Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Well then, quote the NT passage to which you make reference and then tell me your interpretation of that passage.
ECT Ps 89: too much about Christ to be about David
- Thread starter Interplanner
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Well then, quote the NT passage to which you make reference and then tell me your interpretation of that passage.
Right Divider
Body part
Good luck with that.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Besides the agonizing at the end as quoted in Rom 15, here is Metzgers Greek Testaments list. It is the United Bible Society's greek testament used in most seminaries. It has a list of the 2500 uses of the OT by the NT at the back.
89:
3-4 Jn 7:42
4 Jn 12:34
10 Lk 1:51
11 I Cor 10:26
20 Acts 13:22
26 I Pet 1:17
27 Rev 1:5
36 Jn 12:34
50,51 I Pet 4:14
I think they missed Rom 15:3 in their list which is identified in most versions, plus:
25 (calming of the sea)
27 (firstborn in Col 1)
27 (most exalted king, Rev 12)
No luck about it.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Neither of those passages even hint that what I said here is in error:
The following is speaking about David and not about the Lord Jesus:
"I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant, Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations" (Ps.89:3-4).
We can see that the Lord told Nathan to tell David these promises:
"And it came to pass that night, that the word of the LORD came unto Nathan, saying, Go and tell my servant David...I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom. He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever. I will be his father, and he shall be my son. If he commit iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men: But my mercy shall not depart away from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I put away before thee. And thine house and thy kingdom shall be established for ever before thee: thy throne shall be established for ever" (2 Sam.7:5, 12-16).
Nathan told David these promises and it is ridiculous to argue that he told the Lord Jesus these promises because the Lord Jesus was not even on the earth at that time. So the promises of the Lord were made to David and not the Lord Jesus.
So in Psalm 89 the reference is to David and not the Lord Jesus.
Nope,
The Lord has intertwined the truth about Jesus among the OT promises and you can not discern them.
Your misunderstanding of Gen ch 17 began most of the confusion you are in.
Try to pray to the Lord for discernment and wisdom.
Jas 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
Jas 1:6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
Jas 1:7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
Jas 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.
LA
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
As usual you quote me and then you do not even attempt to prove anything which I said is in error. And it is obvious that you are unable to prove that what I said is wrong.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Is jerry one deaf to the NT? does the final declarations of the NT mean anything to him? Are we always going back to the OT to resolve these without knowing what the NT says? Why is Christ's final debate with Judaism about the nothing of being David's son because David called him Lord? Why are Ps 2, 16 and 110 the most used by the apostles instead of D'ism's Ps 83 about defeating all Israel's enemies?
Interplanner
Well-known member
Is jerry one deaf to the NT? does the final declarations of the NT mean anything to him? Are we always going back to the OT to resolve these without knowing what the NT says? Why is Christ's final debate with Judaism about the nothing of being David's son because David called him Lord? Why are Ps 2, 16 and 110 the most used by the apostles instead of D'ism's Ps 83 about defeating all of Isrsel's enemies?
Jerry uses his human reasonings .
2Co 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
2Co 3:15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
2Co 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.
LA
So...you're not human?
Now you are being stupid.
1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
1Co 2:15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
1Co 2:16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
Too bad you weren't around in the first century so you could correct Paul for using "human reasoning":
"And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures" (Acts 17:2).
You resent it when a Christian reasons out of the Scriptures because you think that we should follow your method of throwing your reason to the wind.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
It is very sad that in your 40 years of study and debate that you still do not know what the "OT" and "NT" are.
Right Divider
Body part
Maybe his study plan does not get to those until the 60th or 80th year.
You claim to know what is in my heart.
and you also claim to know better than Gods word.
You act like a false prophet, who has learnt from men and not from the Lord.
You teach much like a SDA (some of their stuff is good)
Were you ever an SDA?
LA
I didn't get the impression that Jerry was claiming that.
He was just reading your words and exercising human reason to try to make sense out of it.
I never get that impression either.
It seems that Jerry has a tremendous grasp on what GOD is saying in the Scriptures.
Most of their stuff is junk.
I seriously doubt it.
Did you use human reason to arrive at that conclusion?
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
LOL!!!
Interplanner
Well-known member
I do know. They are tricks you invented in the past few years to make people think there is 2P2P in the Bible.
:rotfl:
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Define OT and NT for us.