ECT Differentiating being born-again from the Holy Spirit baptism

themuzicman

Well-known member
"Baptism in the Holy Spirit" likely refers to three events, which correlate to the three places Jesus told the Apostles to go: Israel, Samaria, and everywhere else.

And these are the three events detailed: Jerusalem, Samaria, and Cornelius. These are indicators to the apostles that they have followed Christ's commands, and that the Holy Spirit will be poured out on Jews, Samaritans, and Gentiles alike, that none are to be treated differently.

The "Baptism in the Holy Spirit" is complete. It does not come upon every Christian, nor is this event available to anyone, anymore. Yes, we receive the Holy Spirit as the seal of our salvation. But the events "Baptism in the Holy Spirit" are three in number, detailed in Scripture, and are never identified for anyone else to receive.
 

oatmeal

Well-known member
This information is critical for helping believers understand what will be happening in the last days.
It is not what the churches teach for various reasons (explanation available).

Most believers say a person has been born-again when the Holy Spirit has come INSIDE
John 14:16-23, Rom 8:11, 1 Cor 3:16, Gal 4:6, 2 Tim 1:14, 1 John 3:24, 1 John 4:12-16
This “baptism” is done by the Holy Spirit, and this verse is the ONLY
place in the NT where this “baptism” into the church is mentioned:
“For BY one Spirit we were all baptized into one body (the church)
… and have all been made to drink into one Spirit.” (1 Corinthians 12:13)


Jesus was the first to receive another baptism … where the Holy Spirit comes UPON
“When He had been (water) baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water;
and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending
like a dove and alighting UPON Him.” (Matthew 3:16, Mark 1:10, Luke 3:22, John 1:32)


John the Baptist recalled that God told him, “UPON whom you see the Spirit descending,
and remaining ON Him, this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit.’ ” (John 1:33)

Yes, Jesus anoints some believers with this special baptism of spiritual power (which is
necessary for a ministry of some kind): Matthew 3:11, Mark 1:8, Luke 3:16, John 1:33.

Peter spoke of the results of Jesus’ baptism
“God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power” (Acts 10:38).
Father God confirms the Truth of Jesus’ gospel with spiritual power (signs and wonders).

Jesus promised this “baptism with the Holy Spirit” to the first believers
Luke 24:49 • “Behold, I send the Promise of My Father UPON you;
but tarry in the city of Jerusalem until you are endued with power from on high.”

The translators assumed Jesus meant that “the Promise” (capital “P”) is the Holy Spirit,
but really Jesus was referring to this special baptism (see the small “p” in Acts 2:33 and 2:38).
Acts 1:4-8 • “He commanded them … to wait for the Promise of the Father …
‘you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now …
you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come UPON you’ ”


On the Day of Pentecost
Acts 2:3-4 • “Then there appeared to them divided tongues, as of fire,
and one sat UPON each of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit
and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave utterance.”

A few words (at least) spoken in tongues is the evidence of receiving this special baptism.

Peter explained what had just happened
Acts 2:33 • “Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from
the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear.”

Notice the small “p” (here and below) refers to the baptism (and not the Holy Spirit).

Peter explains how people can have the same experience
Acts 2:38 • “Repent, and let every one of you be (water) baptized in the name of Jesus
Christ for the remission of sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off …”

There is no mention at all in Acts up to this point about water baptism.
Both “the promise” and “the gift” refer to this “baptism with the Holy Spirit”, re: the Day of Pentecost.
Peter, at this point, had NO understanding of the Holy Spirit coming INSIDE of believers.
There is no mention at all anywhere in Acts to my knowledge about the indwelling Holy Spirit.

These Samarians had believed and had been water baptized
Acts 8:14-19 • “Now when the apostles who were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received
the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them, who, when they had come down, prayed for
them that they might receive the Holy Spirit. For as yet He had fallen UPON none of them.
They had only been (water) baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Then they laid hands on them,
and they received the Holy Spirit. And when Simon saw that through the laying on of the apostles’
hands the Holy Spirit was given, he offered them money, saying, “Give me this power also …”

Do you know anyone who showed spiritual power when they received the Holy Spirit and were born again?

Peter is involved in the first experience of Gentiles receiving the gift of the baptism with the Holy Spirit
Acts 10:44-48 • “the Holy Spirit fell UPON all those who heard the word. And the Jews who believed
were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured
out ON the Gentiles also. For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter
answered, ‘Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy
Spirit just as we have?’ And he commanded them to be (water) baptized in the name of the Lord.”

These believers were infilled with the Holy Spirit at the same time as they were Spirit-baptized.
And to follow along after this experience, here we have the first mention of water baptism.

Peter recalls his experience with the Gentiles (above)
Acts 11:15 • “… the Holy Spirit fell UPON them, as UPON us at the beginning.
Then I remembered the word of the Lord, how He said, ‘John indeed baptized with water,
but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ ”


Paul helps some disciples at Ephesus receive the baptism with the Holy Spirit
Acts 19:5-6 • “… they were (water) baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
And when Paul had laid hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came UPON them,
and they spoke with tongues and prophesied …”


In the 7 passages where it is specifically mentioned that the Holy Spirit
came UPON believers, these other items are also mentioned:
the promise, the gift, the baptism with the Holy Spirit, power, filled with
the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues, laying on of hands, prophecy.
Such things are not involved when believers receive the Holy Spirit and are born-again.

The one great source of learning this subject is the book "Receiving the holy spirit" by VP Wierwille.

He spent many years searching out this subject from scripture and from many people who had received the gift of holy spirit.

This book is a great place to start to learn how to manifest the gift of holy spirit.
 

ZacharyB

Active member
They could not be born again at that time because Jesus was still with them--
Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away:
for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
Yes, CR ... even though Jesus said "receive the Holy Spirit",
how could they have received the Spirit INSIDE (as true believers did later)?
For me, this is a mystery!
P.S. please don't retire until you know what's written in John.
 

ZacharyB

Active member
The one great source of learning this subject is the book "Receiving the holy spirit" by VP Wierwille.
He spent many years searching out this subject from scripture
and from many people who had received the gift of holy spirit.
This book is a great place to start to learn how to manifest the gift of holy spirit.
If VP did not have this baptism, he was at a great disadvantage
in trying to gain spiritual understanding about this.
With this baptism comes an anointing and increased spiritual revelation,
hence a deeper understanding of whatever Jesus desires one to have.

All one needs for the basics (from Scripture) is found in the OP.

BTW, we don't learn how to manifest "the gift"
(which Peter understood on that first day to be this baptism)
... God does the manifesting.
 

Lazy afternoon

LIFETIME MEMBER
LIFETIME MEMBER
Yes, CR ... even though Jesus said "receive the Holy Spirit",
how could they have received the Spirit INSIDE (as true believers did later)?
For me, this is a mystery!
P.S. please don't retire until you know what's written in John.

They were not born again at that time. They chose the apostle to replace Judas according to the law after that, but before Pentecost when they entered the new covenat.

LA
 

Cross Reference

New member
They were not born again at that time. They chose the apostle to replace Judas according to the law after that, but before Pentecost when they entered the new covenat.

LA

They were born again at that time. They were born again in John 20:22 and NOT Acts 2. Read it all again for the first time!

Here's the intro: "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you". John 14:17 (KJV)

Now reflect back on what Jesus said to [righteous] Nicodemus in John 3:3-5 KJV.
 

ZacharyB

Active member
Der seems to be a distinct lack of participation of the
ladies who were deceived by Satan and the churches
and who are now upstairs in the choir loft - behaving
themselves like they were instructed by Paul to do...
seems dey finally decided not to be teachin' the men.
Now, there is something to praise the Lord about as
we get deeper into these last days.

Watch what happens in 2016, which will be instrumental
in having the mobster Obamster stay in the White House!
 

Cross Reference

New member
Der seems to be a distinct lack of participation of the
ladies who were deceived by Satan and the churches
and who are now upstairs in the choir loft - behaving
themselves like they were instructed by Paul to do...
seems dey finally decided not to be teachin' the men.
Now, there is something to praise the Lord about as
we get deeper into these last days.

Watch what happens in 2016, which will be instrumental
in having the mobster Obamster stay in the White Hous
e!

That is what Hillary is all about.
 
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