That may have been the intention, but it's an even worse distinction. There are far, far more gay people than there are trans people. And how are you going to control their use of restroom, as there's no definitive test for homosexuality?
North Carolina: Force to Rescind Tranny In Bathroom Bill
- Thread starter Ktoyou
- Start date
That may have been the intention, but it's an even worse distinction. There are far, far more gay people than there are trans people. And how are you going to control their use of restroom, as there's no definitive test for homosexuality?
Yes. But that should be along the lines of challenging people who enter clearly the wrong bathroom, not asking them to drop their pants. From what I can tell, it's mostly an imaginary problem.
I'm not willing to compromise the safety of all women, even for the rights of a minority. But I see no real evidence that allowing people to use the bathroom that matches their gender identity instead of their birth certificate or their genitals does that, and in fact, I think requiring especially transwomen to use the mens' room puts them at risk, and requiring transmen to use the women's room will make the women there very uncomfortable.
ToL apparently has a policy of banning people for posting pictures of trans men, but I'd suggest a Google image search for trans men, and ask yourself if you'd be comfortable if that person walked into the ladies room.
PureX
Well-known member
For me, the issue isn't one of personal discomfort, it's one of actual security. Men are so prone to violence, especially when bigotry arises, that it is physically dangerous for some trans-gender type males to enter a men's bathroom in some places. Yet, while they don't pose any danger to women by using the women's bathroom, they will very likely make most women uncomfortable in doing so.
My hope would be that the women would be understanding, as they are well aware of the danger men can pose regarding sexual bias, and allow those trans-males to use their bathroom on the rare occasions when such danger warrants it. And no laws would need be required.
But as is clear from some of the comments, here, women can be just as bigoted and mean-spiritied as the men are, even if they don't often rise to outright violence in expressing it. So some legal solution ends up being required, simply because we're too ignorant, frightened, and angry to resolve this fairly rare and minimal problem among ourselves with simple compassion and courtesy.
My hope would be that the women would be understanding, as they are well aware of the danger men can pose regarding sexual bias, and allow those trans-males to use their bathroom on the rare occasions when such danger warrants it. And no laws would need be required.
But as is clear from some of the comments, here, women can be just as bigoted and mean-spiritied as the men are, even if they don't often rise to outright violence in expressing it. So some legal solution ends up being required, simply because we're too ignorant, frightened, and angry to resolve this fairly rare and minimal problem among ourselves with simple compassion and courtesy.
No, im not comfortable with perverts in my rest room.
Please see the video i posted in the thread, thanks.
Some people could care less about the facts - get educated:
A great many tranny men are attracted to women and children.
Because it's illegal
You didn't see any evidence that homosexuality accounts for the majority of HIV cases until it became legal either.
The government should control all genitalia nationwide
How do you judge someone clearly entering the wrong bathroom? Are you going to say that transgendered people have to dress or look a certain way?
Of course, that's a fair point. But based on that quote sexual attraction wasn't a factor in the law, at least not a primary one.
I guess I would probably only challenge people who are egregiously out of place. If they still insist, you'd have to decide if it was worth throwing them out.
Well good. It shouldn't be.
The initial challenge has to be based on appearances, but do you think there should be some way of designating who can go where beyond appearance? The NC law talked about changing birth certificates if someone has the surgery. That's a pretty high hurdle. I suggested using a state ID instead.
Not all trans people have or need SRS, and it still isn't about genitals.
I didn't say or imply either of those things. The ID could be without surgery or someone examining genitals.
I understand. That was mostly a reaction to North Carolina's law. I guess I don't see the problem the card is trying to solve. Would everyone be required to carry them, or just trans people? And then, how do you determine who is trans? And who's responsible for enforcing it?
It won't be long until all genitalia is controlled by the government.
I don't mean a special ID to indicate what gender you are for bathroom purposes. I mean the regular state ID that anyone has. Most likely a driver's license.
And the problem I see being solved by putting something on an ID is that then it's clear. There's no deciding or fighting over who can go where. And if there are concerns about predators taking advantage of the laws then going to the effort of changing your ID is something that I doubt predators would do. As I said earlier, places won't have ID-checkers at the bathrooms so the ID would mostly be of use to verify something after the fact but then you'd know someone isn't/wasn't where they should be. And if an employee does suspect someone is going where they shouldn't then you can simply ask for an ID.
I can't imagine the circumstances where this would actually be useful. It seems like a lot of work for something with almost no chance of being put to a legitimate use. Would we actually see people prosecuted for using the wrong restroom? If someone's a predator, they're going to get in trouble for that long before, and for much better reasons than where they decide to relieve themselves.
annabenedetti
like marbles on glass
We managed to upgrade from outhouses to indoor plumbing. Can we manage to upgrade to gender-neutral, single-occupancy restrooms? I think that will be the future in new construction and remodels of commercial or multi-use buildings. Even with multi-occupancy gender-specific restrooms, there should be room for an additional single occupancy restroom. That's how they're doing it on my campus, and I see them in stores as well.
theophilus
Well-known member
We should go back to out-houses.