Annihilationism is taught in the bible

Jacob

Jacob

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CherubRam said:
Matthew 11:23
And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades. For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day.

Matthew 16:18
And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

Luke 10:15
And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades.

Luke 16:23
In Hades, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.

Revelation 1:18
I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

Revelation 6:8
I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

Revelation 20:13
The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done.

Revelation 20:14
Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.

Where do you find the word Hades in the Old Testament, you don't.
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Shalom.

I do not. It is a Greek word.

Shalom.

Jacob
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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[FONT=&quot]Hell Luke 16:19.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

I give thanks to you Heavenly Father for hearing my complaint.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]

The Rich Man and Lazarus
Luke 16:19. "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Wealth, comfort, poverty, and suffering have nothing to do with a person’s salvation.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]The word messenger is replaced with the word angel. And assuming that this is a parable, there would be no need for Lazarus to be carried to Abraham, before the resurrection. As for being in Hell and torment and agony; that contradicts the verse that says the dead know nothing. It also is a contradiction where scripture says that Yahwah kills the condemned. In regards to the water on the finger; that would evaporate before it even got to a person. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]

25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Again I say to you that wealth and poverty has nothing to do with the resurrection of the righteous. There is one truth in all of this, and that there is a chasm that has been set in place; and that is called death of the condemned, which are killed by Yahwah. There is no life for them afterward. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]

27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]These are obviously the words of a dim wit, and not the words of an ancient being. No place in these verses is credit given to Yahwah, but only to Moses and the prophets; which would be unlike Yahshua to exclude the Father in matters of life and death.

Hell is a pagan belief and part of the Pagan religion. Why would Yahshua use a nonexistent biblical teaching for which he never explains afterward? Before the return from Babylon, Judaism never taught the concept of hell. But after the return from Babylon, the Hellenistic and Kabbalistic Jews began to introduce Hell into Judaism.

Yahshua never identified the story as a parable, and never explained the relevance as he did in other legitimate parables.
Yahshua, being an ancient being full of knowledge and wisdom, would have had the good sense to explain the new concept. Obviously the story of “The Rich Man and Lazarus” is the words of some man introducing the Pagan concept of Hell.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

Genesis 18:25
Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?"

Luke 20:16
"What then will the owner of the vineyard do to them? He will come and kill those tenants and give the vineyard to others." When the people heard this, they said, "May this never be!"

Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.

Revelation 20:14
Then death and Hades (Grave) were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]If death and the grave, or even Hades is done away with, then how can there be anyone ALIVE in Hades.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]


Revelation 21
1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. 4 He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away."
5 He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making everything new!" Then he said, "Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true."
6 He said to me: "It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To him who is thirsty I will give to drink without cost from the spring of the water of life. 7 He who overcomes will inherit all this, and I will be his God and he will be my son. 8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This (That) is the second death."


[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Catholic Gnosticism. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.” [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Pope Gregory [/FONT][FONT=&quot]540 – 12 March 604. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Just a reminder that it was the Catholic Church that canonized scripture.[/FONT]
 
patrick jane

patrick jane

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Jacob said:
Shalom.

I know nothing, little, or next to nothing about the Papacy. I am against Roman Catholicism. I am against Catholicism and Catholics. I am a Jew. I am not a Catholic. I believe that I should have no dealings with the Pope.

Shalom.

Jacob
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The Pope would have no dealings with you
 
Jacob

Jacob

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CherubRam said:
Hell Luke 16:19.

I give thanks to you Heavenly Father for hearing my complaint.


The Rich Man and Lazarus
Luke 16:19. "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.

Wealth, comfort, poverty, and suffering have nothing to do with a person’s salvation.

22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'

The word messenger is replaced with the word angel. And assuming that this is a parable, there would be no need for Lazarus to be carried to Abraham, before the resurrection. As for being in Hell and torment and agony; that contradicts the verse that says the dead know nothing. It also is a contradiction where scripture says that Yahwah kills the condemned. In regards to the water on the finger; that would evaporate before it even got to a person.

25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

Again I say to you that wealth and poverty has nothing to do with the resurrection of the righteous. There is one truth in all of this, and that there is a chasm that has been set in place; and that is called death of the condemned, which are killed by Yahwah. There is no life for them afterward.

27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

These are obviously the words of a dim wit, and not the words of an ancient being. No place in these verses is credit given to Yahwah, but only to Moses and the prophets; which would be unlike Yahshua to exclude the Father in matters of life and death.

Hell is a pagan belief and part of the Pagan religion. Why would Yahshua use a nonexistent biblical teaching for which he never explains afterward? Before the return from Babylon, Judaism never taught the concept of hell. But after the return from Babylon, the Hellenistic and Kabbalistic Jews began to introduce Hell into Judaism.

Yahshua never identified the story as a parable, and never explained the relevance as he did in other legitimate parables.
Yahshua, being an ancient being full of knowledge and wisdom, would have had the good sense to explain the new concept. Obviously the story of “The Rich Man and Lazarus” is the words of some man introducing the Pagan concept of Hell.

Genesis 18:25
Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?"

Luke 20:16
"What then will the owner of the vineyard do to them? He will come and kill those tenants and give the vineyard to others." When the people heard this, they said, "May this never be!"

Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even the memory of them is forgotten.

Revelation 20:14
Then death and Hades (Grave) were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
If death and the grave, or even Hades is done away with, then how can there be anyone ALIVE in Hades.


Revelation 21
1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. 4 He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away."
5 He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making everything new!" Then he said, "Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true."
6 He said to me: "It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To him who is thirsty I will give to drink without cost from the spring of the water of life. 7 He who overcomes will inherit all this, and I will be his God and he will be my son. 8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This (That) is the second death."


Catholic Gnosticism.
The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.”
Pope Gregory540 – 12 March 604.
Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well.

Just a reminder that it was the Catholic Church that canonized scripture.
Click to expand...

Shalom.

I understand that Hades and Abraham's Bosom are different. But there was a problem with me reading about something where I had them confused or thought I saw a or the distinction.

Shalom.

Jacob
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
Jacob said:
Shalom.

I understand that Hades and Abraham's Bosom are different. But there was a problem with me reading about something where I had them confused or thought I saw a or the distinction.

Shalom.

Jacob
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Not sure what you are trying to say.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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The correct understanding is that condemned face eternal death. That is the eternal punishment, that is the eternal judgment, that is the eternal fire.
 
Jacob

Jacob

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CherubRam said:
The correct understanding is that condemned face eternal death. That is the eternal punishment, that is the eternal judgment, that is the eternal fire.
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Shalom.

That is hardly death and then knowing nothing more.

Shalom.

Jacob
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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Jacob said:
Shalom.

Does your post speak of Abraham's Bosom in regard to Hades or not or does it not?

Shalom.

Jacob
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Luke 16 is most certainly a Pagan insertion. Certainly not the words of an ancient being. They are the words of a man trying to insert the Pagan belief of Hell into Christianity.
 
Jacob

Jacob

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CherubRam said:
Luke 16 is most certainly a Pagan insertion. Certainly not the words of an ancient being. They are the words of a man trying to insert the Pagan belief of Hell into Christianity.
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Shalom.

I am not a Christian. And I accept Matthew through Revelation.

Shalom.

Jacob
 
oatmeal

oatmeal

Well-known member
Yes indeed, those who rejected God will not live beyond the second death. That is their eternal punishment. But before they die, they will know that God is real and His goodness and what they rejected
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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Jeremiah 8:8
“‘How can you say, “We are wise, for we have the law of the Lord,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?

There is also other warnings, but I am not going to look for them now.
 
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