Britain becoming totalitarian police state

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
Exactly. That's exactly right. So whenever we see a similar pattern, anywhere, with anybody, that same truth holds. It doesn't matter if it's Joltin Joe Biden or Obama or Newsome or Fauci or any PhD or MD or DD or JD or what have you.

Fact is that every discipline, every university department, every domain, has its experts, authorities, and it's just so simple to know when that pedigree contributes to the claim or when it's irrelevant. It has to do with whether or not all the doctors agree, is what it boils down to. If they all uniformly agree, then you can bank on it, but if the doctors themselves dispute and contradict each other, then the question remains open.

This matter is an open question. Not all lawyers or political philosophers or even self-identifying liberal thinkers agree on the restrictions that governments are imposing upon civilians. It would be helpful I suppose if at least all the medical doctors agreed on what to do, if mankind were imagined as a zoo, and the zookeepers just want to make sure all their property (animals /specimens) survive an outbreak, but we don't even have that.

But even if we did that wouldn't justify infringing or abridging our basic and universal rights. That's the idea from the source's source. That's the idea of all liberals who take rights seriously. If an authenticated doctor of jurisprudence who's ascended in the profession to anything like a supreme court is also a liberal who takes human rights seriously argues that human rights ought to be taken seriously, that doesn't prove that he or she is right.

The trouble with searching for certainty through an appeal to authority is that sometimes people just resist. For example slavery, in Antebellum America. All the experts in the world might have said that slavery was fundamentally illiberal, they all might have said that Blacks were just as much persons as whites, but DEMOCRACY said that the slave states were going to be slave states. They were never going to voluntarily outlaw slavery. That had to be imposed upon them, and not through the mere enacting of a law, it had to be killed out of them. They were killed until they surrendered unconditionally.

Is anybody talking about imposing upon people that they not lockdown? No, talk is of imposing upon them lockdown. Hopefully violence is not needed. I would suggest at this point that what's done is mask mandates that are not enforced, so that government makes its most grave plea for compliance, but doesn't revoke basic human universal rights like breathing and walking around and leaving your home whenever you feel like it.

Oh, seriously, your hyperbole is getting redundant now. If you have problems with breathing where it comes to wearing a mask then you'll qualify for being exempt from wearing them. Do you think you have the right to potentially spread a disease to others in the middle of a pandemic? What's "liberal" about that?
 

Arthur Brain

Well-known member
So the queen of disinformation and believer in all kinds of conspiracy theories says I'm a conspiracy theorist.... That's laughable. That the article I posted came from Brietbart makes it unbelievable is laughable as 90% of the article is the direct quote from Lord Sumption's statement. It's not taken out of context nor cut up to say something Sumption did not say. It's too bad the "brain of Britain" has now become an outcast because he tells the truth. That tells me lies are now more wanted than truth. I can't think of anything sadder than that.

Here's a few links for you.

https://www.gkg.legal/lord-sumptions...march-30-2020/
https://www.aier.org/article/lord-su...n-our-history/
https://www.legalcheek.com/2020/05/w...s-human-rights

That none of you can see that the "cure" is far worse than the disease is a very sad thing. It says to me that your thinking is so narrow you're incapable of thinking big picture.

You are a conspiracy theorist and lap up anything that aligns with your confirmation bias. Sure, Sumption says all this stuff but do you in any way have any objective critique of it? No. It says what you want to hear and that's all there is to it. Never mind the plethora of opinion that goes against it. So, you believe that Britain is becoming a totalitarian police state as you will. Those of us who actually live here know better...
 

eider

Well-known member
Care to address the specific concerns raised by Lord Sumption?

You just don't get it......... either that or you just cherry-pick your choice of opinions from individuals, pump 'em up and then splatter them around.

Take any collection of Judges, experts, professors etc and ask for their opinions. You'll get a varied collection of viewpoints.

Now take the one that suits you best and cling to it for dear life.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
You just don't get it......... either that or you just cherry-pick your choice of opinions from individuals, pump 'em up and then splatter them around.

Take any collection of Judges, experts, professors etc and ask for their opinions. You'll get a varied collection of viewpoints.

Now take the one that suits you best and cling to it for dear life.

Wow

What a lazy response :(
 

Gary K

New member
Banned
Here is evidence of the totalitarian state in the UK. When a family with medical training is not allowed to care for their own because the state asserts total rights over the individual that is totalitarian government. Of course all the leftists will claim this is how things ought to be. That the government has the right to separate families and control every aspect of their relationship within the family. That will tell everyone that they highly approve of a totalitarian government even though they deny it.

BTW, that is far more intrusive than anything the British government did during WWII. Not allow a family to care for their own? It's despicable.

Humberside Police arrested a 73-year-old retired nurse who was trying to take her 97-year-old mother out of a care home after being unable to see her for nine months because of coronavirus.

Leandra Ashton, a former Coronation Street actress, filmed her mother Ylenia Angeli sitting in the back of a police car, handcuffed, in footage that went viral on social media.

Filming her grandmother, who has dementia, sitting in the front of her mother’s car, Ms Ashton said that she was being taken back “by force” to the care home in Market Weighton, Yorkshire, England.

“My mother has been arrested. My mother is in the back of the car here. She is a nurse. She is a fully qualified nurse who is wishing to care for her own mother. And here we have an incredible use of police time to take my 97-year-old grandmother back into a care home where she is deteriorating, where we haven’t been able to see her for nine months.”

She then addresses her grandmother, her voice breaking, and says: “Nan, I love you, and we’re going to fight for you.”
BORIS' BRITAIN: Police arrest nurse wanting to care for 97 year old mother at home. Cops force Nan back to care home against her will.

Is this the type of country we want to live in? Zero humanity. Zero empathy. Zero common sense. We are not North Korea. pic.twitter.com/B2Xf9kJj8g

— The Brexit Party (@brexitparty_uk) November 5, 2020



Ashton, 41, told The Sun on Thursday how she and her mother had “sprung” her gran from the home, and that while they were wheeling her out of the facility, they could see administrators calling the police.

“The lady opened the door at which point my mother used the flowers to barge her way in. She was just saying, ‘Don’t get in the way of me and my mother, let me get to my mother’.

“She just hugged her. Which was just heartbreaking. Then she turned around to see me outside, the care home were calling the police.”

“…She just carried on wheeling her out, very quietly, very calmly, nobody stopped us and we just wheeled her,” she said.

Police stopped Ms Ashton and Mrs Angeli, who were in separate cars, at a nearby garden centre. Because Mrs Angeli refused to return her mother, police arrested her. The mother was then dearrested, and the 97-year-old returned to the home.

Ms Ashton later explained on social media that while the family has power of attorney for the senior’s finances, they do not have authority over her “wellbeing”.
This video of 104-year-old Ms Fowler is absolutely heartbreaking.

Locked-down in her care home, Ms Fowler begs for help to see her family again.

We're locking up the elderly and the vulernable with no agency. Where is their say in any of this?!@danwootton and I discuss: pic.twitter.com/6oB2M0Mgg1

— Calvin Robinson (@calvinrobinson) October 22, 2020



Police confirmed the incident, with Assistant Chief Constable Chris Noble saying that they had initially received a report of an alleged “assault”. Noble continued: “The care home had also reported that a woman who they were legally responsible for had been taken from the home by her daughter.

“Officers found both women along with a third woman nearby and informed them that they would need to return the lady to the home, as is their legal duty to do so.”

Ashton described it as a “Kafka-esque nightmare” and detailed how her family have been trying to raise a safeguarding concern report over her grandmother’s deterioration during lockdown, “but this was inexplicably dropped and ‘disappeared'”.

“When your voice feels lost in a labyrinth of bureaucracy, when you are informed by the police that you are not on your relative’s relevant paperwork(!!), when the system is so clearly failing, we have to stand up and reform it,” she said.

England went into a second lockdown on Thursday, with older Britons set to bear the brunt of continued restrictions that prevent visits from relatives. One 104-year-old in a Scottish care home pleaded last month to be allowed to visit her family, regardless of the pandemic.

“This is my right. Please help. It’s cutting me to bits,” Mary Fowler said. “I must see my kids. Time’s getting on for me. I must see my children and make things like they used to be. Please help me, help me. Please, please help.”

An 83-year-old Yorkshire grandmother, while being interview on the street by the BBC, bluntly said of the government’s lockdown policy: “I don’t give a sod. I look at it this way: I’ve not got all that many years left of me, and I’m not going to be fastened in a house when the government have got it all wrong.”
“I’ve not got that many years left of me and I’m not going to be fastened in a house.”

Here’s how one 83-year-old in Barnsley reacted to the news that tier three restrictions will be introduced in South Yorkshire from Saturday.

See more here: https://t.co/Kmf1y5Msfe pic.twitter.com/58YJYfIzvU

— BBC Yorkshire (@BBCLookNorth) October 21, 2020

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/20...d-trying-remove-97-year-old-mother-care-home/

Here are a bunch of links confirming this.

https://inews.co.uk/news/health/for...rained-mother-care-home-leandra-ashton-750340
https://www.carehomeprofessional.co...her-mother-from-care-home-following-lockdown/
https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/police-a...er-97-year-old-mother-from-care-home-for-loc/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ation-arrest-attempting-mother-care-home.html
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...take-her-mother-97-from-care-home/ar-BB1aHaWm
 
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