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REPORT: God's plan of salvation

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  • [QUOTE=TimLutz;3887311]
    Originally posted by Ben Masada View Post

    Mark chapters 15 and16. Acts chapter 1 for starters.

    Posted from the TOL App!
    What do you want to know about those texts? It seems to me you don't know how to quote. Biblical quotes must come with chapters and verses to be specific unless you are alone in this website.

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    • What is required, good works or grace?
      He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.

      Jim Elliot

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      • [QUOTE=Ben Masada;3887383]
        Originally posted by TimLutz View Post

        What do you want to know about those texts? It seems to me you don't know how to quote. Biblical quotes must come with chapters and verses to be specific unless you are alone in this website.
        The books were not written with it. And chapters were arranged to keep consistent with the meanings of what ever needed to be conveyed. Cutting up the scriptures leads to abuse which you do.

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        • Originally posted by Bright Raven View Post
          What is required, good works or grace?
          Thanks Bright Raven for bring focus back.

          2 Timothy 3:16
          New King James Version (NKJV)
          16*All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.

          Sola Scriptura, scripture alone.
          Sola fide, faith alone.
          Sola gratia, grace alone.
          Solus Christus, Christ alone.
          Soli Deo gloria, glory to God alone.
          We come to knowledge and relationship with God. By searching knowledge from scripture, justified by faith thru the gift of grace. The gift paid for by Christ's atonement, on the cross. Not by works of man. All Glory for all this to God alone.

          Ephesians 2:8-10
          New King James Version (NKJV)
          8*For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9*not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10*For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

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          • Galatians 3:5-10
            New King James Version (NKJV)
            5*Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— 6*just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”[a] 7*Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 8*And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.”[b] 9*So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.

            The Law Brings a Curse

            10*For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them

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            • And by the way BM. The first time both grace and faith are mentioned in the Bible was over Abraham.

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              • Originally posted by Bright Raven View Post
                What is required, good works or grace?
                The chance we have to do good works in order to set things right with God comes as a result of God's grace. That's what the Law is all about: To show us what is wrong and what we ought to do to keep us out of trouble. Therefore, to answer your question above, good works is what is required, but goods works in terms of obedience to God's Law. This cannot be distinguished from grace.

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                • [QUOTE=TimLutz;3888119]
                  Originally posted by Ben Masada View Post

                  The books were not written with it. And chapters were arranged to keep consistent with the meanings of what ever needed to be conveyed. Cutting up the scriptures leads to abuse which you do.

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                  It means, deep down, you are not interested is answers from the Scriptures.

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                  • Originally posted by TimLutz View Post
                    Galatians 3:5-10
                    New King James Version (NKJV)
                    5*Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— 6*just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”[a] 7*Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 8*And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.”[b] 9*So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.

                    The Law Brings a Curse

                    10*For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them

                    Posted from the TOL App!
                    No one is justified by faith but by the way he or she has lived according to the Law. Abraham was justified by his works. Read James 2:21.

                    The Law brings salvation. What brings curses are our sins. If you obey the Law you will have life free of trouble. We need to abide by the Law. If we break the Law, that's not the end of us. We can always repent and obey. (Isa. 1:18,19) To break the Law is human; to reject the Law is insurrection. That's when the curse sets in.

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                    • Originally posted by TimLutz View Post
                      And by the way BM. The first time both grace and faith are mentioned in the Bible was over Abraham.

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                      And Abraham got justified for his good works. (James 2:21)

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                      • Originally posted by Ben Masada View Post
                        And Abraham got justified for his good works. (James 2:21)
                        You make my point of gripe with you. You shorten context to change meaning.

                        James 2:18-22
                        New King James Version (NKJV)
                        18*But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your[a] works, and I will show you my faith by my[b] works. 19*You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20*But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?[c] 21*Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22*Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?
                        Works is the seal of the proof of faith and grace.

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                        • Genesis 15:4-6
                          New King James Version (NKJV)
                          4*And behold, the word of the Lord came to him, saying, “This one shall not be your heir, but one who will come from your own body shall be your heir.” 5*Then He brought him outside and said, “Look now toward heaven, and count the stars if you are able to number them.” And He said to him, “So shall your descendants be.”

                          6*And he believed in the Lord, and He accounted it to him for righteousness.

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                          • Final aside. Paul was not allowed (trusted) to fellowship with the Jerusalem church for twenty years after his conversion. He was leading them? Not quite.

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                            • Originally posted by TimLutz View Post
                              You make my point of gripe with you. You shorten context to change meaning.

                              James 2:18-22
                              New King James Version (NKJV)
                              18*But someone will say, “You have faith, and I have works.” Show me your faith without your[a] works, and I will show you my faith by my[b] works. 19*You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble! 20*But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?[c] 21*Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? 22*Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?
                              Works is the seal of the proof of faith and grace.

                              Posted from the TOL App!
                              I have read James 2:18-22. I did not mention the whole text because good works and faith in this context are one and the same. Therefore, it is meaningless to distinguish between one and the other as Christians like to, just to discredit the role of the Law. If by good works faith is made perfect, without good works faith is meaningless as grace comes only through obedience to the law.

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                              • It is the seal of election. And good works are beside not sinning. As in giving and helping. An acceptable blood sacrifice has to be made to attone for sin.

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