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What 'Gospel' Did Paul Preach at Acts 9?

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  • ECT: What 'Gospel' Did Paul Preach at Acts 9?

    Here we read that Barnabas explained that while in Damascus Paul preached boldly:

    "But Barnabas took him, and brought him to the apostles, and declared unto them how he had seen the Lord in the way, and that he had spoken to him, and how he had preached boldly at Damascus in the name of Jesus. And he was with them coming in and going out at Jerusalem. And he spake boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus, and disputed against the Grecians: but they went about to slay him"
    (Acts 9:27-29).

    Of course the "gospel" or "good news" which he preached there could not possibly be the same one which he preached to the Gentiles because after he received from the Lord the gospel he preached to the Gentiles he went immediately into Arabia:
    "I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ...But when God, who set me apart from birth and called me by his grace, was pleased to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not consult any man, nor did I go up to Jerusalem to see those who were apostles before I was, but I went immediately into Arabia and later returned to Damascus" (Gal.1:11, 15-17).

    At the time Paul was preaching a gospel at Damascus he had not yet been into Arabia so it is impossible that at Damascus he was preaching the same gospel which he later preached to the Gentiles, a gospel "which was kept secret since the world began" (Ro.16:25).

    Paul speaks of two different gospels which he preached, one which was kept secret and another which was promised by the prophets in the OT:

    "Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh"
    (Ro.1:1-3).

    It is the gospel of grace which had been kept secret since the world began and therefore the Apostle Paul was not preaching that gospel at Acts 9 despite the fact that some people assert that at Damascus Paul preached "ALL THE COUNSEL of God."

  • #2
    Since the gospel of grace was not preached by Paul at Acts 9 then the present dispensation of grace did not begin then. Here are three quotes from him where he speaks of a "dispensation" that has been committed or given to him:

    "If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me toward you"
    (Eph. 3:2).

    "Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God" (Col.1:25).

    "...a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me"
    (1 Cor.9:17).

    The "dispensation" which was committed to Paul is in regard to "God's grace", a "ministry", and a "gospel." Here Paul sums up his dispensational responsibility:

    "But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God"
    (Acts 20: 24).

    I believe that Paul first began to preach the gospel of grace when he began preaching a gospel to the Gentiles at Acts 13:46-48. That is when the present dispensation began.

    It did not begin at Acts 9.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
      It is the gospel of grace which had been kept secret since the world began and therefore the Apostle Paul was not preaching that gospel at Acts 9 despite the fact that some people assert that at Damascus Paul preached "ALL THE COUNSEL of God."
      I never claimed that Paul preached the gospel of the grace of God ALL of the time.

      You're an idiot and a liar.
      All of my ancestors are human.
      Originally posted by Squeaky
      That explains why your an idiot.
      Originally posted by God's Truth
      Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
      Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
      (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

      1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
      (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

      Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
        I never claimed that Paul preached the gospel of the grace of God ALL of the time.

        You're an idiot and a liar.
        What did you mean when you said that Paul preached "all the counsel of God" to the Jews at Acts 9?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
          What did you mean when you said that Paul preached "all the counsel of God" to the Jews at Acts 9?
          I never said any such thing.
          All of my ancestors are human.
          Originally posted by Squeaky
          That explains why your an idiot.
          Originally posted by God's Truth
          Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
          Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
          (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

          1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
          (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

          Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
            I never said any such thing.
            Here is what you said in regard to what Paul was preaching to the Jews at Acts 9 on the thread "Dispensationalism Proven," post #95:

            Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
            Please be aware of the simple fact that Paul could not possibly preach the gospel of the grace of God to the Jews there unless they agreed on who the Christ was to start with. If Paul could not get past that with THEM, there was no way to proceed on to ALL THE COUNSEL of God.
            If you were not arguing that Paul was preaching the "gospel of the grace of God" to the Jews at Acts 9 and that the "gospel of the grace of God" is included in "ALL THE COUNCEL of God" then what was your argument?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
              Here is what you said in regard to what Paul was preaching to the Jews at Acts 9 on the thread "Dispensationalism Proven," post #95:

              If you were not arguing that Paul was preaching the "gospel of the grace of God" to the Jews at Acts 9 and that the "gospel of the grace of God" is included in "ALL THE COUNCEL of God" then what was your argument?
              My statement was simple and clear. It's almost surprising that you cannot understand it. But you are such a deaf zealot that I am not actually surprised.

              My point was simply THIS:

              Paul could not MOVE ON to the gospel of the grace of God if those Jews (Israelite's) that he was talking to did not believe that Jesus was the Christ.

              THEY... like many here on TOL, believed that Jesus was just a man like them. THEREFORE, they were STUCK and could NOT move on to the good news of the cross and the gospel of the grace of God.
              All of my ancestors are human.
              Originally posted by Squeaky
              That explains why your an idiot.
              Originally posted by God's Truth
              Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
              Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
              (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

              1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
              (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

              Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
                My statement was simple and clear. It's almost surprising that you cannot understand it. But you are such a deaf zealot that I am not actually surprised.

                My point was simply THIS:

                Paul could not MOVE ON to the gospel of the grace of God if those Jews (Israelite's) that he was talking to did not believe that Jesus was the Christ.

                THEY... like many here on TOL, believed that Jesus was just a man like them. THEREFORE, they were STUCK and could NOT move on to the good news of the cross and the gospel of the grace of God.
                From what you said earlier I understood that you were saying that the gospel of grace was preached before Acts 13:

                Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
                You believe that the body of Christ began in Acts 7, but the teacher/preacher of the gospel of the grace of God didn't begin teaching/preaching ITS doctrine until Acts 13?
                If you think that the gospel of grace was preached before Acts 13 then tell me when you think it was first preached.

                Comment


                • #9
                  "I believe that Paul first began to preach the gospel of grace when he began preaching a gospel to the Gentiles at Acts 13:46-48. That is when the present dispensation began.

                  It did not begin at Acts 9. "

                  Instead of focusing upon preaching the Gospel of Christ, dispensationalists on TOL now focus upon the issue of dividing up the supposed different Gospels preached in the New Testament. This attention to issues of a systematic theology with all its theologically correct divisions does not lead people to become born again (John 3: 1-6), become transformed by the renewing of your mind (Romans 12: 2), becoming a new creature or creation (II Corinthians 5: 17 and Galatians 6: 15), having Christ in you, which is the hope of glory (Colossians 1: 27) and becoming part of the Body of Christ (Ephesians 2: 16) which is also the same as becoming part of the Israel of God (Galatians 6: 15-16).

                  What these New Testament scriptures teach is interpreted by Reformation Theology. You can use the commentaries by John Calvin to get an idea of what Reformation Theology says on these scriptures.

                  But the hypothesis is that dispensationalism is in opposition to or is the anti-thesis (I Timothy 6: 20-21)to Reformation Theology. I thought dispensationalists claim that Reformation Theology is "Replacement Theology," in that it teaches that the Church replaces Old Covenant Israel.

                  The New Testament does say in four places that the Old Covenant was done away with (II Corinthians 3: 7. Ii Corinthians 3: 11. Hebrews 8: 13, Hebrews 10: 9). Ephesians 2: 13 says Gentiles who were previously aliens from the Covenants of Israel are made close to Israel by the blood of Christ, which is a subtle way of saying Gentiles are joined to Israel, but this is not Israel after the flesh (I Corinthians 10: 18), but is the Israel of God in Galatians 6: 15-16.

                  Paul does seem to imply in Colossians 1: 18 and Colossians 1: 24 that the Body of Christ is the same as the Ekklesia. But Paul does not continue using ekklesia with this meaning in other texts written later. Remember that Tynddale translates ekklkesia consistently as congregation rather than as church, which is closer to the meaning of the Greek ekklesia.
                  Last edited by northwye; January 25th, 2019, 12:31 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The point of this thread: for Jer to assert, pound the podium, declare, "Victory, as I showed all those MAD wackos how right I am, " return to "I am not here to debate, persuade, but show everyone that I am right" echo chamber.

                    That is Jer's MO on TOL.
                    Saint John W

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
                      What did you mean when you said that Paul preached "all the counsel of God" to the Jews at Acts 9?

                      Hi Jerry , and when do you believe that Paul was saved ?

                      Will you explain how Paul was then saved , and it was never at Acts 13 , was it !! NO , NO

                      And Rom 1:1 says that Paul was LIMITED/APHORIZO to preach ONLY God's Gospel !!

                      The dispensation of the Grace of God had to begin with a person , and that person was Paul and NOT Peter !!

                      1 Cor 15:8 proves it !!

                      dan p

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by john w View Post
                        The point of this thread: for Jer to assert, pound the podium, declare, "Victory, as I showed all those MAD wackos how right I am, " return to "I am not here to debate, persuade, but show everyone that I am right" echo chamber.

                        That is Jer's MO on TOL.
                        john w's MO on this forum follows the lawer's approach, that if you can't argue the facts, argue the law. If you can't argue the law then argue the facts. And if you can't argue either pound on the table!

                        All anyone ever sees john w do is pound on the table and do his best to question the integrity of anyone who does not agree with his ideas.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                          And Rom 1:1 says that Paul was LIMITED/APHORIZO to preach ONLY God's Gospel !!
                          Let us look at that gospel, Dan:

                          "Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord"
                          (Ro.1:1-3).

                          This gospel was promised by the OT prophets. But the gospel which he preached to the Gentiles was "kept secret since the world began":

                          "Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began"
                          (Ro.16:25).

                          The gospel which Paul said was kept secret since the world began cannot possibly be the same gospel which was promised by the OT prophets. Can you understand that?

                          Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                          The dispensation of the Grace of God had to begin with a person , and that person was Paul and NOT Peter !!
                          Yes, it began with Paul. Here are three quotes from the pen of Paul where he speaks of a "dispensation" that has been committed or given to him:

                          "If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me toward you" (Eph. 3:2).
                          "Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God" (Col.1:25).
                          "...a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me" (1 Cor.9:17).

                          The "dispensation" which was committed to Paul is in regard to "God's grace", a "ministry", and a "gospel." Here Paul sums up his dispensational responsibility:
                          "But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God" (Acts 20: 24).

                          There can be no doubt whatsoever that the event which marks the beginning of the "dispensation of grace" is the preaching of the "gospel of grace." That is the gospel which Paul referred to as the "gospel of the uncircumcision" (Gal.2:7) and Paul first began to preach that gospel to the uncircumcision at Acts 13:46-48. So it was at Acts 13 when the present dispensation began.

                          Originally posted by DAN P View Post
                          Will you explain how Paul was then saved , and it was never at Acts 13 , was it !! NO , NO
                          I never said that Paul was saved at Acts 13. Before Paul was converted he didn't believe that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. But after his experience on the Damascus road he realized immediately that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. And when he believed that "good news" or "gospel" he was born of God:

                          "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?"
                          (1 Jn.5:1-5).

                          That is the "birth" which Paul spoke of here:

                          "And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time"
                          (1 Cor.15:8).

                          The due date for the regeneration of the nation of Israel is described at Ezekiel 37:1-10 and since Paul experienced a rebirth prior to the nation being regenerated then that is why he said that he was born out of due time. And so all of the Jews who believed that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, were also born of God and born out of due time.
                          Last edited by Jerry Shugart; January 26th, 2019, 10:44 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
                            john w's MO on this forum follows the lawer's approach, that if you can't argue the facts, argue the law. If you can't argue the law then argue the facts. And if you can't argue either pound on the table!

                            All anyone ever sees john w do is pound on the table and do his best to question the integrity of anyone who does not agree with his ideas.
                            Impressive, bible corrector/mystic/agnostic, with that alcohol induced babbling, as members of the boc laugh at you. Slower: I only engage bible believers on this forum, not bible correctors/mystics/agnostics, such as yourself.

                            "who does not agree with his ideas"-you

                            Knock of plagiarizing me, Shugart, as you are trying to employ my argument. You don't have the clout on TOL, as I do, to pull it off. Go back to www.christianforums.com, where you can spam your "ministry." Oh, I forgot-you were banned there, for the same edeceptive, divisive tactics, that you spam/employ here.Maybe you can invite your clone, Pate, to join you.
                            Saint John W

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post
                              Let us look at that gospel, Dan:

                              "Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord"
                              (Ro.1:1-3).

                              This gospel was promised by the OT prophets. But the gospel which he preached to the Gentiles was "kept secret since the world began":

                              "Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began"
                              (Ro.16:25).

                              The gospel which Paul said was kept secret since the world began cannot possibly be the same gospel which was promised by the OT prophets. Can you understand that?



                              Yes, it began with Paul. Here are three quotes from the pen of Paul where he speaks of a "dispensation" that has been committed or given to him:

                              "If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me toward you" (Eph. 3:2).
                              "Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God" (Col.1:25).
                              "...a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me" (1 Cor.9:17).

                              The "dispensation" which was committed to Paul is in regard to "God's grace", a "ministry", and a "gospel." Here Paul sums up his dispensational responsibility:
                              "But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God" (Acts 20: 24).

                              There can be no doubt whatsoever that the event which marks the beginning of the "dispensation of grace" is the preaching of the "gospel of grace." That is the gospel which Paul referred to as the "gospel of the uncircumcision" (Gal.2:7) and Paul first began to preach that gospel to the uncircumcision at Acts 13:46-48. So it was at Acts 13 when the present dispensation began.



                              I never said that Paul was saved at Acts 13. Before Paul was converted he didn't believe that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. But after his experience on the Damascus road he realized immediately that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God. And when he believed that "good news" or "gospel" he was born of God:

                              "Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous. For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?"
                              (1 Jn.5:1-5).

                              That is the "birth" which Paul spoke of here:

                              "And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time"
                              (1 Cor.15:8).

                              The due date for the regeneration of the nation of Israel is described at Ezekiel 37:1-10 and since Paul experienced a rebirth prior to the nation being regenerated then that is why he said that he was born out of due time. And so all of the Jews who believed that the Lord Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, were also born of God and born out of due time.

                              Hi Jerry and a NOVEL approach that Paul preached the gospel only to Gentiles is not supported by Rom 1:1 as Paul was APORIZO / SEPARATED and LIMITED TO ONLY PREACH God's GOSPEL !!

                              The B O C was HIDDEN before the TIMES related to the AGES , Jerry do you now understand what AGES MEANS !!

                              And Eph 1:4 says just as He CHOSE / CALLED US for Himself IN HIM BEFORE THE OVERTHROW of the WORLD !!

                              You can not find this in the OT !!

                              Acts 13 has NO LEGS FOR SUPPORT !!

                              dan p

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