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  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Originally posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a pagan Gentile?

    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a Gentile that believed in the God of Israel?


    Anyone?

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by patrick jane View Post
    Another Home Run For Heir !!!
    You absolute fool...

    Kiss up to heir and STP all you want; they still view our faithful brother Justin Johnson and others under some supposed Romans 16:17 anathema.

    You just don't know what you are agreeing with in STP and heir.

    They actually hold they alone are faithful to the Mystery in this Acts 28 like two mystery understanding of theirs.

    Not O'Hair, not Baker, not Stam, not Jordan, not Enyart, not Justin, not anyone who holds to one Mystery; the Lord's Supper and what ever else that is held by the 28ers that these two have confused A9D doctrine with...

    All I can say to that is more of the same

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Phenice is in Syria, not Greece, and was then part of the Roman Empire.

    Jews referred to Gentiles as Greeks as a result of the Greek's prior Roman like empire over all.

    And way back before that; they referred to Gentiles as Cannanites.

    All as a derogatory just as the term "UNcircumcision" was also a derogatory by the Jew.

    Mark is relating that account to fellow Jews; which is why; and you'll appreciate this; why he is so blunt in his derogatory description of her.

    The sense is the woman was a Gentile; an unclean person.

    Jesus practically spit on her.

    She was no "blesser."

    What she was though; in spite of her "far off...without God; with out hope in the world" was a mom.

    Out of that she cornered Him; reminded Him of His parable about crumbs, and because she was actually dealing with a Member of the Godhead; He broke from His pattern; reached all the way over to the other side of Romans 11:25 and blessed her in line with Gentile blessing within Israel's coming Millennial Sabbath rest from a sickness.

    It is an astounding account - this man Jesus was no ordinary Priest, Prophet, or King of Israel; here was the very Lord of Israel's promised Sabbath or Millennial rest.

    He blessed her within a scope and context He alone had the authority to break with as He saw fit, as Deity.

    Astounding also, because He had not come to heal in that manner.

    But, people make something else out of it all, much like they do with what is actually a similar, anomalous moment also - Peter's experience in Acts 10.

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Originally posted by patrick jane View Post
    I bet saint john w can answer that
    Probably so, but being so extremely humble, he may defer to another.

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  • patrick jane
    replied
    Originally posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    For the general audience.
    I bet saint john w can answer that

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Originally posted by patrick jane View Post
    Whom are you asking oh mysterious one ?
    For the general audience.

    Leave a comment:


  • patrick jane
    replied
    Originally posted by SaulToPaul View Post
    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a pagan Gentile?

    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a Gentile that believed in the God of Israel?
    Whom are you asking oh mysterious one ?

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a pagan Gentile?

    Using the scriptures of the prophets, can you name one blessing that Paul could show to a Gentile that believed in the God of Israel?

    Leave a comment:


  • patrick jane
    replied
    Originally posted by heir View Post
    We even see a Greek during Christ's earthy ministry and what is she seeking? Answer: a blessing!


    Mark 7:25-27 KJV For a certain woman, whose young daughter had an unclean spirit, heard of him, and came and fell at his feet: 26 The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation; and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter. 27 But Jesus said unto her, Let the children first be filled: for it is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it unto the dogs.

    She recognized Him as Lord and understood her position

    Mark 7:28 KJV And she answered and said unto him, Yes, Lord: yet the dogs under the table eat of the children's crumbs.

    Mark 7:29 And he said unto her, For this saying go thy way; the devil is gone out of thy daughter.

    The Greeks that Paul encountered during his Acts provoking ministry were heirs according to the promise (Genesis 12:3 KJV, Acts 13:26 KJV, Galatians 3:29 KJV). Paul found in the synagogue of the Jews (Acts 17:1-2 KJV, Acts 18:4 KJV). Their blessing was still a mystery pre-Paul. Their blessing came in the form of the forgiveness of sins (Acts 13:38-39 KJV). IOW, it came by Paul's "my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ according to the revelation of the mystery that was kept secret since the world began,...a mystery hidden in the scriptures (Romans 16:25-27 KJV, 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV).


    We can try all day long, but we cannot say the same thing about the Ephesian Gentiles to whom Paul wrote the letter. The "YOU GENTILES" that Paul became a prisoner of Jesus Christ for (Ephesians 3:1 KJV) in time past were aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world. They are to whom Paul was later sent (Acts 22:21 KJV, Ephesians 1:13 KJV).

    Ephesians 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;Ephesians 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

    These Ephesians (much like the Colossians) were never under any ordinances. On the contrary:

    Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

    The law of commandments contained in ordinances was the wall of partition that was broken down between them (us). Together, we are the twain made one new man (Ephesians 2:15). It is the fellowship of the mystery (Ephesians 3:1-12 KJV). All aboard!

    Another Home Run For Heir !!!

    Leave a comment:


  • SaulToPaul
    replied
    Greeks seek after wisdom!

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    We even see a Greek during Christ's earthy ministry and what is she seeking? Answer: a blessing!


    Mark 7:25-27 KJV For a certain woman, whose young daughter had an unclean spirit, heard of him, and came and fell at his feet: 26 The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation; and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter. 27 But Jesus said unto her, Let the children first be filled: for it is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it unto the dogs.

    She recognized Him as Lord and understood her position

    Mark 7:28 KJV And she answered and said unto him, Yes, Lord: yet the dogs under the table eat of the children's crumbs.

    Mark 7:29 And he said unto her, For this saying go thy way; the devil is gone out of thy daughter.

    The Greeks that Paul encountered during his Acts provoking ministry were heirs according to the promise (Genesis 12:3 KJV, Acts 13:26 KJV, Galatians 3:29 KJV). Paul found in the synagogue of the Jews (Acts 17:1-2 KJV, Acts 18:4 KJV). Their blessing was still a mystery pre-Paul. Their blessing came in the form of the forgiveness of sins (Acts 13:38-39 KJV). IOW, it came by Paul's "my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ according to the revelation of the mystery that was kept secret since the world began,...a mystery hidden in the scriptures (Romans 16:25-27 KJV, 1 Corinthians 2:6-8 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV).


    We can try all day long, but we cannot say the same thing about the Ephesian Gentiles to whom Paul wrote the letter. The "YOU GENTILES" that Paul became a prisoner of Jesus Christ for (Ephesians 3:1 KJV) in time past were aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world. They are to whom Paul was later sent (Acts 22:21 KJV, Ephesians 1:13 KJV).

    Ephesians 2:11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;Ephesians 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

    These Ephesians (much like the Colossians) were never under any ordinances. On the contrary:

    Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

    The law of commandments contained in ordinances was the wall of partition that was broken down between them (us). Together, we are the twain made one new man (Ephesians 2:15). It is the fellowship of the mystery (Ephesians 3:1-12 KJV). All aboard (Ephesians 3:6 KJV, 1 Timothy 2:4-6 KJV)!

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    Do your history woman - at times Greeks refers to what Jews referred to any one not a Jew - the Gentiles - as a result of the previous rule: the Greek Empire.
    Do yours, "man". All Greeks were Gentiles, but not all Gentiles were Greeks. Greeks were blessers as per Genesis 12:3 KJV. Not all Gentiles that Paul was sent to were the same. There are clearly differences in Gentiles to whom Paul was first sent~ those to whom the Acts 15 ordinances pertained to and those to whom Paul was later sent that those ordinances did not pertain to.

    The Greeks were Gentiles allied/aligned with Israel as per Genesis 12:3 KJV

    Here they are. They are the "whosoever among you feareth God"

    Acts 13:26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

    Those Gentiles feared the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. They were in the commonwealth of Israel, they were in the covenants of promise (Galatians 3:29 KJV), they were in a position of being blessed as per Genesis 12:3 KJV. They had a hope.

    Genesis 12:1 Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will show thee: 2 And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: 3 And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Danoh
    replied
    Originally posted by heir View Post
    You can't make up your mind.

    There were Gentiles under these ordinances.

    20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

    Yet those were against us/ contrary to us.

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

    We were never under any ordinances, but earlier Gentiles called Greeks were! It's time you 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV!
    Do your history woman - at times Greeks refers to what Jews referred to any one not a Jew - the Gentiles - as a result of the previous rule: the Greek Empire.

    Just as Barbarians were what the Romans referred to anyone not a Roman.

    Being well versed in both worlds, Paul uses both terms, for example.

    And never mind what "to the Jew first" is actually a reference to; your mind is definitely made up about all these terms.

    It is a reference to the historical "you first" preference the Jew had once had BUT NOW no longer did.

    When Paul related to Israel what he related in Acts 13's "you first" said "you first" was already no longer the case.

    Their failure under the Law just prior to Paul there, in Acts 7 had concluded them under sin with the Gentiles - spiritual UNcircumcision...

    Acts 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers: 7:53 Who have received the law by the disposition of angels, and have not kept it.

    Romans 2:24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written. 2:25 For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.

    Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    Romans 3:18 There is no fear of God before their eyes. 3:19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

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  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post

    Lol, Paul began his indictment against unbelieving Israel in Romans 2:17 - which you have confused as proselytes out of your consistent failure to understand the sense of words like "called" when and where they are being used.

    It is a condemnation there against the hypocritical Jew.
    Paul was speaking to Gentiles

    Romans 1:13 Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.



    Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

    Leave a comment:


  • heir
    replied
    Originally posted by Danoh View Post
    Two separate issues. No arguement there.
    You can't make up your mind.

    There were Gentiles under these ordinances.

    20 But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

    ...

    Acts 15:28 For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things;

    Acts 15:29 That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication: from which if ye keep yourselves, ye shall do well. Fare ye well.

    Yet those were against us/ contrary to us.

    Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

    We were never under any ordinances, but earlier Gentiles called Greeks were! It's time you 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV!

    Leave a comment:

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