but that is not our primary claim
which is
Jesus, the only Son of God, suffered and died
so
we might be saved
The Late Great Urantia Revelation
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but that is not our primary claim
which is
Jesus, the only Son of God, suffered and died
so
we might be saved
A fragment of God (the rock) lives within each of us, the spirit knows exactly why I think what I think, he knows my motives, my faith and my sincerity. I stand ready to be judged at any time. My only fear of the Father, who us love, is becoming decidedly separated from him.
My faith trust is in the goodness of God.
Hi Chrysostom, I understand that, and that is your faith, it is sacred to you.
My faith is in the "good news" gospel, taught, preached and lived by Jesus long before religious authority unjustly arrested, unjustly tried, and outrageously murdered the body of the incarnate Son [who voluntarily laid down his life and took it up again as proof of his authority as creator], proof of life after death, and benefiting all humanity as the "spirit of truth" gift was then pored out upon all flesh as promised when he returned to his right place as ruler in heaven.
As if the tragedy of the rejection of the Son by his people wasn't bad enough, the original gospel then fell into the hands of the pre-existing Pagan theologians of the Gentile world where his death was understood through the lens of their atonement mythology.
The religion OF Jesus was unintentionally replaced by a religion ABOUT Jesus. The fact of his triumphant and inspiring life [living Gods will] was then replaced by a story about death as a human sacrifice, an idea completely foreign to the original "good news."
what is this atonement mythology?
The various religious beliefs of the Greko-Roman world, the Persians or Mesopotamians etc all contained beliefs about deities descending to earth submitting to sacrifice to bring about redemption of the human race; to atone for sins. They performed the ritualistic drinking of blood and eating of flesh. The beliefs and practices predate Jesus.
Christianity is a comingled marriage of sorts between the facts of Jesus' life blended with a pre-existing theological world view.
Jesus taught salvation by faith and the subsequent and ongoing, growing, personal transformation.
God doesn’t change, he has always been forgiving, and the substitute of an innocent man was never needed. That’s a human idea, not divine.
what would make them believe such things?
Still making an effort to sell your "rotten baloney" my friend?
You're not much of a salesman, you haven't sold any of that
garbage, yet! How about that? Never say die! Keep up the
quest, no matter the odds! Full speed ahead!
Jesus had the same issue, a scant few believed his truth, it's not our problem, the spirit does its own work. Everyone is called, few choose.
"The true believer does not grow weary in well-doing just because he is thwarted."
The Urantia Book, (1740.8) 156:5.21
Now, you consider yourself a victim? Again, funny stuff!
Yeah Caino, you're a real "martyr for your cause!'
Moses the reformer was able to establish the practice of substituting animals for human sacrifice.
The UB explains it in detail here: http://www.urantia.org/urantia-book-standardized/paper-89-sin-sacrifice-and-atonement?term=atonement#search-jump-result-0
What does the urantia book have to say about Superman, and
his problem with "Kryptonite?"
I don't see myself as a martyr, disciples of Jesus have had to deal with hecklers and trolls like you from the beginning, they endured much worse abuse.
If you knew the truth you would abandon this childishness and be grateful that you heard the message of the UB sent to earth by Christ at this critical juncture in history. We are at the beginning of a new dispensation of grace and truth.
"(1999.2) 186:2.2 Before the Sanhedrist court Jesus declined to make replies to the testimony of perjured witnesses. There was but one question which would always elicit an answer, whether asked by friend or foe, and that was the one concerning the nature and divinity of his mission on earth. When asked if he were the Son of God, he unfailingly made reply. He steadfastly refused to speak when in the presence of the curious and wicked Herod. Before Pilate he spoke only when he thought that Pilate or some other sincere person might be helped to a better knowledge of the truth by what he said. Jesus had taught his apostles the uselessness of casting their pearls before swine, and he now dared to practice what he had taught. His conduct at this time exemplified the patient submission of the human nature coupled with the majestic silence and solemn dignity of the divine nature. He was altogether willing to discuss with Pilate any question related to the political charges brought against him — any question which he recognized as belonging to the governor’s jurisdiction."
I'll take my chances with the truth!
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
Divine truth and beauty...............
Divine truth and beauty...............
Your dilemma is a frozen preconception or assumption of what 'truth' is, a 'belief' you've accepted, by tradition or indoctrination. Taking chances on that 'assumption' isn't very responsible as far as researching and being intellectually honest, respecting truth wherever it is found (not just limited to your 'denonimations'). You have an idea, concept, belief of what is 'true', and continually parade that as what is 'truth', yet that belief can become an 'idol', a 'thing' falsely worshipped. The truth that is living....is not bound by any form, image or idol....but is recognizable in 'principle', being 'dynamic'.
Truth is the reality behind everything that gives it value and meaning, or 'existence'. Its a far deeper subject or indescribable essence than what our minds can objectify or assume, to which the intellect can only attempt to articulate.
For complete essay on 'truth and beauty' go here.
Also remember that Pilate asked Jesus "what is truth?" to which the gospels give no answer, although at least one apocryphal text has Jesus saying "truth is from heaven" (from the Spirit). If Jesus came to bear witness to the 'truth' and all those who hear his voice are of the 'truth',...then it is that divine value, wisdom, substance in what he is sharing that rings true in the human spirit (by the witness of Spirit of truth) further illuminating the soul....that verifies itself as being 'true'.
pj
Divine truth and beauty...............
Your dilemma is a frozen preconception or assumption of what 'truth' is, a 'belief' you've accepted, by tradition or indoctrination. Taking chances on that 'assumption' isn't very responsible as far as researching and being intellectually honest, respecting truth wherever it is found (not just limited to your 'denonimations'). You have an idea, concept, belief of what is 'true', and continually parade that as what is 'truth', yet that belief can become an 'idol', a 'thing' falsely worshipped. The truth that is living....is not bound by any form, image or idol....but is recognizable in 'principle', being 'dynamic'.
Truth is the reality behind everything that gives it value and meaning, or 'existence'. Its a far deeper subject or indescribable essence than what our minds can objectify or assume, to which the intellect can only attempt to articulate.
For complete essay on 'truth and beauty' go here.
Also remember that Pilate asked Jesus "what is truth?" to which the gospels give no answer, although at least one apocryphal text has Jesus saying "truth is from heaven" (from the Spirit). If Jesus came to bear witness to the 'truth' and all those who hear his voice are of the 'truth',...then it is that divine value, wisdom, substance in what he is sharing that rings true in the human spirit (by the witness of Spirit of truth) further illuminating the soul....that verifies itself as being 'true'.
pj
Like I've told you before, you're very articulate, and use
"pretty words" to convey your message; however, pretty
words, and articulate writing skills don't necessarily mean
the writer knows what he's talking about or knows anything
about the truth of the subject being discussed!
freelight
Eclectic Theosophist
expanding consciousness........
expanding consciousness........
I've been sharing an intelligent, informed and relatively accurate portrayal of the contents in the Urantia papers here in the thread so far,....relating such to other religious ideals, principles and correlating mythologies. I having familiarized myself with the subject (unlike yourself) am probably a little more qualified (at this point) to be an expounder of such. This has little to do with 'fancy language', but learning the terms and language-symbols so one might better understand the message. That's the 'key'. You know only those with the right 'key', can unlock and receive the message. I say that in reference to the context of the papers, after all, that is what this thread is about. Have to dignity and respect to recognize that.
Even beyond the UB, the subject of what is 'absolute truth' or what is 'reality' is a question that goes deeper than any theological construct, since 'reality' is essentially what actually is (what exists fundamentally at the heart or foundation of existence, the 'root' of all....the 'ground of being'). There are schools that explore and elaborate on these deeper levels of reality, but one must learn the 'keys' to those systems and discover for himself what the teaching points to so the student can 'realize' such for himself.
pj
expanding consciousness........
I've been sharing an intelligent, informed and relatively accurate portrayal of the contents in the Urantia papers here in the thread so far,....relating such to other religious ideals, principles and correlating mythologies. I having familiarized myself with the subject (unlike yourself) am probably a little more qualified (at this point) to be an expounder of such. This has little to do with 'fancy language', but learning the terms and language-symbols so one might better understand the message. That's the 'key'. You know only those with the right 'key', can unlock and receive the message. I say that in reference to the context of the papers, after all, that is what this thread is about. Have to dignity and respect to recognize that.
Even beyond the UB, the subject of what is 'absolute truth' or what is 'reality' is a question that goes deeper than any theological construct, since 'reality' is essentially what actually is (what exists fundamentally at the heart or foundation of existence, the 'root' of all....the 'ground of being'). There are schools that explore and elaborate on these deeper levels of reality, but one must learn the 'keys' to those systems and discover for himself what the teaching points to so the student can 'realize' such for himself.
pj
The stubbornness of today's Christian is a glimpse of what Jesus had to contend with in dealing with the thick headed Jews. They would send lawyers and professional quibblers out to try to entrap him into their own theological abstracts. He would brilliantly wreck the whole house of cards as he was God after all.
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