An open challenge to all closed theists

[Z Man]

Originally posted by Clete Pfeiffer

If Jonah was not lying then my question is valid whether it's a what if question or not.

What would you say to your kids to get them to behave in public? Have you ever threatened them before, without ever intending to do them harm? Was your intent to get a desired effect from them, such as good behavior?

Now there is a big difference in the way God handles matters with His creation and the way we do it with our own. God knew what would happen if He threatened Ninevah, thus He sent Jonah. IF, and I mean IF Ninevah had not repented, then of course they would of been destroyed in 40 days, thus Jonah nor God are liars. But destroying them was not God's intent; that's why Jonah was sent.

If God wasn't lying when He said that in 40 days Ninevah will be destroyed then it was His intention to do just that, or do you doubt God's word?

Of course I don't doubt God's Word. If Ninevah didn't repent, then they would of been destroyed in 40 days. But that obviously wasn't God's intent for them, since He sent Jonah.

If God wanted to destroy Ninevah, why did He send Jonah?

This is about as disengenous a line of thought as I've seen you make Z Man. God threatened Ninevah with thier lives and when they responded so did God. How hard is that to figure out? There is no mystery here. God said He would do something, the circumstances changed so God repented and "did not do it". Simple.

It is simple. I understand and agree.

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by God_Is_Truth

Originally posted by Lee

Originally posted by Godrulz
Did [the Ninevites] HAVE to repent? was their repentence ordained?

Yes. Jonah expected it, even:

JNH 4:2 He prayed to the Lord, "O Lord, is this not what I said when I was still at home?"

then they had no free will.

Exactly. The Ninevites' will was not to repent; that was God's will. In fact, no one on this planet has a will to repent. It is God who allows us to repent if He so desires, according to His will. In this case, it was His intention for the city of Ninevah to repent, thus the reason for Jonah being sent.

if it was just a threat with NO intent, then WHY did they repent? if God didn't intend to destroy them, then what were they worried about? the people of ninevah believed that God meant what he said.

He did mean what He said. But if He wanted to destroy them intentionally, He would of have never sent Jonah. I'm pretty sure that if the will of God was to destroy Ninevah, and they didn't repent, then we would of read a different story in which after 40 days, the city of Ninevah would of been wiped off the face of the map.

God is not a liar. Everything He says is true. Asking the question, "Why did they repent" is ludicris and nonsense. Why should we repent? Is God a liar about hell? Why don't we just tell sinners to never repent, so they can find out for real if God is lying about hell or not...

Nah, just kidding. Don't do that. Their blood would be on our hands!

they believed that he truly was going to destroy them and they prayed and repented in the hope that God would change his mind about them and relent of the wrath he had planned for them because of their wickedness.

Exactly what God desired from them. Isn't He smart?

God wanted the people to repent.

Exactly. It wasn't His intent to destoy Ninevah; it was His intent to have them repent. That's why Jonah was sent. Thanks for seeing it my way buddy! You and Clete have both just agreed with me and all the others who believe as I do.

:thumb:

by sending Jonah, he could get 2 possible responses from the people. they would either reject him as a liar and thus bring judgement upon themselves further or they would believe him and repent and God would spare them after seeing what they did.

so God's mindset was basically "i don't want these people to perish. i will send Jonah to preach to them judgement on their wickedness in the hope that they will believe him and repent and then i will not have to punish them".

LOL! God "hopes"? I don't think He's just sitting "up there", biting away at His nails, "hoping" that things go as planned...

That's certainly not what the Bible tells us about our mighty God...

 

[lee_merrill]

Hi everyone,

God is Truth: "if a man was hiding some jews in his house during WWII and a nazi came and knocked at his door asking if there were any jews in his house. the truth is that there are, but does anyone believe that telling the truth in that situation is the right thing to do?"

Corrie Ten Boom went to prison for hiding Jews, and lied sometimes as part of doing that. She tells a remarkable story in The Hiding Place, though, of her sister Nollie, whose theme was "never tell a lie for any reason." When the Nazis came to her house, and asked her point-blank about one of the Jewish people she had taken in, "Is she Jewish?", Nollie answered "yes." And Nollie went to prison herself for that, and told her family "God will not let any harm come to her, because I obeyed him."

And this Jewish woman was delivered from the Nazis, the place they were keeping her was raided, and she was freed. To say people sometimes need to lie to get the job done is, I think, to limit the power of God.

PS 46:6 Nations are in uproar, kingdoms fall; he lifts his voice, the earth melts.

Which is why God speaks in a whisper!

if it was just a threat with NO intent, then WHY did they repent? if God didn't intend to destroy them, then what were they worried about? the people of ninevah believed that God meant what he said.

I agree with Z Man here, God surely did mean what he said, when you include the condition. "No repentance means destruction," that is what they thought he meant, and they were correct.

they believed that he truly was going to destroy them and they prayed and repented in the hope that God would change his mind about them and relent of the wrath he had planned for them because of their wickedness.

No, they hoped there was a condition, that God's plan included a condition. And there was one.

Clete: If God wasn't lying when He said that in 40 days Ninevah will be destroyed then it was His intention to do just that, or do you doubt God's word?

Z Man: Of course I don't doubt God's Word. If Ninevah didn't repent, then they would of been destroyed in 40 days. But that obviously wasn't God's intent for them, since He sent Jonah.

Exactly! God's threat included a condition, which the Ninevites hoped was there, and Jonah thought was there, too. If you want to be really really literal, God said he would "overthrow" Ninevah, so the destruction was implied, and "what God said" here means "what God implied". Which I think is correct.

Z Man: If God wanted to destroy Ninevah, why did He send Jonah?

We are starting to reach some agreement that God intended for the Ninevites to repent! "Wanted" (and notice that God acted, too!) I think implies some intent. I think God did want the Ninevites to repent, and the steps he took were to bring that about:

JNH 4:11 "Should I not be concerned about that great city?"

Blessings,
Lee

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by lee_merrill

We are starting to reach some agreement that God intended for the Ninevites to repent! "Wanted" (and notice that God acted, too!) I think implies some intent. I think God did want the Ninevites to repent, and the steps he took were to bring that about:

JNH 4:11 "Should I not be concerned about that great city?"

Blessings,
Lee

Amen!

:thumb:

 

[Clete]

Originally posted by God_Is_Truth
"just like if a man was hiding some jews in his house during WWII and a nazi came and knocked at his door asking if there were any jews in his house. the truth is that there are, but does anyone believe that telling the truth in that situation is the right thing to do?"

is lying wrong if it protects people?

No it is not.

The law was made for man, not man for the law. You do not sacrifice innocent lives in order to follow the rules.

There are Biblical examples of people lying and God blessing them for having done so. Like the midwives lying to Pharaoh and saving Moses for example.

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[smaller]

Newsflash!

OV'er C. Pfeiffer acknowledges that God both CONDONES LIES and REWARDS LIARS.

How will his compatriots respond?

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by Clete Pfeiffer

No it is not.

The law was made for man, not man for the law. You do not sacrifice innocent lives in order to follow the rules.

There are Biblical examples of people lying in the Bible and God blessing them for having done so. Like the midwives lying to Pharaoh and saving Moses for example.

Resting in Him,
Clete

:darwinsm:

That's a good one Clete! You're not serious are you? I hope not!

You do not sacrifice innocent lives in order to follow the rules.

Really? So human lives are more important than truth? In that case, why didn't Shadrak, Meshak, and Abendigo lie to save their lives from certain doom in the furnace? Did not God bless them for telling the truth by saving their life anyways? And what about Daniel? Should he have lied to save his neck from going into the lion's den?

Haha! You crack me up Clete.... :chuckle:

 

[Clete]

I'm as serious as I can be. I do not worship rules, I worship the living God who created all mankind and then put the rules in place for them, not the other way around.

Shadrak and company would have had to do bow down and worship someone other than the true and living God in order to save their lives. That was a really poor example to bring up.

There is, as I said, plenty of Biblical precident for righteous lying. I've already mentioned the midwives who lied to Pharaoh but I'll post the text of that example and a few others in order to prove my point...

Exodus 1:18 So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, "Why have you done this thing, and saved the male children alive?"
19 And the midwives said to Pharaoh, "Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women; for they are lively and give birth before the midwives come to them."

What did God think of this little lie? Well, read the next verse...

Exodus 1:20 Therefore God dealt well with the midwives, and the people multiplied and grew very mighty. 21 And so it was, because the midwives feared God, that He provided households for them.

Then there's the stroy of Rahab, remember Rahab? Let's read...

Jos 2:3 So the king of Jericho sent to Rahab, saying, "Bring out the men who have come to you, who have entered your house, for they have come to search out all the country."
4 Then the woman took the two men and hid them. So she said, "Yes, the men came to me, but I did not know where they were from. 5 And it happened as the gate was being shut, when it was dark, that the men went out. Where the men went I do not know; pursue them quickly, for you may overtake them." 6 (But she had brought them up to the roof and hidden them with the stalks of flax, which she had laid in order on the roof.)

Because of this, God placed her in the hall of faith...

Heb 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab did not perish with those who did not believe, when she had received the spies with peace.

Jam 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent [them] out another way?

Want another? Okay, ever hear about a guy named Micaiah? He had a pretty neat story to tell! Let's read it, shall we...

I Kings 22:19 Then Micaiah said, "Therefore hear the word of the Lord: I saw the Lord sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing by, on His right hand and on His left. 20 And the Lord said, 'Who will persuade Ahab to go up, that he may fall at Ramoth Gilead?' So one spoke in this manner, and another spoke in that manner. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The Lord said to him, 'In what way?' So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.' 23 Therefore look! The Lord has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these prophets of yours, and the Lord has declared disaster against you."

Convinced yet?

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[smaller]

Very good Clete.

Perhaps you are starting to see that GOD IS IN FACT GREATER than a lie and ABLE TO BOTH USE AND OVERCOME all LIES by His Great Power.

Apart from this understanding LIES become the DEFEAT of God.

 

[lee_merrill]

Exodus 1:18 So the king of Egypt called for the midwives and said to them, "Why have you done this thing, and saved the male children alive?"
19 And the midwives said to Pharaoh, "Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women; for they are lively and give birth before the midwives come to them."

What did God think of this little lie? Well, read the next verse...

Exodus 1:20 Therefore God dealt well with the midwives, and the people multiplied and grew very mighty. 21 And so it was, because the midwives feared God, that He provided households for them.

"Because they feared God", God blessed them. Not because they lied. If God waited until we were perfect before he blessed us, then we would all be in trouble.

"Where the men went I do not know; pursue them quickly, for you may overtake them." 6 (But she had brought them up to the roof and hidden them...)

Because of this, God placed her in the hall of faith...

Heb 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab did not perish with those who did not believe, when she had received the spies with peace.

Jam 2:25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent [them] out another way?

But the lying was, again, not commended. "Receiving them with peace," "sending them another way," was what she did right.

Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The Lord said to him, 'In what way?' So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.'

JN 13:27 As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him. "What you are about to do, do quickly," Jesus told him.

But Jesus most certainly did not approve of Judas' sin, though it was part of his plan. The lying spirit was part of God's plan, too, and even sent by him, but the sin was not therefore approved.

PR 12:17 A truthful witness gives honest testimony, but a false witness tells lies.

Lying is not approved by God...

PR 19:9 A false witness will not go unpunished, and he who tells lies will perish.

Blessings,
Lee

 

[Clete]

Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The Lord said to him, 'In what way?' So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.'

Don't be afraid of the text Lee. Its okay, "Thou shalt not bare false witness" wasn't rendered null and void because God manipulated His enemies.

 

[lee_merrill]

Hi Clete,

Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The Lord said to him, 'In what way?' So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.'

Don't be afraid of the text Lee. Its okay, "Thou shalt not bear false witness" wasn't rendered null and void because God manipulated His enemies.

God used it, but it doesn't imply that God approved it, though.

ISA 10:5-6 Woe to the Assyrian, the rod of my anger, in whose hand is the club of my wrath! I send him against a godless nation...

They were carrying out God's plan of judgment, sent by God, yet still guilty.

Blessings,
Lee

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by Clete Pfeiffer

Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, 'I will persuade him.' 22 The Lord said to him, 'In what way?' So he said, 'I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' And the Lord said, 'You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.'

Don't be afraid of the text Lee. Its okay, "Thou shalt not bare false witness" wasn't rendered null and void because God manipulated His enemies.

Clete,

Just because God sent out a "lying spirit" through His prophet doesn't mean God suddenly approves of lying.

Job 1:8-12
Then the Lord said to Satan, "Have you considered My servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, one who fears God and shuns evil?" So Satan answered the Lord and said, "Does Job fear God for nothing? Have You not made a hedge around him, around his household, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But now, stretch out Your hand and touch all that he has, and he will surely curse You to Your face!" And the Lord said to Satan, "Behold, all that he has is in your power; only do not lay a hand on his person." So Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.

Do you think that the Lord approves of Satan too?

 

[Clete]

I didn't say that it was suddenly okay to just start telling lies right and left. The principle in Scripture is that the law was made for man not man for the law.
For example, during the dispensation of the law, if one was starving, it was not sinful to do whatever it took to prepare a meal for yourself on the Sabbath day. (Matt. 12:1-5)
And the Bible is replete with examples of God deceiving His enemies and encouraging His prophets to do the same.
I agree that God hates lying lips and I do not encourage people to lie because it is generally a sinful thing to do, but if you are asked, "Are there any Jews in your apartment?" by the Nazi's and you say, "Yes, they're under that table right over there." Then their blood is on your hands just as much as it is on Hitler's.

If a man broke into your home intent on raping the youngest girl he could find and he asked you where your daughters are, what do you say?
Do you say, "Oh, well let me introduce you to Tara, my oldest and Abbi my 10 month old. Here they are right here in the bedroom."

Wouldn't that be a sick and twisted thing to do?

I'll tell you what I would do; I would not hesitate to put my knife through the man's temple! If that were not an option however, I certainly would try to convince him that my kids were at Grandma’s house, or at a friend's for a sleep over or something. Then the moment his back is turned, I would kill him swiftly.
And by the way, I would do the same for your kids, or for anyone else's for that matter.

This is a really easy thing to figure out you guys. The problem that many Christians have with this is that they make the mistake of thinking that all sins are the same. They are not the same. Murder and any number of other crimes are all far worse than telling a lie and so if one must lie in order to save a man from being murdered or the like then by all means lie. I'll say it again; if you have an opportunity to deceive a criminal and avert a murder and you intentionally ignore that opportunity then you are an accomplice to murder and deserve to be executed yourself.

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[God_Is_Truth]

here is my biggest problem with the calvinist position.

God CANNOT lie.

Hebrews 6:18
God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope offered to us may be greatly encouraged.

thus, whatever God says is true.

Psalm 119:160
All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal.

so, when God says ""Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned." then it's true. it has to be true becaues God has spoke it. this is proven by both the hebrews verse and the pslams verse. ALL of God's words ARE true. and God CANNOT lie.

but here comes the problem. if God knows absolutely, positively, and beyond a shadow of a doubt that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed but says that it will, then it's a lie. he is stating something to be true that he knows will absolutely, in no way, come to pass. if God knows that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed because the people will repent, then his statement is false, and God is a liar.

if any calvinist can explain to me either how God didn't lie or how God is able to lie (even though hebrews says it's impossible) and why it would be ok in this situation, i would be much more open to accepting the calvinist's understanding of Jonah than i am right now.

but you must do either of those things. you either have to show:

1) that somehow when God said "forty more days and ninevah will be overturned" while knowing full well that in 40 days it will not happen is not a lie

or

2) you have to show that even though it is a lie, it's something God is capable to do (and you must provide an adequate explanation then for what the hebrews verse means) and that God is allowed to do this even though lying is generally a bad thing.

stated in another way:


when God says "40 days and ninevah will be overturned" but knows full well that it will not happen, is he lying?

a. --yes-- then what does the hebrews verse mean when it says it's impossible for God to lie? also please explain how all God's words can be true if he lies (per the Pslam verse)?


b. --no--please explain why it is not a lie when you say something as true that you know beyond a shadow of a doubt is not, and will not be true. if i know that the sun rose today at 5:20 but deliberately tell you that it rose at 5:45, i am telling you something that i absolutely know is not and cannot be true. why am i not lying?

some other minor issues i have if God is able to lie include

John 14
6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

how can Jesus be THE truth if he can lie? and what would happen to my username? how can God be truth if he can lie?! :shocked:

looking forward to your responses :thumb:

thanks in advance.

God_Is_Truth

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by God_Is_Truth

here is my biggest problem with the calvinist position.

God CANNOT lie.

I don't believe He does.

Hebrews 6:18
God did this so that, by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to take hold of the hope offered to us may be greatly encouraged.

thus, whatever God says is true.

Psalm 119:160
All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal.

so, when God says ""Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned." then it's true. it has to be true becaues God has spoke it. this is proven by both the hebrews verse and the pslams verse. ALL of God's words ARE true. and God CANNOT lie.

Agreed.

but here comes the problem. if God knows absolutely, positively, and beyond a shadow of a doubt that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed but says that it will, then it's a lie. he is stating something to be true that he knows will absolutely, in no way, come to pass. if God knows that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed because the people will repent, then his statement is false, and God is a liar.

Wait a minute there! Just because the city was not destroyed doesn't mean that God is a liar! They repented, remember? And why did they repent? Because God threatened them. Sure, IF they hadn't of repented, then in 40 days, just like God said, they would've been wiped off the face of the planet. But they repented, which was of the will of God the whole time.

I assure you, He never lies. When He said "in 40 days the city would be destroyed", He meant it. Of course, that threat led to their repentance, which is what God was after the whole time. Because they repented, God's threat was no longer needed, thus it was relented.

 

[LightSon]

Originally posted by God_Is_Truth
...
so, when God says ""Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned." then it's true. it has to be true becaues God has spoke it. this is proven by both the hebrews verse and the pslams verse. ALL of God's words ARE true. and God CANNOT lie.

but here comes the problem. if God knows absolutely, positively, and beyond a shadow of a doubt that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed but says that it will, then it's a lie. he is stating something to be true that he knows will absolutely, in no way, come to pass. if God knows that in 40 days ninevah will not be destroyed because the people will repent, then his statement is false, and God is a liar.
...

God_Is_Truth,
I've been watching OVers try to turn this Nineveh account to their advantage, but I don't think it works.

Consider your own point

so, when God says ""Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned." then it's true. it has to be true becaues God has spoke it.

If that is is true, then it must be true whether your position is open or closed. Why are Calvinists on some sort of hook and you are not?

In your view, God doesn't know what will happen. You want to hold Calvinists to a wooden interpretation and make God (in their model) a liar. But the same is true for you, is it not? If the same wooden interpretation holds, then God is a liar in the Open view also, BECAUSE, Nineveh was NOT overthrown as God said it would be.

:doh:

You don't get to hold Calvinists to a different standard of interpretation than yourself.

You seem to be arguing that (in your view) just because God didn't know Nineveh would repent, then God is free to not follow through with this wooden "Nineveh will be overturned" clause. I don't see that at all. To be consistent, you should argue that Nineveh repented, and God should have overturned them anyway, else He is a liar. (I speak as a fool).

The only resolution that I can see (for both sides) is that there is an implicit exception clause, that being, "Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned, (unless you repent)".

Please correct me if I have missed something. And please don't anybody accuse me of adding to God's word. This is an interpretive matter, and the tacit clause must be true for both the Open and Closed views, or God is a liar. And we both know that isn't the case. If you prefer, let God be true and I'll be a liar.

 

[Z Man]

Originally posted by LightSon

In your view, God doesn't know what will happen. You want to hold Calvinists to a wooden interpretation and make God (in their model) a liar. But the same is true for you, is it not? If the same wooden interpretation holds, then God is a liar in the Open view also, BECAUSE, Nineveh was NOT overthrown as God said it would be.

:doh:

You don't get to hold Calvinists to a different standard of interpretation than yourself.

You seem to be arguing that (in your view) just because God didn't know Nineveh would repent, then God is free to not follow through with this wooden "Nineveh will be overturned" clause. I don't see that at all. To be consistent, you should argue that Nineveh repented, and God should have overturned them anyway, else He is a liar. (I speak as a fool).

I honestly do not think anybody has said it any better than you just did. That last sentence was what I was trying to emphasize: God never changed His mind in this whole ordeal. Had Ninevah not repented, and God relented from destroying them, then yes, He is a liar or just a God who changes His mind from time to time. But that wasn't the case since Ninevah repented, which is what God was after the whole time.

Good job! :thumb:

 

[lee_merrill]

I agree that God hates lying lips and I do not encourage people to lie because it is generally a sinful thing to do, but if you are asked, "Are there any Jews in your apartment?" by the Nazi's and you say, "Yes, they're under that table right over there." Then their blood is on your hands just as much as it is on Hitler's.

I addressed this already! In post 263 in this thread, from The Hiding Place, where Nollie did not tell a lie, and her Jewish friend was still delivered out of the hands of the Nazis.

If a man broke into your home intent on raping the youngest girl he could find and he asked you where your daughters are, what do you say?

Not lying doesn't mean you have to give people information they want to do a sinful deed. But you don't have to tell a lie, either.

I heard of some Christian women in Indonesia who were being lined up to be raped. They started singing "Oh, the blood of Jesus". And they weren't raped. I think you are underestimating the power of God.

No lies, not even little ones, are excusable, not even for the best of reasons. We are not immune from trouble! Jesus went to the cross, and told us to carry one, too. But we never need to lie, to carry out God's plan.

REV 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving ... and all liars--their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.

Speaking of this subject!

God is Truth: when God says ""Forty more days and Nineveh will be overturned." then it's true. it has to be true becaues God has spoke it.

Lightson: If that is is true, then it must be true whether your position is open or closed. Why are Calvinists on some sort of hook and you are not?

That's good insight! Yes, everyone has to step up and say there was an implied condition. Jonah thought there was, the Ninevites hoped there was, and they were both correct. r.e. Jeremiah 18...

Blessings,
Lee

 

[lee_merrill]

Thought of a verse about implied conditions! Two verses, actually.

DT 9:25 So I fell down before the Lord the forty days and nights, which I did because the Lord had said He would destroy you.

Here God said "he would destroy them", and no condition is stated, then Moses prays and destruction is averted. This is a very similar situation to Jonah and the Ninevites.

But there was a condition! It is implied in Dt. 9:25, but in the actual account of this event, the condition is stated:

EX 32:10 Now leave me alone so that my anger may burn against them and that I may destroy them.

Here is the condition, "leave me alone," and Moses did not leave God alone, and thus fulfilled the condition to avert the destruction.

Blessings,
Lee