Creation vs. Evolution II

[everready]

Why specifically do you accept the Bible, but reject Islam? What makes one superior over the other?

The bible is Gods word, islam is a doctrine of devils born out of the mother of harlots. Before you reply look up "Fatima" Mohammed's daughter, and start there.


everready

 

[6days]

6days said “PhD Scientists”. .

Yes...I said in response to you..."Isn't it amazing that in spite of these prominent institutions being solidly against Biblical creation... that there are now thousands of PhD scientists who reject common ancestry beliefs"


About 55 years ago there were only 2 scientists I know of who challenged Christians who had compromised on God's Word, and the creation account. Now, there are thousands of PhD scientists around the world who declare science helps support the truth of scripture.


The number I used of "thousands of PhD scientists" is a very conservative, low estimate. *In America alone there are 2.5 million Americans have PhD.

https://www.reference.com/education/percentage-americans-phd-2508f1120884e2a3

20% of college graduates in the USA believe humans have existed in present form from the beginning of time.*

http://www.pewinternet.org/2015/07/01/chapter-4-evolution-and-perceptions-of-scientific-consensus/

Only 2% of AAAS scientists believe humans existed in present form from beginning, which even with that low number would give a couple thousand AAAS scientists in USA alone. *A number of years ago, "*Dr. Russell Humphreys, physicist at Sandia National Laboratories, New Mexico, estimates that there are around 10,000 practicing professional scientists in the USA alone who openly believe in a six-day creation."*http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/v5i10f.htm


It's an exciting time as more Christians are entering the sciences being encouraged by the thousands of trail blazing scientists who reject common ancestry beliefs. Science helps confirm the truth of scripture, *and provides an additional avenue of worship.*

 

[6days]

I suspect 6 days is correct, there are thousands of scientists who "reject Darwinism/common ancestry".

Thanks

But how many are biologists who have actually spent time studying, oh lets use his terms "Darwinism/common ancestry"?

Well...it's enough that some evololutionists are concerned...It starts with a trickle. Jerry Coyne, well known evolutionist and science wtiter is concerned about 'the increasingly unmanageable problem of high-level academic defectors from evolutionary theory'
http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress...ther-new-anti-evolution-book-by-thomas-nagel/

 

[6days]

The bible is Gods word, islam is a doctrine of devils born out of the mother of harlots. Before you reply look up "Fatima" Mohammed's daughter, and start there.


everready

Yes.... but there are millions of Muslims who sincerely seek the true God. Many are very open to hear the Christian message... but we need present Jesus in a loving way. It's interesting that millions of Muslims have come to Christ in recent years from Muslim countries.

 

[gcthomas]

Thanks

Well...it's enough that some evololutionists are concerned...It starts with a trickle. Jerry Coyne, well known evolutionist and science wtiter is concerned about 'the increasingly unmanageable problem of high-level academic defectors from evolutionary theory'
http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress...ther-new-anti-evolution-book-by-thomas-nagel/

Just recently you claimed to dislike the argumentum ad populum, yet here you are invoking a small scale version of the same thing. You are two faced, 6days. And a trickle is, as you know, not a flood. And if you'd actually read the source, you'd know that the defection is not to creationism, but is simply a minority attempt to favour a different mechanism for the fact of evolution.

 

[Greg Jennings]

You are the one in the corner my friend. Otherwise you wouldn't be the one who always seems to get upset, resorting to strawmen...or some other fallacy type of argument. You don't seem to be here for entertainment, but rather to try and proseletyze.*

You could argue that I'm ever so pissed off at you, or you could not dodge my questions. That choice is purely yours

 

[MichaelCadry]

I'm sure that you actually believe that. Nothing you've ever posted has suggested that you know or care about reality

Dear Greg,

I'm talking about Everready's post. I surmise that he knows more than you do! You are just a nonbeliever, so he is further up the ladder, by far, than you are. I appreciate him posting on this site. And his statement sounds correct to me! I hope that you had a Happy Birthday??

May The Lord Teach You Certain Things!!

Michael

 

[redfern]

Greg asked 6days:

If the Bible is always true, explain how either A) a stick becomes a snake or B) a woman turns into a pile of salt. If you can't scientifically explain either if those away then the Bible is scientifically useless

6days response:

We have an omnipotent God.

6day’s doesn’t even hint at the science that would be involved in the stick to snake change, or the woman to salt change. 6day’s knows that both of these stories involve massive violations of very fundamental laws of science, so he carefully avoids any mention of science, and instead offers the only explanation he can – it was an act of supernatural magic.

Of course within just a post or two 6days unashamedly (and hypocritically) resumes his “science supports the Bible” mantra.

 

[MichaelCadry]

Dear 6days,

I was regularly there for you, but I didn't want to intrude on your disagreement. I was just waiting to jump in on things. I held my peace. You might also want to know that my dad was a Moslem for quite a long time, until he saw how loving his wife, my mother's, funeral was. Totally different than a Moslem funeral. He joined Christianity for about the last 22 years of his life, and I'm so thankful that he did.

I have Israeli and Lebanese blood in me, along with English, Irish, and Cherokee blood in me. I got most of it on my mother's side. My father's parents were from Lebanon. You must know how people meet and have sex and do not care what their beliefs are, but only how fun the sex will be. I could say more, but I digress.

Islam is errant in the fact that they don't believe in Jesus as a Personal Savior, nor that He is welcome to enter the heart of any that will ask Him. Islam doesn't believe that way, so they miss out on that point.

6days is right! There are many Moslem people who are goodhearted and God surely notices it. They will be okay. Jesus said, "No man cometh to the Father, but by Me." So you have to love Jesus and believe in Him and His Testimony/ Words. Then can you be allowed into heaven.

It is written, 'And there shall in no wise enter into it {Heaven} any thing that defiles, neither whatsoever works abomination, or makes a lie; but they which are written in the Lamb's book of Life.' {see Rev. 21:27KJV}. Also it is written, 'But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whore-mongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone {our Sun}; which is the second death.' {see Rev. 21:8KJV}. Hell is in the center realms of the Earth. It is very hot there, from lava and magma. It is the bottomless pit because, the Earth being round means it has a top and a center, but not a bottom {because everyone on Earth thinks they're on top of the Earth. So there are some people going to Hell and some going to the 'lake of fire.'

I could tell you so very much, but it would take a lot more posting! This is the difference between Islam and Christianity. Moslem people are wanting to know Jesus and Christianity because they see now what rampant fanatical and extremists Islam beliefs are and they see the splendor of life here and the U.S. and other countries, putting God first for helping us to have such a good life on Earth. I'm not saying every Muslim, but many Muslims see how the U.S. is different and successful because of their belief in Christ!! Good for them!!

Godspeed,

Michael

 

[gcthomas]

"*Dr. Russell Humphreys, physicist at Sandia National Laboratories, New Mexico, estimates that there are around 10,000 practicing professional scientists in the USA alone who openly believe in a six-day creation."[/i]*http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/v5i10f.htm

Humphreys wilfully lies about other people's research (eg, the magnetic field reversals of Coe et al, despite the author's protestations that Humphreys has misrepresented his work) to skew it to his YEC beliefs, so I wouldn't trust any of his religious claims if I were you.

(And he is no longer a "physicist at Sandia National Laboratories", but has spent a number of years as researcher for The Institute for Creation Research and Creation Ministries International and is a board member of the Creation Research Society. Did you forget that part? Oops)

 

[redfern]

Dear Michael,

Several times I have asked, recommended, and suggested that you effectively ignore my posts. But since that message just isn’t one you are willing to respect, then when you jump into my sandbox, I make no promises. So …

Dear redfern,

… your responses … are deft

Really? I kinda thought you might be a bit put out at what I said. Really glad that you thought what I said was “deft”, though that wasn’t my intention.

Dictionary --- “deft: demonstrating skill and cleverness”

… your responses … are simple

Now there I am guilty. I made them simple out of concern for the acumen of the person I was responding to.

… your responses … are rubbish!!

Then they are a pretty much at the level you YECs operate at.

… You can't change a sassy old lady into a pillar of salt because you aren't God or the Master Chemist

No, no, just like the dude that tapped a rock with his staff to get water to flow from it, I would be just fine with having the “changing people to salt power” just for a while. If I changed you to salt, then there was a Phoenix storm, all that would be left of your head is an unsightly bulge where your neck used to be.

… no, the rapture will not happen before the end of 2016!!

Wow, pretty emphatic there. Someone who really didn’t know when the rapture would be might have said, “Probably not, but no one knows for sure”. Since your statement was an unequivocal declarative, I take it you’ve been planning the rapture schedule with God again?

… I have a bit of time to give you.

Well thanks. I’ve got a lot to do next Friday, so how about giving me a half-hour? That will still leave you with 23.5 hours, and I will have a 24.5 hour day on Friday.

(ever thought about not getting in my sandbox?)

 

[Jonahdog]

Thanks

Well...it's enough that some evololutionists are concerned...It starts with a trickle. Jerry Coyne, well known evolutionist and science wtiter is concerned about 'the increasingly unmanageable problem of high-level academic defectors from evolutionary theory'
http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress...ther-new-anti-evolution-book-by-thomas-nagel/

6 days will never face the hard questions head on. Nor will any YEC. He and they are either ignorant of the science or lie for their religion.

 

[redfern]

The number I used of "thousands of PhD scientists" is a very conservative, low estimate. In America alone there are 2.5 million Americans have PhD.

https://www.reference.com/education/percentage-americans-phd-2508f1120884e2a3

20% of college graduates in the USA believe humans have existed in present form from the beginning of time.

http://www.pewinternet.org/2015/07/01/chapter-4-evolution-and-perceptions-of-scientific-consensus/

Only 2% of AAAS scientists believe humans existed in present form from beginning, which even with that low number would give a couple thousand AAAS scientists in USA alone.

I realize you can’t keep your hands off those goalposts, but you really ought to try it occasionally. You specified “common ancestry” in your original claim, not how long humans have been around. If you ever actually read it, you’ll find Darwin’s original book addressed the diversification of animal species (“common descent”), but said pretty much squat about how or when humans got here. It was over a decade later that he brought humans into consideration in a later volume. And indeed, a huge number of Christians break with Darwin at that point - common descent for animals, and Adam and his rib for the parents of humanity. Even your good OEC buddies Hugh Ross and company make that distinction. But hey, if you want to make the case that lots of people, even scientists, believe in Adam, fine, common descent and old earth are untouched thereby.

I notice that your original claim that “there are now thousands …” has predictably softened into a much more defensible “swag”.

It's an exciting time as more Christians are entering the sciences being encouraged by the thousands of trail blazing scientists who reject common ancestry beliefs.

Too bad this mass of dissenters from common descent are so impotent at making their case in the real world of science.

Science helps confirm the truth of scripture

The lady to salt story is part of scripture, and deals with core parts of science. Does science help confirm that story in scripture?

 

[6days]

Just recently you claimed to dislike the argumentum ad populum, yet here you are invoking a small scale version of the same thing. You are two faced, 6days. And a trickle is, as you know, not a flood. And if you'd actually read the source, you'd know that the defection is not to creationism, but is simply a minority attempt to favour a different mechanism for the fact of evolution.

I posted previously on this topic..."A funny line from Coyne is that the secular opposition to the ToE is coming from molecular biologists. He suggests they perhaps don't have a good enough education in evolution!
Perhaps these scientists have superior knowledge than Coyne does about life at the most elemental levels. Perhaps they understand the ToE is a house of cards about to tumble.
( watch for supernatural alternative explanations that exclude a Creator God. Aliens?)"

 

[6days]

6day’s doesn’t even hint at the science that would be involved in the stick to snake change, or the woman to salt change.

You are correct. However, I did 'hint' that there is evidence of an omnipotent super natural Creator.*

Of course within just a post or two 6days unashamedly (and hypocritically) resumes his “science supports the Bible” mantra.

Science always has...always will support the One who created science and scientists.*

Now...to get back to the 'thousands' of PhD scientists....And bit of ad populum but.... If interested I can show that there are physicists, astronomers, geologists and even some microbiologists (The discipline Coyne is concerned about) who agree...science helps confirm the truth of God's Word...and provides an additional avenue of worship.*

 

[Jonahdog]

If interested I can show that there are physicists, astronomers, geologists and even some microbiologists (The discipline Coyne is concerned about) who agree...science helps confirm the truth of God's Word...and provides an additional avenue of worship.*

Stick with the biologists, a list please.

 

[6days]

f you ever actually read it, you’ll find Darwin’s original book addressed the diversification of animal species (“common descent”), but said pretty much squat about how or when humans got here.

Agree.

It was over a decade later that he brought humans into consideration in a later volume. And indeed, a huge number of Christians break with Darwin at that point - common descent for animals, and Adam and his rib for the parents of humanity. Even your good OEC buddies Hugh Ross and company make that distinction. But hey, if you want to make the case that lots of people, even scientists, believe in Adam, fine, common descent and old earth are untouched thereby.

Hugh 'preaches' a compromised gospel. We can discuss how his views effect Christianity if you wish

I notice that your original claim that “there are now thousands …” has predictably softened into a much more defensible “swag”.

Are you saying that now you have looked at a few numbers, you can see its easy to defend the claim there are thousands of PhD scientists who are Biblical creationists? Or, that there are thousands who reject common ancestry beliefs?* Or... what were we actually discussing anyway??

 

[gcthomas]

I posted previously on this topic..."A funny line from Coyne is that the secular opposition to the ToE is coming from molecular biologists. He suggests they perhaps don't have a good enough education in evolution!
Perhaps these scientists have superior knowledge than Coyne does about life at the most elemental levels. Perhaps they understand the ToE is a house of cards about to tumble.
( watch for supernatural alternative explanations that exclude a Creator God. Aliens?)"

The opposition is not to the fact of evolution, but the balence of mechanisms that cause evolution. You are misquoting to further your preconceptions. Why can't you ever use a source honestly?

 

[6days]

The opposition is not to the fact of evolution, but the balence of mechanisms that cause evolution. You are misquoting to further your preconceptions. Why can't you ever use a source honestly?

Semantics? He is complaining about secular, non creationist opposition to the modern TOE. He says perhaps these scientists are just not educated good enough

 

[Jose Fly]

The number I used of "thousands of PhD scientists" is a very conservative, low estimate. *In America alone there are 2.5 million Americans have PhD.

https://www.reference.com/education/percentage-americans-phd-2508f1120884e2a3

The claim was specifically about "PhD scientists", not just anyone with a PhD in any subject.

20% of college graduates in the USA believe humans have existed in present form from the beginning of time.

Most college graduates are not PhD's, nor are they scientists.

Only 2% of AAAS scientists believe humans existed in present form from beginning, which even with that low number would give a couple thousand AAAS scientists in USA alone.

But again, the claim wasn't about "thousands of scientists", it was "thousands of PhD scientists". Not every AAAS member has a PhD (me for example).

*A number of years ago, "*Dr. Russell Humphreys, physicist at Sandia National Laboratories, New Mexico, estimates that there are around 10,000 practicing professional scientists in the USA alone who openly believe in a six-day creation."*http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/v5i10f.htm

First, that's merely a speculation from a creationist. Second, again the claim was about scientists who hold a PhD.

So no 6days, you've still not demonstrated that there are "thousands of PhD scientists who reject common ancestry".