Hate the sin or the sinner?

[eccl3_6]

Thanks for the reply :thumb:

1. The "hate the sin but love the sinner" isn't biblical...

Like intro2faith says what about those verses about love thy enemy?

Biblical or otherwise though....

If the sinner continues in their ways of sinning, it is hateful in its entirety.

What the sinning or the actual sinner?

Although, you are supposed to love everyone, sin occurs from the heart of the sinner and thus, because the sinner is so contaminated with sin (which we hate)...there's disapproval.

We disapprove but we don't hate, we should rebute an unrepentent sinner but we do not hate them. Is this what you are saying?

2. Sin is disobedience towards God. Sin is anything that revolves around selfishness.

Good Answer!.......Is all sin rooted in selfishness?

 

[eccl3_6]

And so allowing the discussion to mature...

#A Is it ever acceptable to hate physicality, not just only action? i.e. the sin (rebuttal not being hate)

#B Is all sin rooted in selfishness?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Like intro2faith says what about those verses about love thy enemy?

Maybe true love doesn't look like acceptance or apathy. :think:

 

[eccl3_6]

Maybe true love doesn't look like acceptance or apathy. :think:

Exactly! In answering #A we must consider; what do you think limits true love? Do you think love can be expressed as a 'hateful action'. Does sin limit love and how it can be expressed? Must the expression of Love be truthful to itself, that a loving sentiment leads to a loving action?



#A Is it ever acceptable to hate physicality, not just only action? i.e. the sin (rebuttal not being hate)

#B Is all sin rooted in selfishness?

 

[Balder]

I already took a shot at this topic:

Hating the Sinner

Pretty similar responses.



Some things you can just count on, I guess!

 

[defcon]

Why so quick to accept the answer that "all sin is rooted is selfishness." Did I not state what sin was and explain it earlier? Any reason why you disregard my explanation (without offering a rebuttal) for this one?

 

[eccl3_6]

Cheers for the heads-up Balder....this will save a lot of time!

Thankyou.

BALDER CLEAR SOME MAIL FROM YOUR MAILBOX.....NOBODY CAN PM YOU!

 

[eccl3_6]

Why so quick to accept the answer that "all sin is rooted is selfishness." Did I not state what sin was and explain it earlier? Any reason why you disregard my explanation (without offering a rebuttal) for this one?

Not at all. I actually thought yours was a strong point, strongly made! I wanted clarification on all sin being rooted in selfishness because it was slightly more ambiguous.

But to take up your line......it seemed you were suggesting that pretty much everything was sinful as it didnt match up to His Holiness. Am I right?

 

[defcon]

Not at all. I actually thought yours was a strong point, strongly made! I wanted clarification on all sin being rooted in selfishness because it was slightly more ambiguous.

But to take up your line......it seemed you were suggesting that pretty much everything was sinful as it didnt match up to His Holiness. Am I right?

Thanks for the explanation.

And yes, you are correct in as much that anything from ourselves (human nature) is worthless and sinful. However, actions wrought by God's Spirit through us of course are not sinful. I don't think you were implying differently, but I wanted to clarify.

 

[beefalobilly]

Maybe true love doesn't look like acceptance or apathy. :think:

Tough love still isn't hate though. My friends and family sin everyday but I don't hate them. If it's impossible to separate the sin from the sinner (hate the sin not the sinner), then it would be impossible to love anyone.

 

[eccl3_6]

Thanks for the explanation.

And yes, you are correct in as much that anything from ourselves (human nature) is worthless and sinful. However, actions wrought by God's Spirit through us of course are not sinful. I don't think you were implying differently, but I wanted to clarify.

Are all sins equal....or some more heinous than others. I suspect a sin against the Holy Spirit is worse than say a sin against another person or am I wrong. Is sin, sin regardless and all sin is equal?

This isn't a trick question I'm finding where people stand before I propose a discussion regarding this.

 

[eccl3_6]

Tough love still isn't hate though. My friends and family sin everyday but I don't hate them. If it's impossible to separate the sin from the sinner (hate the sin not the sinner), then it would be impossible to love anyone.

GOOD ANSWER - What is tough love though? When does tough love become a hateful act? What Im really asking is how far can you take tough love?.....can I kill someone, hit them, rebute them, deny them something, even force myself to hate them in the name of love?

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Are all sins equal....or some more heinous than others. I suspect a sin against the Holy Spirit is worse than say a sin against another person or am I wrong. Is sin, sin regardless and all sin is equal?

This isn't a trick question I'm finding where people stand before I propose a discussion regarding this.

God makes it CLEAR all sin is NOT EQUAL.

 

[defcon]

Are all sins equal....or some more heinous than others. I suspect a sin against the Holy Spirit is worse than say a sin against another person or am I wrong. Is sin, sin regardless and all sin is equal?

This isn't a trick question I'm finding where people stand before I propose a discussion regarding this.

All sin is equal. Speeding on your way to work is the same as murder in God's eyes. The sin against the Holy Spirit is one of the most discussed but I believe there are only two ways to view it in light of Scripture

1) It is a sin that can never again be committed. The Pharisees accused Jesus of being Satanic when He drove the demon out of the man. Here they had irrefutable proof that He was God and still denied it. Since Christ is not in the world as He was then, this "unpardonable sin" can't be committed.
2) This unpardonable sin is the state of unbelief through life and death of an individual. This, of course, will not be forgiven, only those in Christ will be forgiven.

Either way, this "sin" does not affect the gospel message.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

I already took a shot at this topic:

Hating the Sinner

Pretty similar responses.

Some things you can just count on, I guess!

Uh, what is that supposed to mean? Is that supposed to be some sort of jab at folks for maintaining their position on a given issue? Would it be better that we change our stance every time we are asked a similar question?

 

[defcon]

God makes it CLEAR all sin is NOT EQUAL.

Not equal on this earth? Ok, I'll buy that since there are different consequences for sin here on this earth listed throughout the Bible. However, from an eternal perspective - the punishment for "lesser" sin and "big" sins are the same - separation from God and eternal torment.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

All sin is equal. Speeding on your way to work is the same as murder in God's eyes. The sin against the Holy Spirit is one of the most discussed but I believe there are only two ways to view it in light of Scripture

1) It is a sin that can never again be committed. The Pharisees accused Jesus of being Satanic when He drove the demon out of the man. Here they had irrefutable proof that He was God and still denied it. Since Christ is not in the world as He was then, this "unpardonable sin" can't be committed.
2) This unpardonable sin is the state of unbelief through life and death of an individual. This, of course, will not be forgiven, only those in Christ will be forgiven.

Either way, this "sin" does not effect the gospel message.

While all sin may be worthy of seperating ourselves from God all sin certainly isn't equal. Do you honestly believe stealing a Tootsie Roll from 7-11 is equal to murdering an elderly woman and stealing her money?

Setting the common sense aspect aside God has made Himself very clear on this issue....

John 19:11 Jesus answered, “You could have no power at all against Me unless it had been given you from above. Therefore the one who delivered Me to you has the greater sin.”

Luke 12:47 “And that servant who knew his master’s will, and did not prepare himself or do according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 “But he who did not know, yet committed things deserving of stripes, shall be beaten with few. For everyone to whom much is given, from him much will be required; and to whom much has been committed, of him they will ask the more.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Either way, this "sin" does not affect the gospel message.

When you says things like the following it does....

All sin is equal. Speeding on your way to work is the same as murder in God's eyes.

When unbelievers hear Christians make statements like that, you can be sure it affects the gospel message BIG TIME!

 

[Balder]

Uh, what is that supposed to mean? Is that supposed to be some sort of jab at folks for maintaining their position on a given issue? Would it be better that we change our stance every time we are asked a similar question?

No, Knight, it wouldn't. It's just an admission that my own efforts at changing minds in this area have not been very successful, as far as I can tell.

 

[Balder]

Cheers for the heads-up Balder....
BALDER CLEAR SOME MAIL FROM YOUR MAILBOX.....NOBODY CAN PM YOU!

Oh, I hadn't noticed my Inbox was full. Thanks.

I've cleared some space.