Theology Club: Departure cannot possibly mean the removal of the church

Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

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intojoy said:
Your Israelology is deficient buddy!
The theme of Israel, the Remnant and day of Jehovah's wrath. The most common term for the tribulation in the OT is The Day of Jehovah. It is a technical and theological term not to be confused or ignored.
The wrath to come according to Paul's Israelology is the specific seven year Day of Jehovah's wrath. It is that wrath we are delivered out of.

Noah was removed before the judgement fell.
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Yeah you carry on with ol' Fruchtenbaum mate...he is not anointed, as dead as a dodo [I'm not saying he is unsaved]

The day of the Lord begins with Christ coming in the clouds and us being gathered, Israel will be gathered into their land...God will pour His fury out upon those who come up with Antichrist against Israel.

Tribulation is not God's wrath, it is not the day of the Lord.

"Through much tribulation must we enter the kingdom of God"
 
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Danoh

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Isaiah 54:

4. Fear not; for thou shalt not be ashamed: neither be thou confounded; for thou shalt not be put to shame: for thou shalt forget the shame of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more.
5. For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
6. For the LORD hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God.
7. For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.
8. In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer.
 
intojoy

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Totton Linnet said:
Yeah you carry on with ol' Fruchtenbaum mate...he is not anointed, as dead as a dodo [I'm not saying he is unsaved]



The day of the Lord begins with Christ coming in the clouds and us being gathered, Israel will be gathered into their land...God will pour His fury out upon those who come up with Antichrist against Israel.



Tribulation is not God's wrath, it is not the day of the Lord.



"Through much tribulation must we enter the kingdom of God"
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When does this happen?

“Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain; let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of Jehovah cometh, for it is nigh at hand; a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness, as the dawn spread upon the mountains; a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after them, even to the years of many generations.”
**Joel‬ *2:1-2‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/jol.2.1-2.asv
 
intojoy

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And when does this happen?

“The great day of Jehovah is near, it is near and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of Jehovah; the mighty man crieth there bitterly. That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness,”
**Zephaniah‬ *1:14-15‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/zep.1.14-15.asv
 
intojoy

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“"As I live," declares the Lord G OD, "surely with a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm and with wrath poured out, I shall be king over you. I will bring you out from the peoples and gather you from the lands where you are scattered, with a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm and with wrath poured out; and I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there I will enter into judgment with you face to face. As I entered into judgment with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so I will enter into judgment with you," declares the Lord G OD. "I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant; and I will purge from you the rebels and those who transgress against Me; I will bring them out of the land where they sojourn, but they will not enter the land of Israel. Thus you will know that I am the LORD. "As for you, O house of Israel," thus says the Lord G OD, "Go, serve everyone his idols; but later you will surely listen to Me, and My holy name you will profane no longer with your gifts and with your idols. For on My holy mountain, on the high mountain of Israel," declares the Lord G OD, "there the whole house of Israel, all of them, will serve Me in the land; there I will accept them and there I will seek your contributions and the choicest of your gifts, with all your holy things. As a soothing aroma I will accept you when I bring you out from the peoples and gather you from the lands where you are scattered; and I will prove Myself holy among you in the sight of the nations.”
**Ezekiel‬ *20:33-41‬ *NASB‬‬
http://bible.com/100/ezk.20.33-41.nasb
 
Totton Linnet

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Danoh said:
Isaiah 54:

4. Fear not; for thou shalt not be ashamed: neither be thou confounded; for thou shalt not be put to shame: for thou shalt forget the shame of thy youth, and shalt not remember the reproach of thy widowhood any more.
5. For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.
6. For the LORD hath called thee as a woman forsaken and grieved in spirit, and a wife of youth, when thou wast refused, saith thy God.
7. For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.
8. In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer.
Click to expand...

Yes alleluia
 
Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

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intojoy said:
When does this happen?

“Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain; let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of Jehovah cometh, for it is nigh at hand; a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness, as the dawn spread upon the mountains; a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after them, even to the years of many generations.”
**Joel‬ *2:1-2‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/jol.2.1-2.asv
Click to expand...

Zion is Jerusalem, Antichrist will break his pact with Israel and invade the temple. The nations will come up with him.
 
Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

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intojoy said:
And when does this happen?

“The great day of Jehovah is near, it is near and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of Jehovah; the mighty man crieth there bitterly. That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness,”
**Zephaniah‬ *1:14-15‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/zep.1.14-15.asv
Click to expand...

There in all the prophets, in the early part of their prophecy you will read Israel's fall, their disgrace and punishment...in the later chapters you will read Israel's restoration and blessing. Arnie mixes them all up together and with a sprinkling of Revelations shoves them all into the meat grinder to make a glorious prophecy burger.
 
Totton Linnet

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intojoy said:
And when does this happen?

“Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.”
**Jeremiah‬ *30:7‬ *ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/jer.30.7.asv
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But he shall be saved out of it, but he shall be saved out of it.

You say he won't

He shall lie down in peace and NONE shall make him afraid. Jacob's trouble IS the great tribulation.
 
Totton Linnet

Totton Linnet

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intojoy said:
“"As I live," declares the Lord G OD, "surely with a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm and with wrath poured out, I shall be king over you. I will bring you out from the peoples and gather you from the lands where you are scattered, with a mighty hand and with an outstretched arm and with wrath poured out; and I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there I will enter into judgment with you face to face. As I entered into judgment with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so I will enter into judgment with you," declares the Lord G OD. "I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant; and I will purge from you the rebels and those who transgress against Me; I will bring them out of the land where they sojourn, but they will not enter the land of Israel. Thus you will know that I am the LORD. "As for you, O house of Israel," thus says the Lord G OD, "Go, serve everyone his idols; but later you will surely listen to Me, and My holy name you will profane no longer with your gifts and with your idols. For on My holy mountain, on the high mountain of Israel," declares the Lord G OD, "there the whole house of Israel, all of them, will serve Me in the land; there I will accept them and there I will seek your contributions and the choicest of your gifts, with all your holy things. As a soothing aroma I will accept you when I bring you out from the peoples and gather you from the lands where you are scattered; and I will prove Myself holy among you in the sight of the nations.”
**Ezekiel‬ *20:33-41‬ *NASB‬‬
http://bible.com/100/ezk.20.33-41.nasb
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"...But later you will surely listen to Me," marks the turn in the prophecy and relates to the end time re-gathering of Israel.
 
intojoy

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Totton Linnet said:
There in all the prophets, in the early part of their prophecy you will read Israel's fall, their disgrace and punishment...in the later chapters you will read Israel's restoration and blessing. Arnie mixes them all up together and with a sprinkling of Revelations shoves them all into the meat grinder to make a glorious prophecy burger.
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Lol
 
intojoy

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Totton Linnet said:
But he shall be saved out of it, but he shall be saved out of it.



You say he won't



He shall lie down in peace and NONE shall make him afraid. Jacob's trouble IS the great tribulation.
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Your theology requires that but that's not what it is saying
 
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