If God created...

[Stripe]

6days: "secular astronomers have speculated the speed of light may have been trillions of times faster than it is now in the past"

gcthomas: "The speed of light hadn't changed over time"

6days: "(quoting secular jouurnal)"(we) propose that light tore along at infinite speed at the birth of the universe"."

gcthomas: "So why would you latch onto that research?"

Answer

Because, it supported what I said.

You're not allowed to use material they deem reliable against them, 6. Tut tut tut.

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[Nihilo]

What is it like to live a life in fear of a despot god?

I don't know.

But you still see the problem, though. What claim can you make for special creation of anything that doesn't carry the danger of being explained as an outcome of natural processes, which in turn are then explained in terms of other natural processes? The logical conclusion is the god gets shrunk back to nothing and you become the vaguest of deists on the question of creation.

That's just not possible with Easter though. I mean, is it? Dead from Friday night to Sunday morning, and then not dead anymore?

I don't know Stuart. Maybe believing Easter is believing God of the gaps, but if Easter is possible at all without a miracle, maybe I need to rethink what a miracle is. Good question.

So what is your attitude to those who can give evidence-based answers that don't involve any god hypothesis?

That's not what people say about Easter. They say Easter didn't happen, they don't offer any alternative that would explain Him dying on Friday and then rising from the dead on Easter Sunday.

Well, I do admire your forthright declaration of that. You make christianity falsifiable, which is in its favour, but against that is the scientifically induced fact that humans don't walk again after execution, which is a scientific disproof of the easter myth. So you come down to the probability that one man in all history has survived a successful execution, and place that in the context of a belief system that denies all other claims by other religious groups that all their man-gods uniquely arose from death. How is the christian claim for their man-god any better than any other 'easter' story?

Numbers. There's no other major religion with such an important and crucial and vital and integral and essential resurrection claim. And then there are two-to-three billion Christians who all believe it. And then there's how Easter ripped right through the ancient world, growing the Church by leaps and bounds, and while it's not proof, it is in the realm of what I would expect if Easter is nonfiction. And the fact is, that's a lot of what I base my reasoning on, is, What if it's nonfiction? What would I expect? I would expect what has happened, in large part.

Another slight problem is that you still need quite a lot of mythology to link 'man rises from dead' to 'we are all saved from the anger of an invisible friend by that invisible friend'. Or do you think all of that is contained within the word easter?

Yes I do. I know you don't believe Easter, so you'll just have to imagine it being nonfiction. Once you've done that, perhaps you can see that of course all the rest of the Christian faith must also be nonfiction, and only trivially so, because if Easter is nonfiction, then the whole Christian faith is too, because the whole Christian faith stands upon Easter. That's paraphrasing what's in the Christian Bible. 1Co15:14KJV

I don't think the story itself is that interesting. It's more like the plot of a badly-written historical fiction.

I meant that, if Easter were fictional, how the Easter story would have come about is interesting. Who made it up? How did they convince so many people to endure torture and the death penalty, without ever recanting? How did they fool so many people so powerfully?

But the question of how people could behave like sheep on such a grand scale, I agree that's interesting. Do you think we would be having this discussion now if Constantine had not made christianity the religion of the Roman Empire?

I do. I get your point, but I do. Because, the reason he did that, was all part of the history of the Church that is in the realm of what I would expect if Easter is nonfiction. I would expect that the Church would grow and grow, in numbers and in power, and so she has.

 

[Nihilo]

The speed of light hadn't changed over time. Spectral line frequencies, for example, are extremely sensitive to the speed of light, and these lines are identical for starts at wildly different distances/times. See here for more discussion: http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/physics/ParticleAndNuclear/constants.html

With the neutron star collision recently (well, with its evidence arriving recently), and the gravity wave, what happens to the gravitational constant in a gravity wave? Or does it remain constant?

 

[gcthomas]

With the neutron star collision recently (well, with its evidence arriving recently), and the gravity wave, what happens to the gravitational constant in a gravity wave? Or does it remain constant?

Hi Nihilo.

The gravitational constant is the constant in Newton's Law of Gravity, which is a static approximation to Relativity, so the constant doesn't mean much in this situation. Of you prefer to think about or in this way that's OK. Assume G status constant, and the gravitational wave washes over you. You don't get pulled and pushed, so the net force stays the same (constant G) but you get stretched and squashed by the wave. Of you were close to the neutron stars then that would be a lot on noticeable squishing, but here it is nearly nothing.

 

[Stripe]

Hi Nihilo.

The gravitational constant is the constant in Newton's Law of Gravity, which is a static approximation to Relativity, so the constant doesn't mean much in this situation. Of you prefer to think about or in this way that's OK. Assume G status constant, and the gravitational wave washes over you. You don't get pulled and pushed, so the net force stays the same (constant G) but you get stretched and squashed by the wave. Of you were close to the neutron stars then that would be a lot on noticeable squishing, but here it is nearly nothing.

:darwinsm:

:mock: gcthomas

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[6days]

Were these particular evolutionists staggered to discover their ignorance? Were they amazed to learn this? Was it shocking because they were in the dark completely?

Stuu may, or may not be around to read this, but I will still have some fun with his above comment. He was mocking me for saying evolutionists were surprised about a certain finding. He didn't seem to realize that they (the evolutionists) were using the word 'surprised' in the article I cited.

Stuu... you shouldn't be surprised. Science often baffles evolutionists, and then they need create 'rescue device' explanations. Here are 2 stories from today...
1. "Scientists are puzzled by ancient tree mystery
ANCIENT trees were much more complex than their counterparts around today, according to a new study, leaving researchers baffled." http://www.express.co.uk/news/scien...on-cladoxylopsid-university-of-cardiff-nature

2. "In fact, the latest experiment from physicists working at the Swiss facility supports the idea that the universe doesn’t exist." https://www.extremetech.com/extreme...er-experiment-suggest-universe-shouldnt-exist

Ha... That must be a bit mind numbing to realize we don't exist?

 

[Interplanner]

From the Alaska State Museum, Juneau, on mammoth tusks found on St.Paul's (250 miles N of Aleutians) and dated 4000YA: 'these examples coincide with mega fauna from the ice age.' Hmmm, how exactly do you do mega fauna during an ice age--unless it is a very short abrupt event and the mega fauna was there at the last possible date?

 

[Stripe]

From the Alaska State Museum, Juneau, on mammoth tusks found on St.Paul's (250 miles N of Aleutians) and dated 4000YA: 'these examples coincide with mega fauna from the ice age.' Hmmm, how exactly do you do mega fauna during an ice age--unless it is a very short abrupt event and the mega fauna was there at the last possible date?

Good question.

And more fundamentally, how do you get an ice age?

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[Interplanner]

Good question.

And more fundamentally, how do you get an ice age?

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Thanks.

I had clear morning weather for the flight from Juneau to Ketchikan. Low sunrise shadows. It was very obvious that the whole coastal range was not only pushed by waves of force into its roughly N--S lines but also that many places are scraped or cut (by slurry?) E--W as well.

 

[User Name]

Good question.

And more fundamentally, how do you get an ice age?

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This is how:

https://youtu.be/r7aZ6vqCk2E?t=12m26s

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[gcthomas]

Thanks.

I had clear morning weather for the flight from Juneau to Ketchikan. Low sunrise shadows. It was very obvious that the whole coastal range was not only pushed by waves of force into its roughly N--S lines but also that many places are scraped or cut (by slurry?) E--W as well.

Yep, the BEST geology is always done by amateurs from thirty thousand feet.

 

[Jonahdog]

Yep, the BEST geology is always done by amateurs from thirty thousand feet.

But he uses such sciency words---"slurry" for example.

 

[Interplanner]

But he uses such sciency words---"slurry" for example.

Only because over half the north American continent surface, and quite a bit of its subsurface, is sedimentary slurry deposit. While most of the surface has marine fossils, most of the corresponding marine floor has sediment from the corresponding watershed's inland. This is what is wrong with Wiki's blanket statement that there is no world flood evidence anywhere. It is actually everywhere, but as we now know, they are part of the censorious unity with Google and Youtube who are being sued by Prager U for their unconstitutionality.

If you don't see geologic forms in nearly flat light from time to time, you also will be deluded by know-it- alls who never do. I don't need them to walk/hike nearly anywhere in the Pacific Northwest and see sedimentary layers that were turbulent deposits; it's everywhere.

btw, to hop from Juneau to Ketchikan is only 10K altitude, and hardly any cruise time. Those views erre from 1-2000 ft above the objects. Add fresh snow to that, and you can see hundreds of geologic clues.

The real problem with your comments is the absence of comment on the stupidity of the state museum's comment on mega fauna.

 

[Jonahdog]

Google and Youtube who are being sued by Prager U for their unconstitutionality.

In what way are Google and Youtube acting unconstitutionally? And please provide a citation to the lawsuit.

Also, how about a reference in the scientific literature to your sedimentary slurry? Where might I find evidence of that on Cape Cod, where I am now?

 

[Nihilo]

Hi Nihilo.

The gravitational constant is the constant in Newton's Law of Gravity, which is a static approximation to Relativity, so the constant doesn't mean much in this situation. Of you prefer to think about or in this way that's OK. Assume G status constant, and the gravitational wave washes over you. You don't get pulled and pushed, so the net force stays the same (constant G) but you get stretched and squashed by the wave. Of you were close to the neutron stars then that would be a lot on noticeable squishing, but here it is nearly nothing.

OK. I realize I'm so unfamiliar with whatever a gravity wave is, that I jumped the gun in my question. What is a gravity wave? How did we detect it? And what is the significance that both the electromagnetic radiation from the neutron star collision, and the gravity wave, both arrived at earth at exactly the same time? And, does the gravity wave's velocity have anything to do with the instantaneous nature of gravity over long distances? Is the gravity wave a spacetime wave or ripple?

Thank you for your response.

 

[Jonahdog]

OK. I realize I'm so unfamiliar with whatever a gravity wave is, that I jumped the gun in my question. What is a gravity wave? How did we detect it? And what is the significance that both the electromagnetic radiation from the neutron star collision, and the gravity wave, both arrived at earth at exactly the same time? And, does the gravity wave's velocity have anything to do with the instantaneous nature of gravity over long distances? Is the gravity wave a spacetime wave or ripple?

Thank you for your response.

I'm not sure that gravity's effect is instantaneous based on this latest info. It appears to be the same as the speed of light. The question then is, if the sun disappeared in an instant, would the earth suddenly fly off into space while the sun was still visible or would the earth fly off and the sun disappear 8 minutes or so after it did disappear.

 

[Stripe]

This is how:

https://youtu.be/r7aZ6vqk2E?t=12m26s

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Thanks for nothing, dullard.

But he uses such sciency words---"slurry" for example.

Hint: When attempting to mock people, make sure you know what you're talking about so you don't expose your ignorance.

:mock: Dog

I'm not sure that gravity's effect is instantaneous based on this latest info. It appears to be the same as the speed of light. The question then is, if the sun disappeared in an instant, would the earth suddenly fly off into space while the sun was still visible or would the earth fly off and the sun disappear 8 minutes or so after it did disappear.

Darwinists love the discussion to be about something else when faced with questions they find uncomfortable.

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[User Name]

Hmmm, how exactly do you do mega fauna during an ice age--unless it is a very short abrupt event and the mega fauna was there at the last possible date?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleistocene_megafauna

 

[Jonahdog]

Thanks for nothing, dullard.



Hint: When attempting to mock people, make sure you know what you're talking about so you don't expose your ignorance.

:mock: Dog

Darwinists love the discussion to be about something else when faced with questions they find uncomfortable.

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Stripey must be nice to be so disconnected from the real world.

 

[Stripe]

Stripey must be nice to be so disconnected from the real world.

Another Darwinist, another content-free offering.

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