The Late Great Urantia Revelation

[freelight]

In addition....

In addition....

Moses was far advanced in intelligence and enlightenment relative to his nomadic followers, so he needed the fiery eruptions of Sinai to aw and instill fear into the superstitious people. Yahweh was the name of the nature God of Sinai, it stuck with the Israelites.

Oh yes,....a historical study of the early Hebrews is interesting indeed, all the way to a mythicist view of Moses, as a few scholars challenge if there ever was a real historical person named 'Moses',....but that's another subject.

Also how the Hebrews were at times polytheists and in some phases henotheists,...again...a matter of more study. - I've been looking into a more skeptical/agnostic viewpoint currently. The UB however appears to conclude that Moses was an actual historical figure, based on the human knowledge records however already existing from which the revelators drew from. Therefore I think you'd agree Caino, that the UB does not accept or agree with a mythicist view of some of the more important biblical figures, and certainly not of Jesus, since it wholly proclaims the truth that Jesus is 'Michael of Nebadon', and did indeed incarnate (bestow himself) living a human life upon which the gospels attempt to give some narrative. So, the UB is pretty fundamentalist on that point, holding to the historicity of Moses and particularly Jesus (Christ-Michael). Thoughts?

Threats of hell and the lake of fire, curses, bugs and plagues are all the same sort of fear inspiring teachings that appeal to more ignorant types of people who frankly need a God to be afraid of.

Yes,....since the 'God' revealed by Jesus is the all-merciful Father, who sheds his love/light upon all people (good and evil)...there is no need whatsoever to fear 'God'....or threaten souls with everlasting torment in a lake of fire, since such antics are unbecoming of LOVE, let alone antithetical to the divine will. Naturally those committed to 'God' honor, respect, revere, value and worship 'God'....again 'naturally',...since the divine nature has those qualities and attributes.



pj

 

[Bright Raven]

Scriptural? Don't think so.

 

[freelight]

Religious writings.....plenty to explore.....

Religious writings.....plenty to explore.....

Scriptural? Don't think so.

No one is claiming thats a 'criteria' for anything. The points addressed are the subject(s) at hand, if you'd like to engage in a creative dialogue on such matters. 'Scriptural' is just a word...just as arbitrary as the term 'biblical',...and just as vague depending on the meaning and context




pj

 

[Bright Raven]

No one is claiming that's a 'criteria' for anything. The points addressed are the subject(s) at hand, if you'd like to engage in a creative dialogue on such matters. 'Scriptural' is just a word...just as arbitrary as the term 'biblical',...and just as vague depending on the meaning and context




pj

Scripture is the word friend.


Matthew 24:35 New King James Version (NKJV)

35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away.

 

[journey]

Maybe three people on TOL view the ub to be much more than a comic book for a UFO cult. That should be enough said.

 

[freelight]

Scripture is the word friend.


Matthew 24:35 New King James Version (NKJV)

35 Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away.

Can you prove we have all the words ever spoken by Jesus beyond just a 'belief' that we do? Can you prove the Bible is the perfect, inerrant, infallible, complete and FINAL 'word of god',...and nothing else can be revealed (basically annulling 'progressive revelation'). I don't think you can...since it all comes down to 'faith' that such is so.

The Infinite has extended its all-pervading presence thru-out all space and time,....hence no one book can ever contain the totality of the revelation of 'God'. The UB itself has plenty to say upon the subject.



pj

 

[Bright Raven]

Can you prove we have all the words ever spoken by Jesus beyond just a 'belief' that we do? Can you prove the Bible is the perfect, inerrant, infallible, complete and FINAL 'word of god',...and nothing else can be revealed (basically annulling 'progressive revelation'). I don't think you can...since it all comes down to 'faith' that such is so.

The Infinite has extended its all-pervading presence thru-out all space and time,....hence no one book can ever contain the totality of the revelation of 'God'. The UB itself has plenty to say upon the subject.



pj

It is but you don't believe it.

 

[freelight]

Maybe three people on TOL view the ub to be much more than a comic book for a UFO cult. That should be enough said.

The UB just like any other text is open to speculation, research and study,....the terms, information, meanings and values shared within its 'revelation' relates information according to those terms,...so that you're estimation of such, being ignorant of the contents, cannot go very far to substantiate anything really. So you're opinion is near vacuous, as we've noted in our past discussions. You have nothing, but condenscension.

The Bible can be assumed as a hodge-podge of myth, religious fiction, mixed in with some historical facts and information, and various writers own visions, proclivities, imaginations, opinions, etc. If you'd like to compare 'story-books',...there is not much of a difference in magnitude or scope of incredible claims, miracles and the like, when putting the UB alongside the Bible. It takes just as much faith to believe in either record really, beyond anything historically significant that can be proven, since all else is a matter of personal religious experience, faith and subjective reasoning.



pj

 

[freelight]

points................

points................

It is but you don't believe it.

Your proof is "because I say so" :idunno:

As far as what I 'believe',..that can vary on many factors, some conditional.

I can remain just as skeptical and open concerning the UB, the Bible, or any other religious book...and change my mind or opinion on anything as I get more accurate or significant information in my research. Such is the positive attitude of a religious agnostic as far as epistemology is concernred, while my more romantic leanings are spiritualistic and gnostic in nature, because I do recognize the place of 'faith' and personal 'religious experience' in all this. In this sense, I've always been a relentless 'gnostic', but my more skeptical side does venture into 'agnostic' territory on some things. Such is a beautiful paradox IMO. Or as Miguel Conner often says...."we gnostics write our own gospels and live our own myths"

The reality of 'God', or reality itself....is omnipresent, prior to space or time, ever at hand. The "I" of consciousness is the very "eye" of 'God'.....the very "I" in every conscious being....the primal awareness that allows all things to be, and be-come.

From a UB perspective this pre-personal fragment of 'God' indwelling the soul is called the 'thought-adjuster', or 'spirit-monitor'...it is the 'Father-fragment', the essence of 'God' or 'infinity' within every conscious being of normal mind-capacity and potential. All these subjects have been explored here, one can use the 'search thread' feature to find specific subjects.



pj

 

[freelight]

It was natural that the Jewish converts to the Jesus movment wanted Jesus to be their Messiah.

Yes, and the UB records that Jesus went along with this to an extent in his ministry according to wisdom and his divine purpose although his real mission included something far greater and a bit different on a cosmic-scale than their more narrow nationalistic concept and expectation of their 'Messiah' according to scripture and tradition.




pj

 

[Aimiel]

That is your opinion placed upon a limited 66 'booked' canon.

It's God's Word and myself and several million other Christians take Him at His Word, since He hasn't told any lies yet. The same cannot be said for your god: Jebus, who is the false god described in Urantia.

Religious writings indeed can be inspired more or less by the Spirit of God...

The Holy Bible was inspired by God.

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

Your Urantia came from channeling evil spirits.

'God' is the universal reality in all, thru all, and transcending all.

While God did create everything and is above everything, He isn't 'in' everything. He isn't in you. He isn't in Urantia. He isn't in your other false religions, either. He is in The Holy Bible. It was designed as a roadmap to find Him and come into a dynamic relationship with Him.

But the lake of fire metaphor is only used in the book of Revelation (while some concepts of 'everlasting fire or destruction are elsewhere), a book mind you that many rejected and were hesistant in even adding into the canon, until it was inserted finally at the end.

God inspired the words, just as He did for the other 65 books by the 43 other authors of The Holy Scriptures. He doesn't make mistakes.

We've already covered problems with ECT (eternal conscious torment) in a lake of fire...

Yes, you've dismissed ALL sound doctrine. You've dismissed ALL Truth. You need to realize that Truth doesn't go away just because you swallow deception regarding It's Truth-fullness.

...and we note that the words 'gehenna', 'hades', 'sheol', 'tartarus' were translated into the English word 'hell',...but these have different meanings or designations...

Re-defining words doesn't make the simplest of Truths vaporize.

...AND....there is no reason to assume that the lake of fire is to be identified as 'hell'.

I don't. The spirit named, "Hell," is cast into the Lake of Fire to be tormented along with the spirit of, "Death," Satan and every single rebellious angel. You need to stop rebelling against Truth and Right and believe God's Holy Word. It is the One and Only Truth there is.

 

[Puppet]

It's God's Word and myself and several million other Christians take Him at His Word, since He hasn't told any lies yet. The same cannot be said for your god: Jebus, who is the false god described in Urantia.The Holy Bible was inspired by God.

For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

Your Urantia came from channeling evil spirits. While God did create everything and is above everything, He isn't 'in' everything. He isn't in you. He isn't in Urantia. He isn't in your other false religions, either. He is in The Holy Bible. It was designed as a roadmap to find Him and come into a dynamic relationship with Him. God inspired the words, just as He did for the other 65 books by the 43 other authors of The Holy Scriptures. He doesn't make mistakes. Yes, you've dismissed ALL sound doctrine. You've dismissed ALL Truth. You need to realize that Truth doesn't go away just because you swallow deception regarding It's Truth-fullness.Re-defining words doesn't make the simplest of Truths vaporize.I don't. The spirit named, "Hell," is cast into the Lake of Fire to be tormented along with the spirit of, "Death," Satan and every single rebellious angel. You need to stop rebelling against Truth and Right and believe God's Holy Word. It is the One and Only Truth there is.

What's that one book that isn't indpired by God? You said 65 books and I said 66 books. What is the missing book I see here?

 

[freelight]

The 'God' within..............

The 'God' within..............

Your Urantia came from channeling evil spirits.

Can you provide proof beyond "because I say so"?

While God did create everything and is above everything, He isn't 'in' everything. He isn't in you. He isn't in Urantia. He isn't in your other false religions, either. He is in The Holy Bible.

That's a matter of point of view, but 'God' is the First Source and Center of All that IS. 'God' is omnipresent. 'God' is Spirit.

1:2.8 Those who know God have experienced the fact of his presence; such God-knowing mortals hold in their personal experience the only positive proof of the existence of the living God which one human being can offer to another. The existence of God is utterly beyond all possibility of demonstration except for the contact between the God-consciousness of the human mind and the God-presence of the Thought Adjuster that indwells the mortal intellect and is bestowed upon man as the free gift of the Universal Father.

Further expounding on the indwelling 'thought-adjuster' -

1:4.1 The infinity of the perfection of God is such that it eternally constitutes him mystery. And the greatest of all the unfathomable mysteries of God is the phenomenon of the divine indwelling of mortal minds. The manner in which the Universal Father sojourns with the creatures of time is the most profound of all universe mysteries; the divine presence in the mind of man is the mystery of mysteries.

1:4.2 The physical bodies of mortals are “the temples of God.” Notwithstanding that the Sovereign Creator Sons come near the creatures of their inhabited worlds and “draw all men to themselves”; though they “stand at the door” of consciousness “and knock” and delight to come in to all who will “open the doors of their hearts”; although there does exist this intimate personal communion between the Creator Sons and their mortal creatures, nevertheless, mortal men have something from God himself which actually dwells within them; their bodies are the temples thereof.

1:4.3 When you are through down here, when your course has been run in temporary form on earth, when your trial trip in the flesh is finished, when the dust that composes the mortal tabernacle “returns to the earth whence it came”; then, it is revealed, the indwelling “Spirit shall return to God who gave it.” There sojourns within each moral being of this planet a fragment of God, a part and parcel of divinity. It is not yet yours by right of possession, but it is designedly intended to be one with you if you survive the mortal existence.

~*~*~

You need to stop rebelling against Truth and Right and believe God's Holy Word. It is the One and Only Truth there is.

There is no rebellion against reality going on here, but an abiding awareness, a state of 'being',....that does not change, but observes the phenomena of change. Points of view, beliefs, opinions, assumptions....are subject to change. The pure awareness at the heart of all existence, ever abides, being pure, silent, all luminous.



pj

 

[journey]

I think of one word when I read any quote from the ub: BALONEY!

 

[freelight]

theres more................

theres more................

I think of one word when I read any quote from the ub: BALONEY!

1:2.7 The existence of God can never be proved by scientific experiment or by the pure reason of logical deduction. God can be realized only in the realms of human experience; nevertheless, the true concept of the reality of God is reasonable to logic, plausible to philosophy, essential to religion and indispensable to any hope of personality survival.

1:2.8 Those who know God have experienced the fact of his presence; such God-knowing mortals hold in their personal experience the only positive proof of the existence of the living God which one human being can offer to another. The existence of God is utterly beyond all possibility of demonstration except for the contact between the God-consciousness of the human mind and the God-presence of the Thought Adjuster that indwells the mortal intellect and is bestowed upon man as the free gift of the Universal Father.

I'd say there are many wonderful and impressive truths, values and principles revealed in the papers,....just like in other religious books and traditions. But you have to have willingness and courage to search out the best books, revelations and truth-sources to find out for yourself what spiritual gems and intellectual treasures lie within certain texts, to taste them for yourself, .....otherwise you just have 'here-say', 'presumption' and uninformed opinions.

The concept of the 'thought-adjuster' is a mystery and grace most humbling to realize,...that an actual fragment of God, of infinity indwells my own mind....and I can further merge with that divine presence to effect a transformation of 'being' where my personality and the 'though-adjuster' become one,...and are wedded forever, at that point of 'fusion', when one qualifies for 'eternal survival', and puts on immortality. That's just the tip of the iceberg.



pj

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I think of one word when I read any quote from the ub: BALONEY!

That's a good word. It applies perfectly, I like it.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I'd say there are many ignorant and false, goofs revealed in the Urantia funny papers,....just like in other nutty books and magazines. But you have to have the mind of an Orangutan in order to search out the best parts. To find out for yourself if you're dumb enough to understand this non-sense and have the ability to lie to yourself without noticing it. This in turn will create within your skull a vacuum which cannot contain any grey matter. Within yourself lies a huge amount of dormant negativity otherwise, you just maintain a cranium that obstructs relevant criteria that suppresses the ID. Such an obstruction will ultimately cause unfettered and ultra-conscientiousness within your obtrusive psyche.


The concept of the malevolent thought processes can possibly immobilize your ability to maintain:
mega-subversive reality abstractions. This, in and of itself releases sub-human insurgency, combined
with obsessive reportorial intrusion on a lower level of combined and obsessive reportorial intrusion on
a lower level of obtainable reflex criteria!




pj

Changed it for ya, so the folks can easily understand your point!

 

[Aimiel]

Can you provide proof beyond "because I say so"?

My word is certainly more reliable than the demon who spoke of Urantia. It's obvious nonsense.

That's a matter of point of view, but 'God' is the First Source and Center of All that IS. 'God' is omnipresent. 'God' is Spirit.

God is not the center of evil.

Further expounding on the indwelling 'thought-adjuster' -

The Holy Spirit doesn't adjust thoughts... He gives us a clean heart, renews a right spirit in us and gives us The Mind of Christ.

There is no rebellion against reality going on here, but an abiding awareness, a state of 'being',....that does not change, but observes the phenomena of change. Points of view, beliefs, opinions, assumptions....are subject to change. The pure awareness at the heart of all existence, ever abides, being pure, silent, all luminous.

:blabla:

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Freelight,

Too bad you're on the wrong side of truth! You're articulate, intelligent, and a
Wordsmith. However, it's all wasted. Intelligence and an ability to articulate
one's thoughts, doesn't equal common sense, discernment, and a willingness
to be open to Spiritual truth. You're lost, and you don't even know it.

 

[freelight]

clarifying our terms..........

clarifying our terms..........

God is not the center of evil.

The UB certainly doesn't teach your false assumption which is convoluted. 'God' alone is the essence of all that is good, its very source. Your presupposition is erroroneous.

The Holy Spirit doesn't adjust thoughts... He gives us a clean heart, renews a right spirit in us and gives us The Mind of Christ

'Thought-adjuster' (TA) is just the main term given to the indwelling presence of God in one's mind, - it is not necessarily to be taken 'technically', but the spirit of God in one's soul does lead, guide and teach, and this 'process' does obviously include 'coordinating', 'adjusting', 'relating' the thought-processes of the mind in the proper direction as one co-operates with 'God', in the arena of choice-making, etc. I wouldn't get too caught up in the terminology there,....as the TA is also called 'spirit-monitor', 'father-fragment', etc. The term is kinda 'peculiar'...but thats what the revelators provided. Its a 'pre-personal' spirit-fragment of 'God the Father' that indwells the mind of mortals. As a soul chooses eternal life (eternal surivival)...it then fuses with the personality of the mortal and they become one, then this soul becomes 'immortal' by way of such a fusion.

For souls that do not choose life, and choose death, the soul dies (is disintegrated)...and the TA goes back to 'God'.

~*~*~


The origin and nature of thought-adjusters



pj