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  • #16
    Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
    Great. The reintroduction of the ego driven pompous "anyone who doesn't agree with my theology" is a heretic bunk...
    Jn 14:6

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    • #17
      Originally posted by serpentdove View Post
      Jn 14:6
      Oh, if it isn't Miss "lets burn prostitutes alive" Charm herself with another verse quote...

      Nice company you've got there choleric....

      Well this is fun isn't it?

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
        Great. The reintroduction of the ego driven pompous "anyone who doesn't agree with my theology" is a heretic bunk...

        C'mon AB. That isn't even an attempt at intellectual honesty. This isn't a thread about doctrinal purity, it's about the basic fundamentals. You know that.

        If it was what you say, then Calvinists and open theists and Pentecostals etc would be on here.

        If you don't believe that 1) Jesus is God 2) salvation is by faith without works and 3) Paul was not a heretic; then you are way outside basic, across the board Christianity.

        Surely you know that, right?
        Your issue is one of AUTHORITY. All heresy starts and ends where a person sets themselves above God's Word and becomes their own authority. It is disguised as "textual criticism" and "scholarship". All of it ends where the first lie began "Hath God Said?"

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Choleric View Post
          Why so? We are instructed in Scripture to mark heretics. How would you fulfill that commandment on a forum?
          You can add the names of any Calvinist, and it should top your list.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Choleric View Post
            C'mon AB. That isn't even an attempt at intellectual honesty. This isn't a thread about doctrinal purity, it's about the basic fundamentals. You know that.

            If it was what you say, then Calvinists and open theists and Pentecostals etc would be on here.

            If you don't believe that 1) Jesus is God 2) salvation is by faith without works and 3) Paul was not a heretic; then you are way outside basic, across the board Christianity.

            Surely you know that, right?
            Oh give me a break. There's others who would shout 'heretic!' for having a different set of 'basics' and it's just who can shout the loudest for the most part. Carry on with your 'crusade' for all it actually means. If you took a step back from the self assured pomposity of it you might actually see how alienating and bemusing the whole thing is to many looking in....

            Well this is fun isn't it?

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
              Oh give me a break. There's others who would shout 'heretic!' for having a different set of 'basics' and it's just who can shout the loudest for the most part. Carry on with your 'crusade' for all it actually means. If you took a step back from the self assured pomposity of it you might actually see how alienating and bemusing the whole thing is to many looking in....

              If you find standing for basic Christianity "amusing" then what do you believe? Do you think it is ok the deny the deity of Christ, to deny half the New Testament and to deny salvation is by grace without works? Do you think God was kidding when He said salvation was only thoroughly Christ or is that too narrow for you too?

              What is truth to you? Is there such a thing as truth or is everything "relative"?

              Are you a universalist or just someone who wants everyone to like him because you can't stand division, even if it means standing for truth. The word of God has plenty to say about all of that too.

              Jesus said "truth" will set us free. Half truths will not. He also said that men would hate us for His names sake. Are you afraid that standing for truth might make some people not like you?

              Pick a side AB.
              Your issue is one of AUTHORITY. All heresy starts and ends where a person sets themselves above God's Word and becomes their own authority. It is disguised as "textual criticism" and "scholarship". All of it ends where the first lie began "Hath God Said?"

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Choleric View Post
                If you find standing for basic Christianity "amusing" then what do you believe? Do you think it is ok the deny the deity of Christ, to deny half the New Testament and to deny salvation is by grace without works? Do you think God was kidding when He said salvation was only thoroughly Christ or is that too narrow for you too?
                Where did I say I found any such thing "amusing" exactly? I find your thread anything but as it does no such thing. You simply concoct a list of people who don't believe the exact same theology as yourself, call them heretics and then 'invite' them to let you know if they repent of their 'heresy' - believe the same as you - and then you'll take them off the list. Where were you appointed as the sole arbiter of what everyone else should believe?

                What is truth to you? Is there such a thing as truth or is everything "relative"?
                Of course there's such a thing as truth. And...?

                Are you a universalist or just someone who wants everyone to like him because you can't stand division, even if it means standing for truth. The word of God has plenty to say about all of that too.
                Are you kidding? If I 'wanted everyone to like me' then I wouldn't bother to take an opposing position to others on any subject on any thread...
                As far as I'm concerned threads like yours are only designed to cause division and sow dischord. There'll be plenty who think you're a heretic and be just as assured that they have the 'truth'.

                Jesus said "truth" will set us free. Half truths will not. He also said that men would hate us for His names sake. Are you afraid that standing for truth might make some people not like you?
                Oh enough with the martyr complex already. I don't hate you at all choleric. As before - if I was that bothered about not being liked I wouldn't take a stand on any given thread so your argument there simply doesn't work.

                Pick a side AB.
                I do already, on a number of topics. Thanks anyway though....

                Well this is fun isn't it?

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
                  Where did I say I found any such thing "amusing" exactly? I find your thread anything but as it does no such thing. You simply concoct a list of people who don't believe the exact same theology as yourself, call them heretics and then 'invite' them to let you know if they repent of their 'heresy' - believe the same as you - and then you'll take them off the list. Where were you appointed as the sole arbiter of what everyone else should believe?
                  As a Christian I am told to do a few things. 1- share the gospel 2- mark those that teach false gospels

                  I am doing both. I did not concoct a list. And or the record none of the people on my list would argue with their classification. The works crowd will proudly stand for their belief that they have to work to attain and/or maintain their salvation. Same for the other groups.

                  Again, the gospel is one thing and it is absolute. It is not negotiable. It isn't pliable. If you deny salvation is a free gift without works, you will die in your sins. (Rom 10:3). If you deny the deity of Christ, you are placing whatever faith you have in a false Christ and you will die in your sins. If you believe that Paul was a heretic, you have no idea what the gospel is and will die in your sins.

                  If you disagree, please do so with more intelligence than simply calling me mean.


                  Of course there's such a thing as truth. And...?
                  Where is it? Do you stand up for it or at least stand by it? Do you believe a person can get saved by offering God their works? Do you believe that a person can get saved without Paul's epistles? Are you afraid to tell someone their doctrine is the broad road that leads to eternal hell? Are you too "nice" for that?

                  Are you kidding? If I 'wanted everyone to like me' then I wouldn't bother to take an opposing position to others on any subject on any thread...
                  I'm not talking about what your favorite color is, or what your various political views are. I am talking about salvation. It is one thing, and it is not 100 others. Are you taking a stand with anyone who teaches or believes error? Or do you choose not to talk about religious matters because you don't want to be "dogmatic"?

                  As far as I'm concerned threads like yours are only designed to cause division and sow dischord. There'll be plenty who think you're a heretic and be just as assured that they have the 'truth'.
                  Not to sow discord, but to obey this verse:

                  Rom 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

                  How do you suppose we fulfill that command on a forum? If you have an alternate to the list, I'm all ears. Something tells me your preference will be to ignore the verse altogether in the "spirit of unity".

                  Oh enough with the martyr complex already. I don't hate you at all choleric. As before - if I was that bothered about not being liked I wouldn't take a stand on any given thread so your argument there simply doesn't work.

                  I do already, on a number of topics. Thanks anyway though....

                  Take a stand. Tell me what you think about salvation and obedience to "mark them".

                  Maybe you will just sit down instead.
                  Your issue is one of AUTHORITY. All heresy starts and ends where a person sets themselves above God's Word and becomes their own authority. It is disguised as "textual criticism" and "scholarship". All of it ends where the first lie began "Hath God Said?"

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Choleric View Post
                    As a Christian I am told to do a few things. 1- share the gospel 2- mark those that teach false gospels

                    I am doing both. I did not concoct a list. And or the record none of the people on my list would argue with their classification. The works crowd will proudly stand for their belief that they have to work to attain and/or maintain their salvation. Same for the other groups.
                    Yes you have concocted a list. Basically it's anyone who doesn't in whole ascribe to your theological line of thinking. Others have done the same tired thing and point the same accusing finger at others who don't agree with them. It's nowt new and neither are you in that regard...

                    Again, the gospel is one thing and it is absolute. It is not negotiable. It isn't pliable. If you deny salvation is a free gift without works, you will die in your sins. (Rom 10:3). If you deny the deity of Christ, you are placing whatever faith you have in a false Christ and you will die in your sins. If you believe that Paul was a heretic, you have no idea what the gospel is and will die in your sins.
                    Well thank you St choleric...

                    If you disagree, please do so with more intelligence than simply calling me mean.
                    Where did I call you mean exactly? Please point out where else you're making stuff up dude.

                    Where is it? Do you stand up for it or at least stand by it? Do you believe a person can get saved by offering God their works? Do you believe that a person can get saved without Paul's epistles? Are you afraid to tell someone their doctrine is the broad road that leads to eternal hell? Are you too "nice" for that?
                    Oh, so I guess it's 'heresy' to not believe in an eternal hell as well is it? Most in the early church didn't go along with the dogma of eternal torment so if you're peddling that as 'truth' then you're just another zealot who likes the sound of his own voice and isn't happy unless he finds disagreement. Again - nowt new.

                    And are you suggesting that people can't actually be 'saved' unless they read Paul's epistles or something regardless?

                    I'm not talking about what your favorite color is, or what your various political views are. I am talking about salvation. It is one thing, and it is not 100 others. Are you taking a stand with anyone who teaches or believes error? Or do you choose not to talk about religious matters because you don't want to be "dogmatic"?
                    I'm not dogmatic choleric, that's kinda the point. You're a dime a dozen where it comes to what 'teaching error' consists of and like plenty others you're equally vehement that you have the truth and everyone from a contrary position doesn't. You're all tiresome frankly.

                    Not to sow discord, but to obey this verse:

                    Rom 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.
                    How ironic. You're the one intent on causing division because you're so egotistical as to presuppose you're the only one who has the 'truth'.

                    How do you suppose we fulfill that command on a forum? If you have an alternate to the list, I'm all ears. Something tells me your preference will be to ignore the verse altogether in the "spirit of unity".
                    No, you wouldn't be 'all ears' choleric. You'll doubtless label me a heretic because I don't ascribe to an 'eternal hell' and you can get on with that frankly. It'll simply confirm that you're not interested in genuine debate on contentious issues but only intent on your own obsessive agenda if so.


                    Take a stand. Tell me what you think about salvation and obedience to "mark them".
                    I'm not interested in 'marking others' as heretics. I'm strongly opposed to some of the 'teachings' I see on here, but I don't need to revert to pointless name calling and lists fuelled by nothing but ego.

                    Maybe you will just sit down instead.
                    Maybe I'll do a sudoku puzzle after submitting this....who knows?

                    Well this is fun isn't it?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Choleric View Post
                      If you deny salvation is a free gift without works, you will die in your sins. (Rom 10:3). If you deny the deity of Christ, you are placing whatever faith you have in a false Christ and you will die in your sins. If you believe that Paul was a heretic, you have no idea what the gospel is and will die in your sins.
                      Is the reason I agree with all these points I'm being held back from this esteemed list?

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Protestantism is essentially a heresy
                        "Whatever you do to God's people, you do to God" - Mt 25:31

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by TruthSetsFree View Post
                          Protestantism is essentially a heresy
                          Heresy is just a big stick used to beat up people you disagree with.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Arthur Brain View Post
                            Yes you have concocted a list. Basically it's anyone who doesn't in whole ascribe to your theological line of thinking. Others have done the same tired thing and point the same accusing finger at others who don't agree with them. It's nowt new and neither are you in that regard...
                            It is not a list based on my theological way of thinking. If it was Calvinists and Pentecostals and open theists would be on the list. This list is based on basic Christianity. This is basic, first Sunday school class lesson type stuff. The idea that you can't understand the difference is quite puzzling for someone with "brain" in their name.

                            Where did I call you mean exactly? Please point out where else you're making stuff up dude.
                            It was implied. You are calling me divisive and such like. Or are you saying I'm a wonderfully nice and caring person for being divisive?

                            Oh, so I guess it's 'heresy' to not believe in an eternal hell as well is it? Most in the early church didn't go along with the dogma of eternal torment so if you're peddling that as 'truth' then you're just another zealot who likes the sound of his own voice and isn't happy unless he finds disagreement. Again - nowt new.
                            Of course there is real eternal hell. This is in the bible. Jesus said to fear him who had the power to throw both body and soul into hell and in revelation we read "the smoke of their torment went up day and night forever" and they "have no rest". People still exist who have no rest, not non-existent people. Of course, you could all God a liar.

                            But I would not claim you will go to hell for not believing in hell. I would say it explains a lot about your beliefs and about your view of God that you don't believe the bible. It explains why you and I are having this conversation.

                            And are you suggesting that people can't actually be 'saved' unless they read Paul's epistles or something regardless?
                            You would have no idea what the gospel was without Paul's letters, particularly Romans and Galatians. That is a fact. The reason people reject Paul's apostleship is for that very reason, as the salvation by grace without works is clearly taught by Paul and those who reject him would rather work for their salvation. To reject Paul is to reject free salvation without works. Just ask anyone on the list.

                            I'm not dogmatic choleric, that's kinda the point. You're a dime a dozen where it comes to what 'teaching error' consists of and like plenty others you're equally vehement that you have the truth and everyone from a contrary position doesn't. You're all tiresome frankly.
                            Well pray tell, tell us all what the gospel is then. Or are you afraid to stand for what you believe in? Do you believe anything enough to trouble yourself with telling someone, or is truth more "fluid" than that?

                            I believe what God says. It is appointed into man once to die and then face judgement. Life is not a negotiation, there are real consequences to whether or not a person is Born Again. Eternity is a long time to be wrong. People that teach the things those on the list teach are in danger of eternal torment and the people that believe that heresy are in the same danger.

                            This is not a game.

                            How ironic. You're the one intent on causing division because you're so egotistical as to presuppose you're the only one who has the 'truth'.
                            I don't "have" any truth. I simple repeat what I read. I believe what I read, and respond. That is what people do when they believe something, they tell others.

                            No, you wouldn't be 'all ears' choleric. You'll doubtless label me a heretic because I don't ascribe to an 'eternal hell' and you can get on with that frankly. It'll simply confirm that you're not interested in genuine debate on contentious issues but only intent on your own obsessive agenda if so.
                            I would love to have a civilized debate on eternal hell. I and yes, I am obsessed with truth and people getting saved. Paul warned against heresy because it was "another gospel" that would lead people astray. It is not the time to play nice.

                            I'm not interested in 'marking others' as heretics.
                            That is pretty obvious. Paul must have been having a bad day.

                            I'm strongly opposed to some of the 'teachings' I see on here, but I don't need to revert to pointless name calling and lists fuelled by nothing but ego.
                            So you are so opposed that you keep silent? Great plan.

                            Maybe I'll do a sudoku puzzle after submitting this....who knows?

                            Sudoku? You are a heretic!
                            Your issue is one of AUTHORITY. All heresy starts and ends where a person sets themselves above God's Word and becomes their own authority. It is disguised as "textual criticism" and "scholarship". All of it ends where the first lie began "Hath God Said?"

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              It is not a list based on my theological way of thinking. If it was Calvinists and Pentecostals and open theists would be on the list. This list is based on basic Christianity. This is basic, first Sunday school class lesson type stuff. The idea that you can't understand that is quite puzzling to someone with "brain" I'm their name.
                              So you believe that those who "actually" believe in the HOLY SPIRIT,and Operate in the gifts of the SPIRIT are heretics? Wow...So dead Christianity is better in your book,that the SPIRIT of the "LIVING" GOD? How interesting...

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by SeraphimsCherub View Post
                                So you believe that those who "actually" believe in the HOLY SPIRIT,and Operate in the gifts of the SPIRIT are heretics? Wow...So dead Christianity is better in your book,that the SPIRIT of the "LIVING" GOD? How interesting...
                                Did I say any of what you just said? Pentecostals are wrong because they ( generally) teach you have to be good enough to earn or keep salvation. That is error. We may disagree about the role of the Holy Spirit, but you aren't goin to go to hell over it. The list is for basic Christianity, not what born again Chriatians argue over.

                                If you think salvation has to be earned, or that Paul was a heretic, or that Jesus is not God, you are likely lost.
                                Your issue is one of AUTHORITY. All heresy starts and ends where a person sets themselves above God's Word and becomes their own authority. It is disguised as "textual criticism" and "scholarship". All of it ends where the first lie began "Hath God Said?"

                                Comment

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