Do You Repent Daily

[marhig]

I don't need to get forgiven, I live forgiven, past tense. And guilt and shame died back then too.

Guilt and shame are not healthy Christian emotions.

Blimey I pray and ask God to forgive me always.

Why would Jesus ask us to pray daily for forgiveness in the Lord's prayer if we don't need to always be forgiven? And there is a condition, we are forgiven as we forgive others who sin against us.

Why would Jesus include forgiveness in the Lord's prayer if there was no need for it?

 

[iouae]

Blimey I pray and ask God to forgive me always.

Why would Jesus ask us to pray daily for forgiveness in the Lord's prayer if we don't need to always be forgiven? And there is a condition, we are forgiven as we forgive others who sin against us.

Why would Jesus include forgiveness in the Lord's prayer if there was no need for it?

The point of the Lord's prayer is that YOU FORGIVE anyone who has sinned against you, so that YOU don't live with baggage. God is just saying, "How would you like to live unforgiven by me?"
But God HAS (PAST TENSE) forgiven you unless you live in unforgiveness. That is the whole point of the following parable...


Mat 18:21
¶
Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mat 18:22
¶
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
Mat 18:23
Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
Mat 18:24
And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents.
Mat 18:25
But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made.
Mat 18:26
The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:27
Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
Mat 18:28
¶
But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest.
Mat 18:29
And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:30
And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.
Mat 18:31
So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
Mat 18:32
Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33
Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34
And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
Mat 18:35
¶
So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

God would be a hypocrite to tell us to forgive 70x7 if He Himself did not do that to us.

 

[Squeaky]

I don't need to get forgiven, I live forgiven, past tense. And guilt and shame died back then too.

Guilt and shame are not healthy Christian emotions.

I said
Use your head. If it was all done on the cross. There would be no need for a judgment day. The cross was what sealed the new testament and made it valid. Jesus made the way we can be forgiven, by repenting of our sins. When they happen.

[Heb 9:16-17
16 For where there [is] a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament [is] in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives.

 

[Squeaky]

The point of the Lord's prayer is that YOU FORGIVE anyone who has sinned against you, so that YOU don't live with baggage. God is just saying, "How would you like to live unforgiven by me?"
But God HAS (PAST TENSE) forgiven you unless you live in unforgiveness. That is the whole point of the following parable...


Mat 18:21
¶
Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mat 18:22
¶
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.
Mat 18:23
Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants.
Mat 18:24
And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents.
Mat 18:25
But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made.
Mat 18:26
The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:27
Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt.
Mat 18:28
¶
But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest.
Mat 18:29
And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all.
Mat 18:30
And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt.
Mat 18:31
So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done.
Mat 18:32
Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33
Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34
And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
Mat 18:35
¶
So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

God would be a hypocrite to tell us to forgive 70x7 if He Himself did not do that to us.

I said
Oh don't think you are without sin now. You will always sin when you are in your body.

[1Jo 1:8-10
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

 

[iouae]

I said
Use your head. If it was all done on the cross. There would be no need for a judgment day. The cross was what sealed the new testament and made it valid. Jesus made the way we can be forgiven, by repenting of our sins. When they happen.

[Heb 9:16-17
16 For where there [is] a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament [is] in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives.

Judgment day is only something the goats/chaff have to fear.

True believers live with love, joy, peace, long-suffering, goodness... etc. not guilt, fear, doubt.

Fearing judgment belongs in the Dark Ages, before Luther, where the Catholic Church promoted guilt, doubt, fear to sell indulgences.

Jhn 14:27
Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

One is afraid if one considers God to be a hard man, with his finger hovering above the big red "smite" button.
But we are supposed to see Him as loving and forgiving, full of grace and mercy.

 

[Squeaky]

Judgment day is only something the goats/chaff have to fear.

True believers live with love, joy, peace, long-suffering, goodness... etc. not guilt, fear, doubt.

Fearing judgment belongs in the Dark Ages, before Luther, where the Catholic Church promoted guilt, doubt, fear to sell indulgences.

Jhn 14:27
Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

One is afraid if one considers God to be a hard man, with his finger hovering above the big red "smite" button.
But we are supposed to see Him as loving and forgiving, full of grace and mercy.

I said
You have been walking in a delusion. If you don't fear God now you will when He passes judgment on you.

Rev 14:6-7
6 Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth-- to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people--
7 saying with a loud voice, "Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water."
(NKJ)

1 Pet 2:17
17 Honor all people. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the king.
(NKJ)

Acts 13:26
26 "Men and brethren, sons of the family of Abraham, and those among you who fear God, to you the word of this salvation has been sent.
(NKJ)

Rev 19:5
5 Then a voice came from the throne, saying, "Praise our God, all you His servants and those who fear Him, both small and great!"
(NKJ)

Luke 12:5
5 "But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear Him who, after He has killed, has power to cast into hell; yes, I say to you, fear Him!
(NKJ)

Luke 1:50
50 And His mercy is on those who fear Him from generation to generation.
(NKJ)

 

[iouae]

I said
You have been walking in a delusion. If you don't fear God now you will when He passes judgment on you.

Parable talents - only those with a bad attitude making them unproductive have to fear the Master's return, not those who have not confessed their daily sins.

Parable of virgins - only those with no oil have anything to fear, not those forgetting to repent of their daily sins.

Some taken, some left - no mention of unconfessed sins.

You are worrying about the wrong thing focussing on YOUR sins and YOURself.

Righteousness comes only from Christ imputing it to you. Your righteousness, even with confessed sins, is as filthy rags. Isa 64:6
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags;

There are two kinds of Christians - those who try to clean themselves up (say by confessing sins, doing something, keeping laws, avoiding unclean foods etc.).

Then there are those who in loving God and others, rely on God to impute righteousness to them, irrespective of what they are or have DONE to deserve it.

 

[Squeaky]

Parable talents - only those with a bad attitude making them unproductive have to fear the Master's return, not those who have not confessed their daily sins.

Parable of virgins - only those with no oil have anything to fear, not those forgetting to repent of their daily sins.

Some taken, some left - no mention of unconfessed sins.

You are worrying about the wrong thing focussing on YOUR sins and YOURself.

Righteousness comes only from Christ imputing it to you. Your righteousness, even with confessed sins, is as filthy rags. Isa 64:6
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags;

There are two kinds of Christians - those who try to clean themselves up (say by confessing sins, doing something, keeping laws, avoiding unclean foods etc.).

Then there are those who in loving God and others, rely on God to impute righteousness to them, irrespective of what they are or have DONE to deserve it.

I said
You sound like one of them full of faith without works. Your really going to be disappointed on judgment day.
Faith-Works-Love (By Themselves they are only principles) But together they are righteousness.

People are trying to make a conclusion out of pieces and parts. It cant be done. Faith alone won't get you to heaven. Works alone won't get you to heaven. Love alone won't get you to heaven. That is the only conclusion.

XXX If all you have to present to God is faith, YOU ARE NOTHING.
1 Cor 13:1-2

1 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
James 2:14
14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
James 2:17-18
17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18 But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
James 2:24
24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
Rom 16:26
26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith--
(NKJ)

XXX You are saved by grace through faith. But that is NOT SALVATION. Faith only works through love.

Eph 2:8
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
(NKJ)


Luke 6:32-33
32 "But if you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners love those who love them.
33 "And if you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is that to you? For even sinners do the same.
(NKJ)

xxx Some stand on faith and some stand on works and some stand on love. They are all principles, they have to be together. So many on here are argueing just one point or part of a whole. You need to understand. Faith without works or love is dead. Works without faith or love is vanity. Love without faith or works is useless. Love is NOT AN EMOTION. Love is an action.

So many are running on blind faith. They dont even know what faith is. In reality their useing trust as faith. Their different. Your faith should be in what is written, all of it. But faith alone will NOT get you to heaven. Works alone will NOT get you to heaven. Love alone will not get you to heaven. What you need is the true faith in the Word of God. If you have the true faith in the Word of God you would try your best to do the works that are in the Word. Now love is NOT a feeling but an action. And the only way to learn what Godly love is would be to do the works. That is how you learn what love is by trying to do the works. In the Word that you have put your faith in.


Rom 5:1-4
1 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ,
2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
3 And not only that, but we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance;
4 and perseverance, character; and character, hope.
Eph 2:18-20
18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.
19 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,
20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief corner stone,
Eph 3:12
12 in whom we have boldness and access with confidence through faith in Him.
(NKJ)

xxx Do you have real faith, or blind faith?? The true faith only works through love. True love is to suffer wrongfully. Your real faith only works when you are suffering wrongfully.

Gal 5:6
6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but faith working through love.
(NKJ)

1 Tim 1:5-6
5 Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith,
6 from which some, having strayed, have turned aside to idle talk,
(NKJ)

 

[iouae]

I said
You sound like one of them full of faith without works. Your really going to be disappointed on judgment day.

You got that wrong since I am of the school that faith without works is dead.

But some Christians never seem to achieve inner peace. They say things like being rich is a sin, or that one needs to repent daily. And because there is always something more to DO, they always feel deficient. And nothing fills their half-empty cup better than trying to make other Christians feel half-empty, or guilty, or shameful. I feel totally at peace resting in Christ's imputed righteousness.

Isa 48:22
There is no peace, saith the LORD, unto the wicked.
The righteous should have total inner peace. Christians should have total inner peace.
You should aspire to have total inner peace.

 

[Squeaky]

You got that wrong since I am of the school that faith without works is dead.

But some Christians never seem to achieve inner peace. They say things like being rich is a sin, or that one needs to repent daily. And because there is always something more to DO, they always feel deficient. And nothing fills their half-empty cup better than trying to make other Christians feel half-empty, or guilty, or shameful. I feel totally at peace resting in Christ's imputed righteousness.

Isa 48:22
There is no peace, saith the LORD, unto the wicked.
The righteous should have total inner peace. Christians should have total inner peace.
You should aspire to have total inner peace.

I said
lol And it is obvious you haven't found inner peace. I think I can tell you why. Or atleast the Holy Spirit can tell you through me. Every time you try to be justified by the old testament you are falling from grace.

John 10:8-9
8 "All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them.
9 "I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.
(NKJ)

II Jn 1:8-11
8 Look to yourselves, that we do not lose those things we worked for, but that we may receive a full reward.
9 Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine, do not receive him into your house nor greet him;
11 for he who greets him shares in his evil deeds.
(NKJ)

Gal 5:4
4 You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
(NKJ)

 

[iouae]

Squeaky, do you hold to the theory that only confessed sins are forgiven, and that unconfessed ones still are held against us?

 

[Lazy afternoon]

I said
Its obvious you don't know the Holy Spirit. If you knew the Holy Spirit your guardian angel would bring every sins to remembrance so the Holy Spirit could give you the repentance verses to get you forgiven.

Such a parent would be seen as a tyrant with their children, giving them no latitude at all, seeing as they all come from imperfect Adam.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

I don't need to get forgiven, I live forgiven, past tense. And guilt and shame died back then too.

Guilt and shame are not healthy Christian emotions.

They are if one lives in unrepentant sin--

Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
Mat 5:29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
Mat 5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

LA

 

[iouae]

They are if one lives in unrepentant sin--

LA

Do you take repentance to mean change and stop sinning, or to feel sorry for sinning?

Do we daily ask God to forgive us for the same sin we commit every day, or do we daily find what we are doing wrong and not do it tomorrow?

And you use lusting after a woman as if that is the one thing that daily gets done, and everyone should feel sorry for. If God made women attractive, its not a sin to notice this. Stop feeling guilty!

To me repentance is not about feeling guilt and shame (an utterly worthless emotion) but feeling sorry that one has disappointed God, and resolving never to do so again. That takes about one second of not even shame, but more resolve, to accomplish.

 

[meshak]

Do you take repentance to mean change and stop sinning, or to feel sorry for sinning?

Do we daily ask God to forgive us for the same sin we commit every day, or do we daily find what we are doing wrong and not do it tomorrow?

And you use lusting after a woman as if that is the one thing that daily gets done, and everyone should feel sorry for. If God made women attractive, its not a sin to notice this. Stop feeling guilty!

To me repentance is not about feeling guilt and shame (an utterly worthless emotion) but feeling sorry that one has disappointed God, and resolving never to do so again. That takes about one second of not even shame, but more resolve, to accomplish.

Do you pray Lord's prayer daily?

 

[iouae]

Do you pray Lord's prayer daily?

Did you read my post?

 

[meshak]

Did you read my post?

which one?

I am not reading all your posts.

 

[Squeaky]

Squeaky, do you hold to the theory that only confessed sins are forgiven, and that unconfessed ones still are held against us?

I said
You will have to be more specific. There are three types of sin. Ones you must repent of ones that are covered by love, and the unforgiveable sin. And the ones you must repent of -you must repent of.
Three Types Of Sin

The ones you dont have to repent of.

1 Pet 4:8
8 And above all things have fervent love for one another, for "love will cover a multitude of sins."
(NKJ)

The ones you must repent of.

2 Pet 3:9
9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
(NKJ)

And the unforgiveable sin. That it doesnt do any good to repent of.
Matt 12:31-32
31 "Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men.
32 "Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come.
(NKJ)

 

[Squeaky]

Such a parent would be seen as a tyrant with their children, giving them no latitude at all, seeing as they all come from imperfect Adam.

LA

I said
How in the world could that be?? God is a loving God. He even gave us the right to be forgiven 7 times 70 times a day. Don't forget we are sinners, and we all fall short of obedience.

 

[Squeaky]

Do you take repentance to mean change and stop sinning, or to feel sorry for sinning?

Do we daily ask God to forgive us for the same sin we commit every day, or do we daily find what we are doing wrong and not do it tomorrow?

And you use lusting after a woman as if that is the one thing that daily gets done, and everyone should feel sorry for. If God made women attractive, its not a sin to notice this. Stop feeling guilty!

To me repentance is not about feeling guilt and shame (an utterly worthless emotion) but feeling sorry that one has disappointed God, and resolving never to do so again. That takes about one second of not even shame, but more resolve, to accomplish.

I said
You keep telling us what you think, and what you feel. How about you finding out what God thinks through His Word. You don't even have q grip on what repentance is.


2 Cor 7:8-12
8 For even if I made you sorry with my letter, I do not regret it; though I did regret it. For I perceive that the same epistle made you sorry, though only for a while.
9 Now I rejoice, not that you were made sorry, but that your sorrow led to repentance. For you were made sorry in a godly manner, that you might suffer loss from us in nothing.
10 For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death.
11 For observe this very thing, that you sorrowed in a godly manner: What diligence it produced in you, what clearing of yourselves, what indignation, what fear, what vehement desire, what zeal, what vindication! In all things you proved yourselves to be clear in this matter.
12 Therefore, although I wrote to you, I did not do it for the sake of him who had done the wrong, nor for the sake of him who suffered wrong, but that our care for you in the sight of God might appear to you.
(NKJ)