-term immune protection involves several components. Antibodies—proteins that circulate in the blood—recognize foreign substances like viruses and neutralize them. Different types of T cells help recognize and kill pathogens. B cells make new antibodies when the body needs them.
All of these immune-system components have been found in people who recover from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19.


Why are you calling me a liar for quoting the NIH? Are you misunderstanding what I have been posting?

 

[Clete]

This is from the NIH:

Lasting immunity found after recovery from COVID-19

The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection.

www.nih.gov

After people recover from infection with a virus, the immune system retains a memory of it. Immune cells and proteins that circulate in the body can recognize and kill the pathogen if it’s encountered again, protecting against disease and reducing illness severity.
This long-term immune protection involves several components. Antibodies—proteins that circulate in the blood—recognize foreign substances like viruses and neutralize them. Different types of T cells help recognize and kill pathogens. B cells make new antibodies when the body needs them.
All of these immune-system components have been found in people who recover from SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19.


Why are you calling me a liar for quoting the NIH? Are you misunderstanding what I have been posting?

You're quoting the exact same research that tells you that the immunity is temporary, Marke! It's you who aren't understanding something, not me!

The VERY FIRST sentence you read when you click the link that is in YOUR OWN post reads....

"The immune systems of more than 95% of people who recovered from COVID-19 had durable memories of the virus up to eight months after infection."​

It's right there at the very top of the web page inside the box that's labeled "At a Glance"! and later in the article you read...

However, 95% of the people had at least 3 out of 5 immune-system components that could recognize SARS-CoV-2 up to 8 months after infection."​

And that is verbatim what I said and which you blew off as mere unsupported opinion and then cited this article as proof that I was just shooting my mouth off! Did you just instinctively blow it off as meaningless opinion because I was the one who told it to you? Did you even bother to read the stuff I cited?

What in the world are you even doing here? Are you just here to waste people's time and try to drive them crazy?

Is there anything in the world that could persuade you away from ANYTHING you believe no matter how mundane?

You come here claiming to be a Christian and do things that are just about as dishonest as you could find to do in a text based web forum in defense of fear based nonsense that is the opposite of wisdom or anything that should be coming from a renewed mind. And worse than that, you flat out refuse to listen to reason! That is not prudent, that is not righteous, that is not rational, that is not Christian. It's embarrassing and you absolutely ought to be ashamed of yourself.

Clete

 

[marke]

You're quoting the exact same research that tells you that the immunity is temporary, Marke! It's you who aren't understanding something, not me!

There is a difference between saying "immunity might be temporary" and "immunity has been scientifically proven to only be temporary."

Here is a quote: This long-term immune protection involves several components.

I fail to see how leftists can interpret that to mean Science has proven this immunity to be short-term.

 

[Arthur Brain]

What type of shoe fits Clete, a left one or a right one?

Both, depending on which foot he's putting them on. Otherwise, politically, he's far right wing. Entertaining exchanges though, gotta admit!

 

[ok doser]

Whoopsie!

 

[marke]

Whoopsie!

Greedy owner: 'At no time did we ever tell our employees to dilute vaccines for profit. Even the suggestion is ridiculous. We are not crooks and we never tell lies.'

 

[Clete]

There is a difference between saying "immunity might be temporary" and "immunity has been scientifically proven to only be temporary."

Here is a quote: This long-term immune protection involves several components.

I fail to see how leftists can interpret that to mean Science has proven this immunity to be short-term.

IT IS NOT AN OPINION!!!!

It is the research that is telling them "up to eight months". It's a not an opinion, its not a wish or a dream or a goal or some sort of agenda, its science!

from the article....

"As with antibodies, the numbers of different immune cell types varied substantially between individuals. Neither gender nor differences in disease severity could account for this variability. However, 95% of the people had at least 3 out of 5 immune-system components that could recognize SARS-CoV-2 up to 8 months after infection."​

​

Prior to that research there was data that showed antibodie counts to drop precipitously after only about three months which people over reacted too and caused a big scare that COVID19 was going to be far worse even than it turned out to be.

Furthermore, there are several similar viruses in existence (seven different corona viruses that infect humans including COVID19) and they all have somewhat different but similar immune responses and we know that antibody levels simply do not stick around in the body permanently. That simply isn't how our immune systems typically works against such pathogens.

There are very few diseases that you can catch only once. This is because our bodies usually stop producing antibodies once the infection is no longer a threat. There are some exceptions to this. Measles is a good example. Why we keep those antibodies around is not well understood but the point is that COVID19 is not the first corona virus to show up and so we already have some good long term data on how the body will likely respond to it.

 

[marke]

IT IS NOT AN OPINION!!!!

It is the research that is telling them "up to eight months". It's a not an opinion, its not a wish or a dream or a goal or some sort of agenda, its science!

from the article....

"As with antibodies, the numbers of different immune cell types varied substantially between individuals. Neither gender nor differences in disease severity could account for this variability. However, 95% of the people had at least 3 out of 5 immune-system components that could recognize SARS-CoV-2 up to 8 months after infection."​

​

Prior to that research there was data that showed antibodie counts to drop precipitously after only about three months which people over reacted too and caused a big scare that COVID19 was going to be far worse even than it turned out to be.

Furthermore, there are several similar viruses in existence (seven different corona viruses that infect humans including COVID19) and they all have somewhat different but similar immune responses and we know that antibody levels simply do not stick around in the body permanently. That simply isn't how our immune systems typically works against such pathogens.

There are very few diseases that you can catch only once. This is because our bodies usually stop producing antibodies once the infection is no longer a threat. There are some exceptions to this. Measles is a good example. Why we keep those antibodies around is not well understood but the point is that COVID19 is not the first corona virus to show up and so we already have some good long term data on how the body will likely respond to it.

What has science proven? That immunity from covid lasts no longer than 8 months? No, not at all. That opinion results from misunderstanding what researchers have said, which is that immunity to covid was detected in trials lasting up to 8 months, but no longer because covid has not yet been around to test for more than 8 months.

 

[Clete]

What has science proven? That immunity from covid lasts no longer than 8 months? No, not at all. That opinion results from misunderstanding what researchers have said, which is that immunity to covid was detected in trials lasting up to 8 months, but no longer because covid has not yet been around to test for more than 8 months.

The research that you yourself have cited says otherwise.

Believe whatever the hell you want you stubborn stupid moron.

Go be scared of stupid crap the whole rest of your miserable emotion driven life.

 

[marke]

The research that you yourself have cited says otherwise.

Believe whatever the hell you want you stubborn stupid moron.

Go be scared of stupid crap the whole rest of your miserable emotion driven life.

I take it you are not a loving Christian with a kind, loving nature.