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  • #16
    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    In Acts 2 , how were Jews saved ? As all Jews had a Covenant relationship with God and were not Alienated from God.
    Not so. Rom 3:23 (NIV)


    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    Many believe in infant Baptism as the road to salvation !!
    and they would be wrong. Mark 16:16 (NIV)



    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    Many are counting on a Catechism and Confirmation , along with Wafers and Wine !!

    It can be and is conceded by most on TOL, that the RCC does NOT save.


    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    Many say that they spoken in Tongues , so they are saved , Like my mother did , but Admitted to me that speaking in tongues is of the Flesh !!

    The Bible definitely does NOT show that speaking in tongues bring salvation. In fact it clearly shows speaking in tongues FOLLOWS salvation, and requires the baptism/infilling of the Holy Spirit.


    [quote=DAN P;3400692]
    Many are counting on their , being Water Baptism , like those Acts 2 , believers and very Foolish !![/quote


    This comes POST salvation and is NOT required to be saved.



    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    So , what happens when people hear the Gospel of the Grace of God ??
    Rom 10:9 , reads , " That IF you should Confess with you mouth ( the ) Lord Jesus , and should believe in your HEART , that God raised Him from ( the ) dead , you will be saved !!
    How simple is that , as it is not Water , Wafers and Wine , or Tongues , but BELIEF in your Heart >


    Very simple, accept the truth of Jesus and believe it and BE saved.



    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    Notice how important the HEART is !!
    Rom 1:21 , the Heart can be Darkened !!
    Rom 2:5 , the Heart can be Hardened and Impenitent !!
    Rom 9:2 , it can become Sorrowful !!
    1 Cor 14:25 , the Heart has many Secrets and who can know it !!

    Yes, and the heart can love and do good things. Matthew 7:11
    The heart can know of the reality of God. Rom 1:21 (NIV)
    The heart can also be foolish and lack understanding of God. Psalm 14:1 (NIV)




    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    I submit to all that the Heart has to be Opened as they hear the Gospel of Grace to be Saved !!
    The first example of this is found in Acts 16:14 , it says that " WHOM the Lord had OPENED the HEART , to the give ATTENTION to the things being SPOKEN by PAUL and not Peter !!
    Yes but also notice it said... "Lydia...a worshipper of God." God made real to her the reality of the Good News of Jesus Christ, who Paul was teaching about. She wasn't a Jew, so obviously not only Jews believed in God.


    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    Then Eph 2:8 kicks in as God GIVES the GIFT of FAITH as Grace in verse 8 , is in the PASSIVE VOICE ( IT IS ) the GIFT of God !!

    Now this can be taken as breakdown of the salvation process that is a single process, or it can be looked at at two necessary parts to one achievement, salvation. I tend to look at it as one process, inextricably bound to both grace and faith. In either view, belief is required in order to be saved, and that comes from OUR heart and OUR will.


    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    In Rom 10:10 , it reads " For with the HEART he believes to Righteousness and with ( the ) mouth he CONFESSES to SALVATION !!
    Both , " man believeth and Confession is made " is in the Present Tense , Passive Voice , an Indicative Mood of FACT !!

    and are you advocating that mute people can NOT be saved then?



    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    The Present Tense , speaks to Continuous Results when Confession is Made and so then means OSAS !!


    How exactly did you get here? This confession is a one time event. Rom 10:10 (NIV)
    It is NOT a continuous event. 1 John 1:9 (NIV) shows what we do post salvation. Confessing or agreeing who Jesus is, in order to be saved, as in Romans 10, is one thing and confessing/agreeing what is sin in our life after that, is our daily way of life. Notice what 1 John 1:10 (NIV) says and as well what other scriptures say about residing in the vine as in Rom 11:20-21 (NIV)
    This clearly shows that OSAS is NOT a fact of salvation. Heb 6:4-6 (NIV) is another that OSAS is not a reality.


    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    I guess that means that Water Baptism , Tongues , Confessional with Priests and WORKS have no place in the Dispensation of the Grace of God !!

    I deduce you are wrong given how I exegete scripture. Grace is for a certain purpose identified in scripture. It doesn't give free reign to ignore everything else God wants to and does do in our lives.

    I'm afraid you have to make a better effort at presenting your Calvinist views if you really want people to accept and believe they are Biblically correct.


    But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15 (NIV)
    Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
    For this very reason, make every effort by your faith to produce virtue, by virtue knowledge, 6 by knowledge self-control, by self-control steadfastness, by steadfastness godliness, 7 by godliness brotherly affection, and by brotherly affection love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will make you effective and productive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Peter 1:5-8 (NIV)

    Comment


    • #17
      Theology Club: HOW ARE WE SAVED TODAY ?

      Romans 10:9-10
      sigpic

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Angel4Truth View Post
        Theology Club: HOW ARE WE SAVED TODAY ?

        Romans 10:9-10
        sigpic

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by StanJ53 View Post
          Not so. Rom 3:23 (NIV)


          want people to accept and believe they are Biblically correct.

          Hi , and in Eph 2:12 , we see that Gentiles were strangers from the Covenants of Promise .

          Gentiles had no Covenant with God at all , as it it all by Grace !!

          dan p

          Comment


          • #20
            [QUOTE=StanJ53;



            The Bible definitely does NOT show that speaking in tongues bring salvation. In fact it clearly shows speaking in tongues FOLLOWS salvation, and requires the baptism/infilling of the Holy Spirit.

            /QUOTE]


            Hi , and in 1 Cor 13:8 and 11 , Tongues are CHILDISH things , so much for Tongues , as Tongues were for Israel !!

            dan p

            Comment


            • #21
              [QUOTE=StanJ53;3402900
              This comes POST salvation and is NOT required to be saved.






              [/QUOTE]


              Hi , and just where does it ay that Baptism comes POST salvation

              Where does Paul say that ??

              dan p

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by StanJ53 View Post


                and are you advocating that mute people can NOT be saved then?


                .

                Hi , and I never said that , you did !!

                Are you accusing God of being Un-just ??

                In Rom 10:8 , But what does it say ? The Word is near you , in your mouth and in your heart , that is , the word of faith which we preach .

                And , by the way , I am not a Calvinist !!

                dan p

                Comment


                • #23
                  [QUOTE=StanJ53;This clearly shows that OSAS is NOT a fact of salvation. Heb 6:4-6 (NIV) is another that OSAS is not a reality.




                  /QUOTE]

                  Hi , and it is obvious , that you do not know what the Perfect Tense means in Eph 2:8 ??

                  SAVED/SOZO is in the Greek Perfect Tense , Passive Voice and a Participle !!

                  It should read , " For by Grace , HAVING BEEN SAVED " is the correct Translation .

                  But , you did not know that ??

                  dan p

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    [QUOTE=StanJ53;

                    How exactly did you get here? This confession is a one time event. Rom 10:10 (NIV)
                    It is NOT a continuous event. 1 John 1:9 (NIV) shows what we do post salvation. Confessing or agreeing who Jesus is, in order to be saved, as in Romans 10, is one thing and confessing/agreeing what is sin in our life after that, is our daily way of life. Notice what 1 John 1:10 (NIV) says and as well what other scriptures say about residing in the vine as in Rom 11:20-21 (NIV)
                    This clearly shows that OSAS is NOT a fact of salvation. Heb 6:4-6 (NIV) is another that OSAS is not a reality.





                    I deduce you are wrong given how I exegete scripture. Grace is for a certain purpose identified in scripture. It doesn't give free reign to ignore everything else God wants to and does do in our lives.

                    I'm afraid you have to make a better effort at presenting your Calvinist views if you really want people to accept and believe they are Biblically correct.[/QUOTE]


                    Hi , and there is a TWO PRESENT TENSE verb in Rom 10:10 , " MAN BELIEVETH " and " Confession is made " and also in the Passive Voice and in the Indicative Mood of FACT .

                    The Present tense speaks to CONTINUOUS ACTION in the present time !!

                    Check the internet and see , is what I do !!

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                      Hi , and in Eph 2:12 , we see that Gentiles were strangers from the Covenants of Promise .

                      Gentiles had no Covenant with God at all , as it it all by Grace !!

                      dan p

                      You're going from what you said about Jews in Acts 2 having a covenant, which they no longer had at that point, to a verse in Eph 2:12 about Paul explaining there was no need for Gentiles to become Jews anymore.
                      I'm really not sure what you're NOT getting about the NEW covenant?


                      But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15 (NIV)
                      Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
                      For this very reason, make every effort by your faith to produce virtue, by virtue knowledge, 6 by knowledge self-control, by self-control steadfastness, by steadfastness godliness, 7 by godliness brotherly affection, and by brotherly affection love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will make you effective and productive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Peter 1:5-8 (NIV)

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Dan,

                        Could a person be saved before Jesus died?

                        Untellectual

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                          Hi , and in 1 Cor 13:8 and 11 , Tongues are CHILDISH things , so much for Tongues , as Tongues were for Israel !!
                          dan p

                          This is NOT proper exegesis. You don't take two separate verses and try to put their thoughts together, to support YOUR opinion, when they don't go together. That is called eisegesis\, and is NOT acceptable by any competent Biblical scholar.
                          1 Cor 13:8-10 is one thought. 1 Cor 13:11, 12, 13 are three different thoughts. This is a totally disingenuous way of asserting your bias against tongues.


                          But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15 (NIV)
                          Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
                          For this very reason, make every effort by your faith to produce virtue, by virtue knowledge, 6 by knowledge self-control, by self-control steadfastness, by steadfastness godliness, 7 by godliness brotherly affection, and by brotherly affection love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will make you effective and productive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Peter 1:5-8 (NIV)

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                            Hi , and just where does it ay that Baptism comes POST salvation

                            Where does Paul say that ??

                            dan p

                            Acts 19:1-7 is a good example.


                            But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15 (NIV)
                            Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
                            For this very reason, make every effort by your faith to produce virtue, by virtue knowledge, 6 by knowledge self-control, by self-control steadfastness, by steadfastness godliness, 7 by godliness brotherly affection, and by brotherly affection love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will make you effective and productive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Peter 1:5-8 (NIV)

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                              Hi , and I never said that , you did !!

                              Are you accusing God of being Un-just ??

                              In Rom 10:8 , But what does it say ? The Word is near you , in your mouth and in your heart , that is , the word of faith which we preach .

                              And , by the way , I am not a Calvinist !!

                              dan p

                              That's right, I asked you a question based on your strong statement of "with ( the ) mouth he CONFESSES to SALVATION !!" in your post. What was your intent of capitalizing these words? Do you believe those who CAN'T confess Jesus with their mouth and vocal cords are NOT saved?

                              Why do you answer a question with another question?

                              I have no idea why you provided me with Rom 10:8?

                              You just support Calvinist views then is it?


                              But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect. 1 Peter 3:15 (NIV)
                              Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 2 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
                              For this very reason, make every effort by your faith to produce virtue, by virtue knowledge, 6 by knowledge self-control, by self-control steadfastness, by steadfastness godliness, 7 by godliness brotherly affection, and by brotherly affection love. 8 For if you possess these qualities in increasing measure, they will make you effective and productive in your knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Peter 1:5-8 (NIV)

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Untellectual View Post
                                Dan,

                                Could a person be saved before Jesus died?

                                Untellectual
                                Hi , and Abraham , Issac , and Jacob were saved before Jesus died , what say you ?

                                And they we be in the Millennial Kingdom , Matt 8:11 !!

                                dan p

                                Comment

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