The Trinity

[God's Truth]

Are you still arguing that women should have long hair to cover their bodies because otherwise it sexually tempts the angels? Or did you amend that? I'm not sure where you are anymore.

We have moved on back to the topic of the thread. You will have to figure it out and search.

 

[Bright Raven]

What is God's essence?

Let me make it simple for you. From Dictionary.com

the basic, real, and invariable nature of a thing or its significant individual feature or features:

 

[God's Truth]

Let me make it simple for you. From Dictionary.com

the basic, real, and invariable nature of a thing or its significant individual feature or features:

Is the essence light? Spirit? Something else?

 

[Bright Raven]

Is the essence light? Spirit? Something else?

You really are stupid aren't you.

 

[marhig]

Marhig, even that passage you chose there is part of a set that shows equivalence. See Isaiah 45:23, Romans 14:11, and Philippians 2:10 individually and together. It's written inside and out.

Part 1, Isaiah

Isaiah 45:22-23 KJV
(22) Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
(23) I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

Question for Marhig, whom are we told to look to to be saved? When Moses raised the serpent upon the pole, whom did that serpent represent? This was Jesus, as in John 12:32, "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me." We are told to look upon Jesus and be saved. Jesus was lifted up, and not another. Regardless, remember that the subject of Isaiah 45:23 is God, that "unto me [God] every knee shall bow."

Part 2, Romans

Romans 14:10-12 KJV
(10) But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
(11) For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
(12) So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

Question for Marhig, to whom do we give account of ourselves? Jesus is the judge of the quick and the dead, and we stand before the judgment seat of Christ. Paul says we thus give account to God. We are judged by Jesus, we are not judged by the Father, yet it says we give account of ourselves to God. And by the way, note that "God" from the Old Testament is here now "saith the Lord." He's quoting Isaiah and he considers "God" and "the Lord" to be the same.

Part 3, Philippians

Philippians 2:10-11 KJV
(10) That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;
(11) And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Question for Marhig, did Paul make up something new, or is he quoting that passage in Isaiah again? The same passage that in the Old Testament where "God says unto me every knee shall bow" in Romans Paul interprets it as "the Lord saith unto me every knee shall bow" and in Philippiansthis same Paul understands that this is interchangeable with "unto Jesus every knee shall bow."

Marhig, I don't think Paul was a careless or uneducated writer. Yet he uses "God" and "Lord" and "Jesus" interchangeably when quoting the same Old Testament passage. People understand Jesus as their God because they read these scriptures.




And why not Marhig? In the aforementiond Isaiah 45:23 (and Jeremiah 22:5) God says that he swears by himself. He even refers to himself in the third person in passages like this in Zechariah:

Zechariah 3:2 KJV
(2) And the LORD said unto Satan, The LORD rebuke thee, O Satan; even the LORD that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?

Even with my limited mortal self I will talk to myself: I think thoughts in my head and come up with answers, I send myself emails or write myself notes as reminders, and I don't have anything as complicated as being God and incarnate in flesh at the same time like God did. Your incredulous question isn't a valid evidence, actual bible statements are valid evidences.




How does he "live by his will and not by his own will?" Your statement is a contradiction. Regardless, Jesus lived by his Father's will, which is what you would expect if that were his true identity. I have multiple conflicting wills in myself (and Paul states the same in other scripture) yet we yield to our true selves. We are dealing with terms of expression. If Jesus lived by his own will and against his Father's will, then you would have a case saying that Jesus was not God. Not the other way around Marhig.



See all the above. If Jesus exercised will contrary to the Father, then he would not be God. If he could do things apart from the Father or against the Father, then he would not be God. And of course the Father is greater than he, just like my hand would defer to my head. They are both me, both ultimately the same person.



Jesus is the living God, which is why he drops the subtle approach entirely by the time we reach the book of Revelation. "I am the beginning and the end" he says. If you don't know the significance of that title, read the book of Isaiah. Word search that phrase, you'll find it.

What you don't seem to see, is that everything Jesus has, has been given to him from the father. He has been given authority over the heavens and the earth by the father, he is set at the father's right hand, by the father. He was given power over all flesh from the father, and the father has a handed judgment to the son. But it all comes from the father of lights, the living God. Without whom Christ could do nothing.

So it's not that Jesus is the father, but rather that the father has put Christ Jesus over everything. And the only way to the father is through him. He is the way, the truth and the life, and his way is the only way.

Jesus isn't God rosenritter. I've quoted many verses that show this clearly, and I've got many more if you wish to see them. And I believe in what is written in the Bible, and it clearly shows us, plainly, that not only is Jesus not God, but that God is also his God and father.

I'm sorry but that's what I can see clearly from the words of the book, everything you have quoted shows to me that God was in Christ, not that Christ is God.

There is only one Almighty God, and that's the father.

There is also this verse in Philippians about God exalting Jesus

Philippians 2:9

Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

And there's this regarding Jesus judging

John 5

Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man

Everything comes from the father. And everything that the son has is given to him from the father. And we are judged by the word of God through Christ. His words are Spirit and they are life!

 

[God's Truth]

You really are stupid aren't you.

Not when it comes to God's Truth.

 

[God's Truth]

What you don't seem to see, is that everything Jesus has, has been given to him from the father. He has been given authority over the heavens and the earth by the father, he is set at the father's right hand, by the father. He was given power over all flesh from the father, and the father has a handed judgment to the son. But it all comes from the father of lights, the living God. Without whom Christ could do nothing.

So it's not that Jesus is the father, but rather that the father has put Christ Jesus over everything. And the only way to the father is through him. He is the way, the truth and the life, and his way is the only way.

Jesus isn't God rosenritter. I've quoted many verses that show this clearly, and I've got many more if you wish to see them. And I believe in what is written in the Bible, and it clearly shows us, plainly, that not only is Jesus not God, but that God is also his God and father.

I'm sorry but that's what I can see clearly from the words of the book, everything you have quoted shows to me that God was in Christ, not that Christ is God.

There is only one Almighty God, and that's the father.

There is also this verse in Philippians about God exalting Jesus

Philippians 2:9

Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

And there's this regarding Jesus judging

John 5

Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man

Everything comes from the father. And everything that the son has is given to him from the father. And we are judged by the word of God through Christ. His words are Spirit and they are life!

I see what you are saying, but can you tell me exactly what you do believe about Jesus? Are you a trinitarian?

If yes, the trinity doctrine makes the three an entity and only together as a family they call this family God.

Is that what you believe?

 

[popsthebuilder]

I see what you are saying, but can you tell me exactly what you do believe about Jesus? Are you a trinitarian?

If yes, the trinity doctrine makes the three an entity and only together as a family they call this family God.

Is that what you believe?

She said exactly what she believes.

She is not a traditional Trinitarian, you know that.

peace

 

[God's Truth]

She said exactly what she believes.

She is not a traditional Trinitarian, you know that.

peace

I do not know that. I rarely read what other people say in a thread if it is not directed to me. I especially do not read long posts that are not to me. Marhig has not been here long and I don't know exactly what she believes. Don't be contentious. I haven't done anything wrong. I am trying to discuss more deeply with another member. What are you doing?

 

[popsthebuilder]

I do not know that. I rarely read what other people say in a thread if it is not directed to me. I especially do not read long posts that are not to me. Marhig has not been here long and I don't know exactly what she believes. Don't be contentious. I haven't done anything wrong. I am trying to discuss more deeply with another member. What are you doing?

I'm not trying to be contentious.

I'm just saying that you know we'll what she believes as she has made it very clear for all.

I didn't say you were doing anything wrong.

She will answer you, then we can go from there.

Me? What am I doing?

Trying to iron out needless wrinkles and bring like minds into conformity of the One Spirit that we are to all be perceptive to and abide by.

That's all.

No alterior motive, I assure you friend.

peace

 

[marhig]

I see what you are saying, but can you tell me exactly what you do believe about Jesus? Are you a trinitarian?

If yes, the trinity doctrine makes the three an entity and only together as a family they call this family God.

Is that what you believe?

GT I'm sure that I have told you before that I don't believe in the trinity, how can I believe in the trinity if I don't believe that Jesus is God?

So no, I don't believe in a triune God, I believe in one God, and he's the father, and Jesus is the Christ the beloved son of the living God.

 

[God's Truth]

GT I'm sure that I have told you before that I don't believe in the trinity, how can I believe in the trinity if I don't believe that Jesus is God?

So no, I don't believe in a triune God, I believe in one God, and he's the father, and Jesus is the Christ the beloved son of the living God.

Excuse me for not debating you on this topic much. I really don't know what you believe. You say you don't believe in a three God, so then, you are bowing to someone (Jesus) who is not God?

How can you bow to someone who is not God?

 

[God's Truth]

I'm not trying to be contentious.

I'm just saying that you know we'll what she believes as she has made it very clear for all.

I didn't say you were doing anything wrong.

She will answer you, then we can go from there.

Me? What am I doing?

Trying to iron out needless wrinkles and bring like minds into conformity of the One Spirit that we are to all be perceptive to and abide by.

That's all.

No alterior motive, I assure you friend.

peace

Try not judging me and saying things like I know what Marhig believes.

You are setting up a hostile environment.

Please back off.

 

[marhig]

Excuse me for not debating you on this topic much. I really don't know what you believe. You say you don't believe in a three God, so then, you are bowing to someone (Jesus) who is not God?

How can you bow to someone who is not God?

I just thought you knew that by now, as I've said it quite a bit, and I know what you believe

I bow the knee to Jesus by becoming humble and obeying his teachings and living by they will of God, and God has put him in a place of worship. But I worship the father in spirit and in truth, as Jesus taught us to.

 

[God's Truth]

I just thought you knew that by now, as I've said it quite a bit, and I know what you believe

No, I don't really know what you believe. Why are you and pops speaking as if you are one? Are you two married? My asking you questions should not be met with pops trying to slander me. What do you mean by saying "I just thought"? You haven't said anything yet about what I asked you, only pops did.

I bow the knee to Jesus by becoming humble and obeying his teachings and living by they will of God, and God has put him in a place of worship. But I worship the father in spirit and in truth, as Jesus taught us to.

Thank you for explaining that you bow to Jesus. Thank you too for explaining that you do NOT believe Jesus is God.

Do you believe the scriptures that say no one is to bow to anyone but God?

Why are you bowing to Jesus if he is not God?

 

[popsthebuilder]

I most certainly am not setting up any hostile anything or judging in any way.

Try not judging me and saying things like I know what Marhig believes.

You are setting up a hostile environment.

Please back off.

I most certainly am not setting up any hostile anything or judging in any way.

If you haven't noticed I have backed off as it is not my intent to cause strife of contention.

You know this well too.

peace

Is that me judging? If so then how?

 

[marhig]

No, I don't really know what you believe. Why are you and pops speaking as if you are one? Are you two married? My asking you should not be met with pops trying to slander me.



Thank you for explaining that you bow to Jesus. Thank you too for explaining that you do NOT believe Jesus is God.

Do you believe the scriptures that say no one is to bow to anyone but God?

Well, there is this verse in Revelation, what do you think about it?

Revelation 3

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

 

[God's Truth]

I most certainly am not setting up any hostile anything or judging in any way.

I most certainly am not setting up any hostile anything or judging in any way.

If you haven't noticed I have backed off as it is not my intent to cause strife of contention.

You know this well too.

peace

Is that me judging? If so then how?

You came on here telling me what I know. You don't know what I know.

I am not the bad person you are trying to make me out to be.

 

[marhig]

No, I don't really know what you believe. Why are you and pops speaking as if you are one? Are you two married? My asking you questions should not be met with pops trying to slander me. What do you mean by saying "I just thought"? You haven't said anything yet about what I asked you, only pops did.



Thank you for explaining that you bow to Jesus. Thank you too for explaining that you do NOT believe Jesus is God.

Do you believe the scriptures that say no one is to bow to anyone but God?

Why are you bowing to Jesus if he is not God?

By the way, I don't think that pops is trying to slander you, I think that he only thought that by now you'd know what I believe, as I have said it a lot. But maybe you haven't seen what I've said.

 

[God's Truth]

Well, there is this verse in Revelation, what do you think about it?

Revelation 3

Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

I believe Jesus is God. That is why I bow to Jesus.

Please just answer the question I asked.

We are NOT to bow to anyone but God.

So how is it that you bow to Jesus even though we are told to ONLY BOW TO GOD?