Why would God need a hell?

[Mickiel]

Lets get back into some word. In John 12:47, again Jesus, "And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him NOT, for I come NOT to judge the world, but to save the world." Now right here Jesus reveals that unbelief cannot stop salvation! Any person that does not believe in God or accept Christ, Jesus teaches here that he is NOT judging them! Now believers in God will judge you to their hell for not accepting Christ, but Jesus did NOT teach that!

Jesus taught that he came here to save a world! Jesus said if they don't believe in him, he does NOT judge them; so what are you doing judging them for their unbelief?

 

[chrysostom]

In my view, if you have a need to follow someone, then that is what you are going to do. Because its a need. I think a believer in God should follow God, his Holy Spirit, and his word. I am not in to the following a human thingy. I personally don't trust that, and don't need that. But I understand that not everyone is cut that way, some people need the crutch of leaning on a pastor or leader, I personally think that is one of the reasons the church got so messed up in the first place; the blind leading the blind.

so why would Jesus build His church on a rock?

 

[Mickiel]

so why would Jesus build His church on a rock?

Well he had to; he came here to save humanity, not animals or nature. He had to build it on humans, and he had to teach them; and they had to teach others; that is how it got started. But its not how its going to end. God will raise up a church that is not led by humans, 1 John 2:27- they will be led by the Holy Spirit, not pastors or leaders, no human will teach them.

I think they will be quite something; no human meddling between them and God. No religious interference.

 

[Aimiel]

The Holy Spirit is The One Who reassures us that the Truth about hell is real.

 

[chrysostom]

The Holy Spirit is The One Who reassures us that the Truth about hell is real.

who is reassured?

 

[chrysostom]

I think they will be quite something; no human meddling between them and God. No religious interference.

so why would Jesus build His church on a rock?

 

[Mickiel]

The Holy Spirit is The One Who reassures us that the Truth about hell is real.

Well I understand that is what you believe; like I stated before, when you deceive church people, you have to use a church, the bible, Pastors, teachers, you must use " An image of the Holy Spirit", convince the believers that it is the Spirit leading them, or the deception will be useless. So I know you think the spirit has led you to see hell. I know that. And far be it from me to try and convince you other wise; I already know I cannot. I simply bear witness that I see hell as a major deception in this world.

 

[Mickiel]

so why would Jesus build His church on a rock?

Like I already answered you, he had to build it on humans, Peter was the " Rock" the bible was referring to, not some stone on the ground. The church is the human people.

I hope you are not thinking the bible was literal, and that Jesus built his church on a brick?

 

[chrysostom]

Like I already answered you, he had to build it on humans, Peter was the " Rock" the bible was referring to, not some stone on the ground. The church is the human people.

I hope you are not thinking the bible was literal, and that Jesus built his church on a brick?

Jesus changed simon's name to peter which means rock
so
His church is built on a man who was given the power to bind and loose

 

[Mickiel]

Jesus changed simon's name to peter which means rock
so
His church is built on a man who was given the power to bind and loose

Those times are over. The times of men leading the true church of God is over, in John 16:13 Jesus explains how this works, or will work after he is gone from the earth. One reason WHY the church of God is messed up now, is from years and years of leaders who had the power to bind the members, and loose all kinds of traditional mess into the church. Now we have a bunch of pew sitting church members who are addicted to the leadership; they are really just a big set of ears, listening to a big mouth preacher who has their minds in a bind.

 

[chrysostom]

Those times are over.

why?

now more than ever we need someone to clear up the confusion

someone with authority

 

[Mickiel]

why?

now more than ever we need someone to clear up the confusion

someone with authority

I disagree; men with authority caused the confusion. If you would be a student of the bible, show me where God sends a man during our times to clear up the confusion. Show me that. Nowhere in the bible does it reveal prophets or teachers of God coming out in our times; not true prophets; it only reveals that our time will be full of false prophets and teachers.

 

[Mickiel]

If you read the bible, show me a man leading the true church of God in our times. Show me any Apostles being called in the last days, or the days leading to the last days; show me. Show me any God appointed leaders in the Philadelphia era;

lets have the scriptures.

Matthew chapter 24 is where I think we are headed, and no church of God leader is given to that time.

 

[Mickiel]

The world has always been full of broken hearted people; sad people who never really knew what to believe. Notice God in Ps. 34:18, " The Lord is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and SAVES those who are of a contrite spirit."

God is saving people, he is not planning on a hell fire pot roast.

 

[serpentdove]

[God and evil] "The most biblically correct way to put this, is that God "had evil created", for his purpose. What many do not know, is that really Jesus did all the creating. Notice John 1:3, " ALL things were made by him (Christ, the Word), and without him was not anything made that was made."

God made all things good (Ge 1:31). He allows evil (that which is opposed to good) [Is 45:7]. There is not evil in him (1 Jn 1:5, Heb 4:15).

""Is 45:6, 7 — “I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create calamity; I, the LORD, do all these things.”

God is a lot “tougher” than we sometimes think. He does not lack the spine to act decisively, nor does He lack the power to bring order to a chaotic world. Never doubt His resolve or His strength." Stanley, C. F. (2005). The Charles F. Stanley life principles Bible: New King James Version (Is 45:6–7). Nashville, TN: Nelson Bibles.

 

[serpentdove]

...ALL have sinned, so he came for ALL.

He came for all (Jn 3:16). Not all choose him. The evils of pride include: hardens the mind (Dan. 5:20), produces spiritual decay (Hos. 7:9, 10), keeps from real progress (Prov. 26:12), hinders coming to God (Ps. 10:4), issues in self-deception (Jer. 49:16), makes men reject God’s Word (Jer. 43:2), leads to ruin (Prov. 16:18). Thomas Nelson Publishers. (1996). Nelson’s quick reference topical Bible index (p. 504). Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson Publishers.

 

[serpentdove]

...The second death, as clearly described in Rev. 20:14 is the first death being cast into the Lake of Fire; so notice, death is destroyed BEFORE the event in verse 15...

Punishment is eternal for all who reject God: everlasting fire (Matt. 25:41), everlasting punishment (Matt. 25:46), everlasting destruction (2 Thess. 1:9).

"Re 19:20 beast was captured, and … the false prophet. In an instant, the world’s armies are without their leaders. The beast is Antichrist (see note on 13:1–4); the false prophet is his religious cohort (see notes on 13:11–17). cast alive. The bodies of the beast and the false prophet will be transformed, and they will be banished directly to the lake of fire (Dan. 7:11)—the first of countless millions of unregenerate men (20:15) and fallen angels (cf. Matt. 25:41) to arrive in that dreadful place. That these two still appear there 1,000 years later (20:10) refutes the false doctrine of annihilationism (cf. 14:11; Is. 66:24; Matt. 25:41; Mark 9:48; Luke 3:17; 2 Thess. 1:9). lake of fire. The final hell, the place of eternal punishment for all unrepentant rebels, angelic or human (cf. 20:10, 15). The NT says much of eternal punishment (cf. 14:10, 11; Matt. 13:40–42; 25:41; Mark 9:43–48; Luke 3:17; 12:47, 48). fire … brimstone. See note on 9:17. These two are frequently associated with divine judgment (14:10; 20:10; 21:8; Gen. 19:24; Ps. 11:6; Is. 30:33; Ezek. 38:22; Luke 17:29)." MacArthur, J., Jr. (Ed.). (1997). The MacArthur Study Bible (electronic ed., p. 2020). Nashville, TN: Word Pub.

 

[Mickiel]

He came for all (Jn 3:16). Not all choose him. .

They don't need to choose him, he came to choose them; to call them. I have an announcement for all sinners and unbelievers, Jesus came here to choose you. Notice Jesus in Luke 5:32, " I came not to call the righteous, ( which means believers who choose him), but sinners to repentance!, ( meaning unbelievers who don't choose him). Jesus came to earth to call unbelievers and sinners.

Now, I'm telling you, certain believers in God are trying to block this free salvation, they don't want unbelievers to be called by Christ; they want only the believers to be called. They are seriously selfish with salvation. Don't let them frighten your mind.

 

[serpentdove]

"I think many believers in God just don't understand how God deals with evil; uses it like he does. Again Isaiah 45: 7, " I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace and create evil; I the Lord do all these things!" Now God does these things, uses these things in all kinds of situations, and its nothing a believer in God can do or say to alter this reality."

Vengeance belongs to the Lord's as: judgment upon sin (Jer. 11:20–23), right not to be taken by man (Ezek. 25:12–17; Heb. 10:30), set time (Jer. 46:9, 10). opcorn: Thomas Nelson Publishers. (1996). Nelson’s quick reference topical Bible index (p. 635). Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson Publishers.

" Is 45:7 I form light and I create darkness In Gen 1:3–4, God creates light and separates the darkness. This assertion indicates that the darkness, too, was God’s creation—it wasn’t just there to begin with. In the same way, God is described as creating both well-being and calamity." Barry, J. D., Heiser, M. S., Custis, M., Mangum, D., & Whitehead, M. M. (2012). Faithlife Study Bible (Is 45:7). Bellingham, WA: Logos Bible Software.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Its a good thing for us sinners, that you Christians are not in charge of salvation, because you would make humans to be the devils offspring, when they are the offspring of God. In Ps. 24:1, " The earth is the Lords and the fullness thereof; the world and they that dwell therein." The whole world belongs to God, and you Christians cannot transfer a child of God to be a child of the devil.

In Isaiah 66:9 God promises not to abort any of his children, so unbelievers are safe from the judgment of Christianity.

Can you find for me the place in the gospels where Jesus plainly says to His opponents "ye are of your father the devil and His lusts you do"