ARCHIVE: God's mass-murder in the flood
- Thread starter smothers
- Start date
Of course not. :doh:
You said, "Absolute power corrupts absolutely?"
You did not say, "Absolute power corrupts Knight absolutely."
God is just an obvious counterexample to the cliche you posted. (Obvious to you I hope, though clearly not so obvious to smothers or Zakath.)
You said, "Absolute power corrupts absolutely?"
You did not say, "Absolute power corrupts Knight absolutely."
God is just an obvious counterexample to the cliche you posted. (Obvious to you I hope, though clearly not so obvious to smothers or Zakath.)
I leave for the night and find others taking up my fight! Way to go people, I'm proud of you!.
My point origionally germinated from reading an article about abortion protesters then immidiately after that seeing an article about Noah's flood. I could not help but make the connection between God killing practically all living beings in a world-wide flood and abortionists killing a lot less in a sterile environment.
God DOES have the power to stop the abortions but doesn't, and did kill sentient beings in a world-wide flood. If an alien had the same attributes as God and killed billions of living creatures and passively stood by while doctors killed babies, everyone would agree that alien is evil. I can only deduce that God is evil as well for actively and passively contributing to evil acts.
In regards to a poster calling me a retard: He claims that Jesus did the same thing. My answer is simply: Jesus was wrong in doing that as well. Ad hominem (sp?) attacks is a clear indication of being desperate. It is a childish reaction when confronted with loosing an argument.
In regards to getting the Cain and Abel story wrong: The point stands, God was wrong for disallowing the parents from killing the person who murdered his brother. A just being, (as opposed to the capricious self-centered being that God presents himself as) would demand the death penalty.
I can only deduce that those who worship this being are either evil or willfully disregarding the evil commited by their diety. I feel sorry for you.
My point origionally germinated from reading an article about abortion protesters then immidiately after that seeing an article about Noah's flood. I could not help but make the connection between God killing practically all living beings in a world-wide flood and abortionists killing a lot less in a sterile environment.
God DOES have the power to stop the abortions but doesn't, and did kill sentient beings in a world-wide flood. If an alien had the same attributes as God and killed billions of living creatures and passively stood by while doctors killed babies, everyone would agree that alien is evil. I can only deduce that God is evil as well for actively and passively contributing to evil acts.
In regards to a poster calling me a retard: He claims that Jesus did the same thing. My answer is simply: Jesus was wrong in doing that as well. Ad hominem (sp?) attacks is a clear indication of being desperate. It is a childish reaction when confronted with loosing an argument.
In regards to getting the Cain and Abel story wrong: The point stands, God was wrong for disallowing the parents from killing the person who murdered his brother. A just being, (as opposed to the capricious self-centered being that God presents himself as) would demand the death penalty.
I can only deduce that those who worship this being are either evil or willfully disregarding the evil commited by their diety. I feel sorry for you.
LightSon
New member
I notice that you do not question God's existence, but rather charge Him with being evil and wrong.
The words I use to describe such conclusions are ignorant(at best), reckless, arrogant and wicked.
One who would judge God, is acting as God, and presupposing to replace God. Satan tried this once and we know what it will get him. You sound just like your father, the Evil One.
I did not question God's reality as it really is a side-issue. God, (whom I don't have sufficient evidence to accept as real) is a Christian place-holder. The god-concept that you worship is clearly evil.
Again, calling me the son of satan is childish name-calling. Ad hominem attacks are a weak attack on a person NOT the argument. You attacked my conclusions as wicked, yet did not refute my argument that a supreme being who think killed every living thing on the planet must be evil.
Again, calling me the son of satan is childish name-calling. Ad hominem attacks are a weak attack on a person NOT the argument. You attacked my conclusions as wicked, yet did not refute my argument that a supreme being who think killed every living thing on the planet must be evil.
Zakath
Resident Atheist
smothers,
He has a point. Christian theology generally holds that all humans (some say all creation) is basically the chattel property of YHWH. This view also provided historical justification for human slavery as well as genocide.
You're in a losing fight here. These folks actually desire slavery. For them it's far preferable to live as slaves than to live any other way.
He has a point. Christian theology generally holds that all humans (some say all creation) is basically the chattel property of YHWH. This view also provided historical justification for human slavery as well as genocide.
You're in a losing fight here. These folks actually desire slavery. For them it's far preferable to live as slaves than to live any other way.
The creation argument does not hold. If God created and destroyed non-living beings I would agree with you. it is his stuff he can do with it what he wants. What God did was create living beings and then destroy them. That is patently immoral.
We have the technology to parse frog and human DNA together to create a new form of life. If we created this being then killed him that would be evil. If God does the same thing such as with the flood, you rationalize that God can do what he wants with his creation.
I created my children, God only supplied the "technology" to do it. I made a consious choice to create, therefore I am the creator. The child did not arive at the hospital via a stork, it grew in my wife's body. If you are saying that since God created the mechanism for life, he is the creator of all life, than you must also make God responsible for death. He created the environment for ebola viri, the plaque and AIDS, therefore, according to this line of reasoning he created these terrible things.
We have the technology to parse frog and human DNA together to create a new form of life. If we created this being then killed him that would be evil. If God does the same thing such as with the flood, you rationalize that God can do what he wants with his creation.
I created my children, God only supplied the "technology" to do it. I made a consious choice to create, therefore I am the creator. The child did not arive at the hospital via a stork, it grew in my wife's body. If you are saying that since God created the mechanism for life, he is the creator of all life, than you must also make God responsible for death. He created the environment for ebola viri, the plaque and AIDS, therefore, according to this line of reasoning he created these terrible things.
According to the Christian, God is the creator of ALL things. If God is the creator of ALL things, He is also the creator of evil.
Evil would not have been available for the Devil if God didn’t create it for him to take. If God is all-knowing, a seer of the future, God should have already known that “evildoing” was going to cause gratuitous pain and suffering throughout human history. Many innocent God worshiping Christian fundamentalists have died because of “evil”. If there is a God, He is neither perfect nor pure.
If God is the creator of ALL things, He is also the creator of evil.
Evil would not have been available for the Devil if God didn’t create it for him to take. If God is all-knowing, a seer of the future, God should have already known that “evildoing” was going to cause gratuitous pain and suffering throughout human history. Many innocent God worshiping Christian fundamentalists have died because of “evil”. If there is a God, He is neither perfect nor pure.
If God is the creator of ALL things, He is also the creator of evil.
Zakath
Resident Atheist
For all of our KJV-only folks, how about:
The American Standard Version, Young's Literal, and Darby all translate it as "evil", as well.
Other, more modern, translations play with the word translated as "evil" by the KJV team and render it as:
"disaster" - NIV
"calamity" - NASB, NKJV
Zakath
Resident Atheist
According to some believers, YHWH allegedly created the universe in which such things exist. Even though the Bible does not say that.
Darkness and coldness are essentially relative low energy states. Darkness is the lack of photonic energy while coldness is the lack of infrared energy.
Others examples of God's evilness
Others examples of God's evilness
God gets angry with all of the people on Earth, and kills every living thing on Earth, with a few notable exceptions (Genesis 6 & 7).
God heeded the prayers of the Jews and helped the Jews to "utterly destroy" the Canaanites. Later, God told the Jews that they would leave "no survivors" (including women and children) from among the whole people when they battled the followers of King Og of Bashan. In between those two, the Jews battled the followers of King Sihon of Heshbon, who "God had given him a resistant spirit and stubborn determination" so that he would not surrender his people, and for "even the women and children; there was not a single survivor." (Numbers, Chapter 21; and Deuteronomy, Chapters 2 and 3.)
When the Jews fought the Midianites, the Jewish army killed all of the men, but brought back all of the women and children to Moses, who was then furious at this disobedience of God. Moses ordered all of the male children killed, and all of the females who were not virgins. 32,000 virgin females remained alive; all of the other Midianite people were killed. It is unclear from the text whether or not 32 of these virgins were sacrificed to God (human sacrifice). The Jews enslaved all of the virgin females who lived. (Numbers, Chapters 25 and 31.)
God instructed the Jews that when they invaded the territory that God had granted to them, as for the inhabitants, "you must utterly annihilate them. Make no covenant with them nor show them compassion!" (Deuteronomy, Chapter 7.) God instructed the Jews that, when confronting other people who lived on land other than that granted to the Jews, they could give them an offer of perpetual slavery for their whole population, or else they could kill all the males and take the women and little children as slaves. (Deuteronomy, Chapter 20.) God set rules for male Jews who desired to take a wife from among these captives. (Deuteronomy, Chapter 21.)
When invading Jericho, as instructed by God, the Jews "annihilated with the sword everything that breathed in the city, including men and women, young and old, as well cattle, sheep, and donkeys." (Joshua, Chapter 6.)
When taking Ai, as instructed by God, the Jews "annihilated all who lived in Ai," including all of the men, women, and children. (Joshua, Chapter 8.)
Acting on God’s instructions, the Jews "annihilated everyone who lived in" Makkedah. At Libnah, they again "left no survivors." At Lachish, "they put the sword to all who lived there, just as they had done to Libnah." At Eglon, "they annihilated it just as they had done to Lachish." At Hebron, "they annihilated it and all who lived there." Again at Debir, "they annihilated everyone who lived there; they left no survivors." "Joshua defeated the whole land, including the hill country, the Negev, the lowlands, the slopes, and all their kings. He left no survivors. He annihilated everything that breathed, just as the Lord God of Israel had commanded." (Joshua, Chapter 10.)
At Hazor, "They annihilated everyone who lived there with the sword—no one who breathed remained." "The Israelites plundered all the loot of these cities and the cattle, but they totally destroyed all the people and allowed no one who breathed to live." "Moses the Lord's servant passed on the Lord's commands to Joshua, and Joshua did as he was told. He did not ignore any of the commands the Lord had given Moses." "No city made peace with the Israelites (except the Hivites living in Gibeon); they had to conquer all of them," "for the Lord determined to make them obstinate so they would attack Israel. He wanted Israel to annihilate them without mercy, as he had instructed Moses." (Joshua, Chapter 11.)
King Saul of Israel, acting on God’s orders, "captured King Agag of the Amalekites alive, but he executed all his people with the sword." (Later, God got angry for this "disobedience" of leaving the king alive and for other matters.) (I Samuel, Chapter 15.)
Others examples of God's evilness
God gets angry with all of the people on Earth, and kills every living thing on Earth, with a few notable exceptions (Genesis 6 & 7).
God heeded the prayers of the Jews and helped the Jews to "utterly destroy" the Canaanites. Later, God told the Jews that they would leave "no survivors" (including women and children) from among the whole people when they battled the followers of King Og of Bashan. In between those two, the Jews battled the followers of King Sihon of Heshbon, who "God had given him a resistant spirit and stubborn determination" so that he would not surrender his people, and for "even the women and children; there was not a single survivor." (Numbers, Chapter 21; and Deuteronomy, Chapters 2 and 3.)
When the Jews fought the Midianites, the Jewish army killed all of the men, but brought back all of the women and children to Moses, who was then furious at this disobedience of God. Moses ordered all of the male children killed, and all of the females who were not virgins. 32,000 virgin females remained alive; all of the other Midianite people were killed. It is unclear from the text whether or not 32 of these virgins were sacrificed to God (human sacrifice). The Jews enslaved all of the virgin females who lived. (Numbers, Chapters 25 and 31.)
God instructed the Jews that when they invaded the territory that God had granted to them, as for the inhabitants, "you must utterly annihilate them. Make no covenant with them nor show them compassion!" (Deuteronomy, Chapter 7.) God instructed the Jews that, when confronting other people who lived on land other than that granted to the Jews, they could give them an offer of perpetual slavery for their whole population, or else they could kill all the males and take the women and little children as slaves. (Deuteronomy, Chapter 20.) God set rules for male Jews who desired to take a wife from among these captives. (Deuteronomy, Chapter 21.)
When invading Jericho, as instructed by God, the Jews "annihilated with the sword everything that breathed in the city, including men and women, young and old, as well cattle, sheep, and donkeys." (Joshua, Chapter 6.)
When taking Ai, as instructed by God, the Jews "annihilated all who lived in Ai," including all of the men, women, and children. (Joshua, Chapter 8.)
Acting on God’s instructions, the Jews "annihilated everyone who lived in" Makkedah. At Libnah, they again "left no survivors." At Lachish, "they put the sword to all who lived there, just as they had done to Libnah." At Eglon, "they annihilated it just as they had done to Lachish." At Hebron, "they annihilated it and all who lived there." Again at Debir, "they annihilated everyone who lived there; they left no survivors." "Joshua defeated the whole land, including the hill country, the Negev, the lowlands, the slopes, and all their kings. He left no survivors. He annihilated everything that breathed, just as the Lord God of Israel had commanded." (Joshua, Chapter 10.)
At Hazor, "They annihilated everyone who lived there with the sword—no one who breathed remained." "The Israelites plundered all the loot of these cities and the cattle, but they totally destroyed all the people and allowed no one who breathed to live." "Moses the Lord's servant passed on the Lord's commands to Joshua, and Joshua did as he was told. He did not ignore any of the commands the Lord had given Moses." "No city made peace with the Israelites (except the Hivites living in Gibeon); they had to conquer all of them," "for the Lord determined to make them obstinate so they would attack Israel. He wanted Israel to annihilate them without mercy, as he had instructed Moses." (Joshua, Chapter 11.)
King Saul of Israel, acting on God’s orders, "captured King Agag of the Amalekites alive, but he executed all his people with the sword." (Later, God got angry for this "disobedience" of leaving the king alive and for other matters.) (I Samuel, Chapter 15.)
God's view of women -- property
God's view of women -- property
But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves (Num. 31: 18).
"If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father fifty skelels of silver, and she shall be his wife, and he may not put her away all of his days (Deut:22; 28-29)." (Rape is okay as long as you pay and marry the woman.)
In the case of the rape of a betrothed virgin in a city, the Bible says that both the rapist and victim should be stoned to death: the rapist because he violated his neighbor's wife and the victim because she did not cry for help (Deut. 22: 23-25).
God isn't evil?
God's view of women -- property
But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves (Num. 31: 18).
"If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father fifty skelels of silver, and she shall be his wife, and he may not put her away all of his days (Deut:22; 28-29)." (Rape is okay as long as you pay and marry the woman.)
In the case of the rape of a betrothed virgin in a city, the Bible says that both the rapist and victim should be stoned to death: the rapist because he violated his neighbor's wife and the victim because she did not cry for help (Deut. 22: 23-25).
God isn't evil?