Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

THE LORDS DAY CONTROVERSY?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • THE LORDS DAY CONTROVERSY?

    Hi All,

    This thread is for scripture only. Is the "LORD'S DAY" that many proclaim SUNDAY according to the scriptures in the bible?

    Let's start by looking at your scriptures that many use to claim SUNDAY is the "LORD'S DAY"

    REVELATIONS 1:9-11 [9] I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ. [10], I was in the Spirit on the LORD'S DAY, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, [11], Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What you see, write in a book, and send it to the seven churches which are in Asia; to Ephesus, and to Smyrna, and to Pergamos, and to Thyatira, and to Sardis, and to Philadelphia, and to Laodicea.

    No doubt about it Revelations 1:10 clearly says that John was in the SPIRIT on the "LORD'S DAY"!

    NOW the only problem you have is the need to show scripture that says SUNDAY IS THE LORD'S DAY.

    Can you please provide scripture that says SUNDAY or the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK is the "LORD'S DAY"?

    If we cannot find any scriptures to say that SUNDAY is the "LORD'S DAY" then we have a problem.

    .............

    Now let's look at the scriptures that give the only answer answer to our question that I can find in the bible...

    Q. WHAT DAY IS THE "LORD'S DAY" ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE?
    A.
    MATTHEW 12:8 [8], For THE SON OF MAN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY.

    Which day is the Lord's Day? THE SABBATH DAY (MATTHEW 12:8; MARK 2:27-28)

    God's WORD says that the SABBATH DAY IS THE LORD'S DAY!

    There is NO scripture that says Sunday or the FIRST DAY of the week is the Lords Day. God's Word says the Lord's day is the Sabbath day. This is the day God rested on, he set apart and made a Holy day at the completion of the creation week and made a memorial for all mankind (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11). Jesus is the God of creation and he is the Lord of the Sabbath day (Matthew 12:8; Mark 2:27-28)

    .............

    Now friend's the SABBATH is the 4th Commandment of God's 10 Commandments and there is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says that God's 4th Commandment has been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep SUNDAY as a HOLY DAY. The same as there is not one scripture in ALL of God's WORD that says that SUNDAY is the LORD'S DAY.

    John in the book of REVELATIONS 1:10 was in the SPIRIT on the SABBATH DAY not SUNDAY!

    .............

    HOW WAS THE LORD'S DAY CHANGED TO SUNDAY?

    SUNDAY Worship is a teaching and tradition of men handed down by the Roman Catholic Church that has lead many to break and ignore God's 4th Commandment (Exodus 20:8-11).

    Interested to know your thoughts. Remember friendly disucussion please supported by the scriptures.

    May God bless you as you seek him through his Word.

  • #2
    Originally posted by 3rdAngel View Post
    No doubt about it Revelations 1:10 clearly says that John was in the SPIRIT on the "LORD'S DAY"!
    The "Lord's day" in Revelation 1:10 is NOT a reference to a day of the week.

    It is referring to the day of the Lord when He executes judgment on the world.
    All of my ancestors are human.
    Originally posted by Squeaky
    That explains why your an idiot.
    Originally posted by God's Truth
    Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
    Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
    (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
    (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

    Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Right Divider View Post

      The "Lord's day" in Revelation 1:10 is NOT a reference to a day of the week.

      It is referring to the day of the Lord when He executes judgment on the world.
      Actually no it isn't. REVELATION 1:10 is not referring to the second coming of "day of the Lord" it is referring to "the Lord's day" The Greek word used here is in reference to the Lord's ownership of the day and the context of REVELATION 1 is not to the second coming but to "the day that John was in the "Spirit of". John is in the presence of JESUS in the Heavenly Sanctuary not the second coming.

      The Lords day in the GREEK "Lord's Day" (κυριακή ημέρα; means day belonging to the Lord). That is this is the day John was in the Spirit receiving his vision was the time of the vision, the Lord's Day. The phrase in this latter passage is totally different. The phrase here is; en te kuriake hemera. The adjective is applied by Paul to the Lord’s Supper: from the Supper it came to be applied to the day.

      On the Lord's day - The word rendered here as "Lord's" (κυριακῇ kuriakē), occurs only in this place and in 1 Corinthians 11:20, where it is applied to the Lord's supper. It properly means "belonging to the Lord"; and, so far as this word is concerned, "a day; belonging to the Lord," in any sense, or for any reason; either because he claimed it as his own, he was the "Creator" of the Sabbath. It is that day he set aside and rested on in the creation week, made known to his disciples that he made this day and he was the creator of it Lord and set it aside and made Holy (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11; Mark 2:27-28; Matthew 12:8).

      Jesus being the creator of all things and Lord's of the Sabbath would not be common knowledge to the Jews as the majority of them did not believe Jesus was the Messiah. Jesus as creator and Lord of the Sabbath was a revelation from God to his people. Hence Lord's day the day of the Sabbath that all God's people knew about is applied to Jesus as the creator of it.

      It is clear that in reference to Revelation 1:10 that this refers to some day which was distinguished from all other days of the week, and which would be sufficiently designated by the use of this term "κυριακή ημέρα; day belonging to the Lord" κυριακή ημέρα that it was a day which was for some reason regarded as especially a day of the Lord, or especially devoted to him. κυριακή ημέρα it would further appear that this was a day particularly devoted to the Lord Jesus; for: that is the natural meaning of the word "Lord" as used in the New Testament and in, MATTHEW 12:8 κύριος γαρ εστι του σαββάτου ο υιός του ανθρώπου with the Word Lord κύριος being used here as supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller ; God, Lord. The Sabbath is the day that distinguishes Jesus as LORD, God creator of all things. This is the day (Sabbath) that John received his Vision.

      .................

      "The Lord's Day" in the Greek is a reference to a Day belonging to the Lord that John was in the Spirit on, which is the context and meaning of the Greek words used κυριακή ημέρα [10] εγενόμην εν πνεύματι εν τη κυριακή ημέρα και ήκουσα φωνήν οπίσω μου μεγαλήν ως σάλπιγγος.

      Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - G2960 The Lord's day' κυριακός; kuriakos From G2962; belonging to the Lord (Jehovah or Jesus): - Lord's.

      "The Day of the Lord" is a biblical term and theme used in both the Hebrew Bible (יֹום יְהוָה) and the New Testament. The Greek word for "the day of the Lord" (ἡμέρα κυρίου) uses a different Greek word to the Lords day as shown, as in "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come" (Joel2:31, cited in Acts2:20).

      ..................


      MATTHEW 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

      WHICH DAY IS THE LORDS DAY OR THE DAY?

      MATTHEW 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

      MARK 2:27-28 [27], And he said to them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:[28], Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

      The term "Lord's day" used in Revelation 1:10 is not linked to μία των which is used in the NEW TESTAMENT Greek which means FIRST DAY.

      In Revelations 1:10 "Lords Day κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ does not link to any scripture reference in the NEW TESTAMENT to μιά των σαββάτων (the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK).

      κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ used in Revelations 1:10 is in reference to the Lord's ownership of the day. It does not say that this day is in reference to μιά των σαββάτων which means the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK.

      ...................

      Your challenge here in this OP is to prove that the Lord's DAY is in reference to the First day of the week and prove it from the scriptures.

      Hope this helps
      Last edited by 3rdAngel; May 17th, 2020, 03:37 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by 3rdAngel View Post

        Actually no it isn't. REVELATION 1:10 is not referring to the second coming of "day of the Lord" it is referring to "the Lord's day" The Greek word used here is in reference to the Lord's ownership of the day and the context of REVELATION 1 is not to the second coming but to "the day that John was in the "Spirit of". John is in the presence of JESUS in the Heavenly Sanctuary not the second coming.
        You're quite the cut and paste artist.

        No, the LORD'S DAY is one way of saying THE DAY OF THE LORD.

        There is NO indication whatsoever that John is referring to a day of the week. What John is referring to is a JUDGEMENT.

        This is also shown later when the Lord Jesus Christ says "Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter".

        The thing which must be hereafter are judgments on the world.
        All of my ancestors are human.
        Originally posted by Squeaky
        That explains why your an idiot.
        Originally posted by God's Truth
        Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
        Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
        (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

        1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
        (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

        Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
          You're quite the cut and paste artist.

          No, the LORD'S DAY is one way of saying THE DAY OF THE LORD.

          There is NO indication whatsoever that John is referring to a day of the week. What John is referring to is a JUDGEMENT.

          This is also shown later when the Lord Jesus Christ says "Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter".

          The thing which must be hereafter are judgments on the world.
          No not at all. It is only a subject I have prayerfully studied through the scriptures. Do you have something to add to the conversation? All you have done here is ignored all the scriptures and context demonstrated in the post you are quoting from and hand waiving and ignoring the post and scriptures that prove your intepretation of REVALTION 1:10 is not correct. Everything you have posted here is already addressed in the very post you are quoting from and your simply ignoring what has been shared with you from the scriptures without addressing anything and showing why you disagree. If you disagree dear friend, how about you address this post and scriptures that prove context is in the Heavenly Sanctuary and not the second coming and the "day that John was in the Spirit of" and the Greek word application used is to the "the Lords ownership of the day" John was in the Spirit of. If you cannot you have no excuse not to believe the scriptures shared with you in my opinion. Ignoring God's Word does not make it disappear. God's Word can be a blessing or a curse. It is a blessing to all those who receive and believe it and a curse to those who reject it and becomes our judge come judgement day *JOHN 12:47-48
          Last edited by 3rdAngel; May 20th, 2020, 02:35 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 3rdAngel View Post

            No not at all. It is only a subject I have pratyerfully studied through the scriptures. Do you have something to add to the conversation?
            The "Lord's day" is the "day of the Lord".

            It is NOT a "day of the week".

            Originally posted by 3rdAngel View Post
            All you have done here is ignored all the scriptures and context demonstrated in the post you are quoting from and hand waiving and ignoring the post and scriptures that prove your your intepretation of REVALTION 1:10 is not correct. Everything you have posted here is already addressed in the post you are quoting from and your simply ignoring what has been shared with you from the scriptures. If you disagree dear friend, how about you address this post and scriptures that prove context is in the Heavenly Sanctuary and not the second coming and the "day that John was in the Spirit of" and the Greek word application used is to the "the Lords ownership of the day" John was in the Spirit of. If you cannot you have no excuse not to believe the scriptures shared with you in my opinion. Ignoring God's Word does not make it disappear. God's Word can be a blessing or a curse. It is a blessing to all those who receive and believe it and a curse to those who reject it and becomes our judge come judgement day *JOHN 12:47-48
            Blah blah blah...

            In Greek, the LORD'S DAY is 100% equivalent to THE DAY OF THE LORD in Hebrew.

            In Revelation 1:10 there is no point to a "day of the week", instead John was seeing the DAY OF THE LORD where God's judgement on the earth in view.

            Your obsession with a DAY OF THE WEEK is your SDA false doctrine showing.
            All of my ancestors are human.
            Originally posted by Squeaky
            That explains why your an idiot.
            Originally posted by God's Truth
            Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
            Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
            (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

            1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
            (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

            Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Right Divider View Post

              The "Lord's day" in Revelation 1:10 is NOT a reference to a day of the week.

              It is referring to the day of the Lord when He executes judgment on the world.
              Yes, that is correct
              "And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship and in breaking of bread and in prayers." Acts 2:42

              "Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind" Philippians 2:2

              Pro scripture = Protestant

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
                The "Lord's day" is the "day of the Lord".

                It is NOT a "day of the week".


                Blah blah blah...

                In Greek, the LORD'S DAY is 100% equivalent to THE DAY OF THE LORD in Hebrew.

                In Revelation 1:10 there is no point to a "day of the week", instead John was seeing the DAY OF THE LORD where God's judgement on the earth in view.

                Your obsession with a DAY OF THE WEEK is your SDA false doctrine showing.
                Yep... same as 'day of Christ', also equals 'day of the Lord' and 'the Lord's day'.

                2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
                Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD[YHVH], that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
                Jer 23:6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he[the Branch] shall be called, THE LORD[YHVH] OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by steko View Post

                  Yep... same as 'day of Christ', also equals 'day of the Lord' and 'the Lord's day'.

                  2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.


                  Another example of the deity of Christ.
                  All of my ancestors are human.
                  Originally posted by Squeaky
                  That explains why your an idiot.
                  Originally posted by God's Truth
                  Father figure, Son figure, and Holy Spirit figure.
                  Col 2:9 (AKJV/PCE)
                  (2:9) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

                  1Tim 4:10 (AKJV/PCE)
                  (4:10) For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.

                  Something that was SPOKEN OF since the world began CANNOT be the SAME thing as something KEPT SECRET since the world began.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by 3rdAngel View Post
                    Hi All,
                    This thread is for scripture only. Is the "LORD'S DAY" that many proclaim SUNDAY according to the scriptures in the bible?
                    Well, scripture only is okay, but the Jewish calendar and Gregorian calendar aren't in sync. If you tried today, you'd have to switch days ever year to keep whatever day the Sabbath happened to be upon.

                    Then, as has been mentioned, "the Lord's Day" is a different issue than the Sabbath.

                    Both of these, imho, require reasoned discussion specifically because no scripture is going to tell you that there is a difference between our current calendar and how different it is from the Jewish calendar. -Lon
                    My New Years Resolution: 1 Peter 3:15
                    Omniscient without man's qualification. John 1:3 "Nothing"
                    Colossians 1:17 "Nothing" John 15:5 "Nothing"
                    Mighty, ALL mighty (omnipotent). Revelation 1:8
                    No possible limitation Isaiah 40:25 Joshua 24:15
                    Infinite (Omnipresent) Psalm 145:3 Hebrews 4:13

                    ? Yep

                    Now to Him who is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think... Amen. -Ephesians 3:20 & 21

                    ... when I became an adult, I set aside childish ways. Titus 3:10 Ephesians 4:29-32; 5:11

                    Separation of church and State is not atheism "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
                      The "Lord's day" is the "day of the Lord".

                      It is NOT a "day of the week".


                      Blah blah blah...

                      In Greek, the LORD'S DAY is 100% equivalent to THE DAY OF THE LORD in Hebrew.

                      In Revelation 1:10 there is no point to a "day of the week", instead John was seeing the DAY OF THE LORD where God's judgement on the earth in view.

                      Your obsession with a DAY OF THE WEEK is your SDA false doctrine showing.
                      Your just repeating yourself again dear friend without addressing the scriptures and the posts that disagree with you. This is already addressed in detail in post # 3 linked which proves your claims to "REVELATION 1:10 being to the second coming as being false because; the context is to JOHN being "in the Spirit" on "the Lords day" which in the Greek means the Lord's ownership of "the Day". Also the CONTEXT" is to John being in the presenece of JESUS in the "Heavenly Sanctuary" not the "second coming" or the Day of the Lord which is not the same as the "Lord's Day" or a day belonging to the Lord (κυριακή ημέρα). Revelations is also not written in Hebrew it is written in Greek so your argument is not relevant to Greek context and language meaning. All of this and more scripture however was already addressed in post # 3 linked, all you have done is ignore scripture and have not addressed anything you are quoting from. I do not mind if you disagree but if you disagree show why. So far all you have shown is that you choose to ignore the scriptures that prove why your interpretation is in error.

                      May you receive Gods' Word and be blessed.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by oatmeal View Post

                        Yes, that is correct
                        Actually no it is not correct. Revelation 1:10 is a reference to a Day belonging to "the Lord that John was in the Spirit on, which is the context and meaning of the Greek words used κυριακή ημέρα [10] εγενόμην εν πνεύματι εν τη κυριακή ημέρα και ήκουσα φωνήν οπίσω μου μεγαλήν ως σάλπιγγος. The context is John being in the presence of JESUS in the Heavenly Sanctuary *REVELATION 1:11-13. If you disagree please address this post and post # 3 linked
                        that proves why REVELATION 1:10 does not mean the second coming.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by steko View Post
                          Yep... same as 'day of Christ', also equals 'day of the Lord' and 'the Lord's day'. 2Th 2:2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.[/COLOR]
                          Actually nope. The reason being is that "the Lord's Day" in the Greek is a reference to a Day belonging to the Lord that John was in the Spirit on, which is the context and meaning of the Greek words used κυριακή ημέρα [10] εγενόμην εν πνεύματι εν τη κυριακή ημέρα και ήκουσα φωνήν οπίσω μου μεγαλήν ως σάλπιγγος. The context is John being in the presence of JESUS in the Heavenly Sanctuary *REVELATION 1:11-13 and not the second coming (or Day of the Lord). If you disagree please address this post and post # 3 linked that proves why REVELATION 1:10 does not mean the second coming.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lon View Post
                            Well, scripture only is okay, but the Jewish calendar and Gregorian calendar aren't in sync. If you tried today, you'd have to switch days ever year to keep whatever day the Sabbath happened to be upon. Then, as has been mentioned, "the Lord's Day" is a different issue than the Sabbath. Both of these, imho, require reasoned discussion specifically because no scripture is going to tell you that there is a difference between our current calendar and how different it is from the Jewish calendar. -Lon
                            Hi Lon, nice to meet you and welcome. Actually the calanders do not effect the Sabbath which is simply every seventh day of the week according to the scriptures *GENESIS 2:1-3; EXODUS 20:8-11. All the calander does is effect how many days are in the month. It does not effect a continual unbroken weekly cycle. The Jews have been keeping the Sabbath unbroken as a continous weekly cycle for 6000 years, Jesus kept it as did all the Aposltles according to God's 4th commandment and God's people have always kept it unbroken to this very present day as demonstrated through history. Thanks for sharing your thoughts Lon

                            God bless.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Right Divider View Post
                              In Greek, the LORD'S DAY is 100% equivalent to THE DAY OF THE LORD in Hebrew.
                              NONSENSE, but here is the reason why...

                              "The Lord's Day" in the Greek is a reference to a Day belonging to the Lord that John was in the Spirit on, which is the context and meaning of the Greek words used κυριακή ημέρα [10] εγενόμην εν πνεύματι εν τη κυριακή ημέρα και ήκουσα φωνήν οπίσω μου μεγαλήν ως σάλπιγγος.

                              Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong - G2960 The Lord's day' κυριακός; kuriakos From G2962; belonging to the Lord (Jehovah or Jesus): - Lord's.

                              "The Day of the Lord" is a biblical term and theme used in both the Hebrew Bible (יֹום יְהוָה) and the New Testament. The Greek word for "the day of the Lord" (ἡμέρα κυρίου) uses a different Greek word to the Lords day as shown, as in "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come" (Joel2:31, cited in Acts2:20).


                              Hope this helps.
                              Last edited by 3rdAngel; May 17th, 2020, 03:34 PM.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X