Time for IMJersusha to eat her hat

[musterion]

The Reformed insist on going beyond Paul's 'my Gospel' so they can mix it with works.

 

[Right Divider]

i personally haven't seen a MADist say or imply they are "capable" of wording the Gospel better than God. your accusations are baseless and conjured in your head. - :carryon:

Indeed, Nang is a blowhard, liar, deceiver, twister, etc. etc.

She uses every tactic, except the truth.

 

[Nang]

The Reformed insist on going beyond Paul's 'my Gospel' so they can mix it with works.

:madmad:

Prove it . . .

No Reformer ever teaches that salvation is obtained or maintained by actions or works of the sinner. None.

 

[musterion]

:madmad:

Prove it . . .

No Reformer ever teaches that salvation is obtained or maintained by actions or works of the sinner. None.

The doctrine of Lordship Salvation.

Biblically valid, or false?

 

[Nang]

The doctrine of Lordship Salvation.

Biblically valid, or false?

Justification comes by faith alone, and Sanctification produces the fruits of the Holy Spirit. Romans 1:16-17; Galatians 5:22-25

That is biblically valid Truth . . .

 

[musterion]

Do you even know what Lordship Salvation teaches, Nang?

 

[chrysostom]

:madmad:

Prove it . . .

No Reformer ever teaches that salvation is obtained or maintained by actions or works of the sinner. None.

what about love of neighbor?

is that considered work?

 

[Nang]

Do you even know what Lordship Salvation teaches, Nang?

I know what MacArthur teaches . . .

 

[musterion]

MacArthur isn't the only one, by any stretch.

So is Lordship Salvation biblically valid?

 

[Nang]

what about love of neighbor?

is that considered work?

Love of one's neighbor is a fruit of the indwelling Holy Spirit. It is sanctified evidence of justification.

However, even unsaved people can show love to their neighbors, and only God can read heart motives, for many religionists practice charity only to stay in the good graces of God. Such is works.

God the Judge knows who truly loves from the Spirit and regenerated heart, and who loves only to serve themselves.

 

[Nang]

MacArthur isn't the only one, by any stretch.

So is Lordship Salvation biblically valid?

Lordship Salvation promotes a synergistic sanctification, which I, and most solid Reformers reject.

I do not consider MacArthur to be genuinely Reformed; nor do I think he and his ideas reflect the historical Reformed fathers.

A quote from Martin Luther:

“Faith alone justifies, but not the faith that is alone.” “Works,” Luther said, “are not taken into consideration when the ques*tion respects justification. But true faith will no more fail to produce them than the sun can cease to give light.”

Why?

Because of the indwelling Holy Spirit in every regenerated believer.

Sanctification and bearing the fruits of God, are as monergistic as justification, calling, drawing, regenerating, converting, preserving, and bringing the sons to glory in Jesus Christ.

 

[Nang]

The opposite of Lordship Salvation, is "easy believism" which you MADists practice, which proves to be total lawlessness.

 

[musterion]

If I recall correctly, Sproul and Piper believe in it and teach it.

Do you reject them on that point?

 

[musterion]

"Endurance in faith is a condition for future salvation. Only those who endure in faith will be saved for eternity."

That's Lordship Salvation in a nutshell: the work of enduring in the faith, as evidenced by works including the work of persevering, proves one is elect and thus will be saved in the end.

Know who said it?

I bet you do before you even click the link.

 

[Nang]

If I recall correctly, Sproul and Piper believe in it and teach it.

Do you reject them on that point?

I consider both Sproul and Piper to be neo-calvinists; who somewhat differ theologically from historical and staunch Reformers.

I do not "reject" them, for they do not proclaim a false gospel . . but I DO reject MAD teachings for claiming there is more than the One True Gospel of Jesus Christ.

 

[musterion]

So do you repudiate Sproul's position on L.S.?

 

[musterion]

Or how about this guy, going a bit further back in Calvinistic history?

"There is a deadly and damnable heresy being widely propagated today to the effect that, if a sinner truly accepts Christ as his personal Saviour, no matter how he lives afterwards, he cannot perish. That is a satanic lie, for it is at direct variance with the teaching of the Word of truth. Something more than believing in Christ is necessary to ensure the soul's reaching heaven."

 

[Nang]

"Endurance in faith is a condition for future salvation. Only those who endure in faith will be saved for eternity."

This is synergistic Sanctification, which I disagree with.

Faith is not a required condition to endure. The Holy Spirit is the guarantee of the Christian enduring to the end. Ephesians 1:13-14; II Corinthians 5:5

 

[musterion]

Or this guy, going even further back?

"The only evidence of election is effectual calling, that is, the production of holiness. And the only evidence of the genuineness of this call and the certainty of our perseverance, is a patient continuance in well-doing."

"Well-doing" = good works.

 

[Nang]

Or how about this guy, going a bit further back in Calvinistic history?

The "something more" would be genuine sanctification by the Holy Spirit.

John 15:1-8