No Longer A Christian

[brother Willi]

Originally posted by granite1010

Christ talked about hell more than anyone in the New Testament. Sorry, no dice. In any event, if you're so blinded that you're willing to ignore the lion's share of your own book, I'm not the one with the problem.

hell might be the death an atheist sees.

as to the O.T

did Jesus not teach a new Way?

 

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by brother Willi

PLEASE granite, get a "red letter edition" of a Bible.

read ONLY the read letters.

I think I agree with Willi on this, go figure.

 

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by On Fire

Anyone who comes here or any other web site expecting to find God is just plain stupid. You've got to rub elbows with God's people, confess your sins to God's people, expose your brokeness to God's people, and ask God's people to stand beside you when you feel like doubting.

Right! And if you're expecting to find very many of God's people here, you're SOL.

 

[brother Willi]

Originally posted by Zakath

Sounds pretty bloodthirsty to me... :think:

indeed it does.

are we to be O.T. bloodthirsty christians?

did Jesus not teach us a New Way?

 

[wickwoman]

Originally posted by granite1010

Christ talked about hell more than anyone in the New Testament. Sorry, no dice. In any event, if you're so blinded that you're willing to ignore the lion's share of your own book, I'm not the one with the problem.

Uh oh. I must be in denial. Show me where Jesus talked about Hell. You're screwing up my philsophy. Well, that is if I must believe all of what is attributed to Jesus in the gospels is actually what Jesus said, which I don't.

 

[Granite]

Originally posted by wickwoman

Uh oh. I must be in denial. Show me where Jesus talked about Hell. You're screwing up my philsophy. Well, that is if I must believe all of what is attributed to Jesus in the gospels is actually what Jesus said, which I don't.

Huh??? Come on, Wick! I'm surprised you weren't aware of the real charming tidbits from the gospels. Weeping and gnashing of teeth. Fear not those who kill the body but he who can throw you into hell. He cursed entire cities...

 

[Nineveh]

Ah! Good, I thought you were ignoring me

Originally posted by Zakath

Your argument is flawed. If no one believed in their existence, why did someone pay for archeologists to locate them? :think:

Just because the "enlightened" who "keep the knowledge" were in error, that doesn't mean everyone bowed to their "wisdom". Even (athiestic) Archaelogists give the Bible credit for being a "treasure map". If I'm not mistaken the guy who went in search of Troy using the Illiad was mocked.

I would seriously doubt that the existence of Nineveh was in doubt, what appeared to be in doubt was the exact location of the site of the city which was finally found in the early nineteenth century underneath the modern city of Mosul.

In the days of the Greek historian Herodotus, 400 BC, it [Nineveh] had become a thing of the past; and when Xenophon the historian passed the place in the "Retreat of the Ten Thousand," the very memory of its name had been lost. It was buried out of sight, and no one knew its grave. It is never again to rise from its ruins.cite

In essence, God kept memory of the great city of Nineveh when men had forgotten.

Oh, you mean after his apparent stroke or seizure on the Damascus road affected his brain? More flimsy framework...

LOL right.

Of course it's free... all my advice here is free.

Good policy...
Saves me from asking for my money back

Since you apparently cannot see beyond your limited worldview

Right backatcha

(aww do those little smilies irk you that badly? Be proud! You have :zakath: you earned it! )

I wasn't taking it there, was I?

Are you arguing granite's reasons for losing his faith or yours?

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by brother Willi

indeed it does.

are we to be O.T. bloodthirsty christians?

did Jesus not teach us a New Way?

Maybe, maybe not...


:readthis: Some teachings of Jesus...

"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn " 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law-- a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.' - Mt. 10:35-35

"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters--yes, even his own life--he cannot be my disciple." - Lk 14:26


And for all our biblical literalists, this part of John's vision in Revelation (allegedly from Jesus)...

I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one "like a son of man" with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand. Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, "Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe." So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.

Another angel came out of the temple in heaven, and he too had a sharp sickle. Still another angel, who had charge of the fire, came from the altar and called in a loud voice to him who had the sharp sickle, "Take your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of grapes from the earth's vine, because its grapes are ripe." The angel swung his sickle on the earth, gathered its grapes and threw them into the great winepress of God's wrath. They were trampled in the winepress outside the city, and blood flowed out of the press, rising as high as the horses' bridles for a distance of 1,600 stadia." - Rev. 14:14-19



"He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name." Rev. 14:10


I'm not sure what's "better" about Jesus' way, Willi. :think:

 

[cattyfan]

Trust me, I wasn't looking for an "excuse," nor do I see my choice as an "excuse" for anything. People walk from the church all the time for any number of reasons.

o.k. then please ignore the use of "excuse" and just take the second half of my post to heart. I am sincere when I tell you I hope you find your way back to Christ and His grace and love.

 

[cattyfan]

That's "toeing", as in standing with your toe on a line...)

great...now I'm hearing that 1980 Rocky Burnett song in my head...:freak:

 

[Granite]

Originally posted by brother Willi

indeed it does.

are we to be O.T. bloodthirsty christians?

did Jesus not teach us a New Way?

Are you going to acknowledge the God of the OT was fundamentally bloodthirsty and condoned barbarism and savagery committed by the Hebrews?

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by Nineveh

Ah! Good, I thought you were ignoring me



Just because the "enlightened" who "keep the knowledge" were in error, that doesn't mean everyone bowed to their "wisdom".

Perhaps a veiled reference to your attitude about the established Church? :think:

Even (athiestic) Archaelogists give the Bible credit for being a "treasure map".

I think you've been watching too many Indiana Jones movies, Nineveh. Many recent archeological digs in the middle east are, shall we say, not exactly supporting the veracity of the biblical stories about important things like the exodus from Egypt and the invasion of Palestine.

If I'm not mistaken the guy who went in search of Troy using the Illiad was mocked.

I presume you mean Heinrich Schliemann. So what? Galileo was mocked, and worse, by your Christians when he went in search of what he believed to exist and we now accept as verifiable fact...

In essence, God kept memory of the great city of Nineveh when men had forgotten.

Actually modern copies of ancient texts kept the memory. Deity had nothing to do with it.

(aww do those little smilies irk you that badly?

Nope. Just pointing out how appropriate your dark glasses were.

Be proud! You have :zakath: you earned it!

As you pointed out earlier, searchers for truth are used to dealing with mockers, like those of you in the established religions...

Are you arguing granite's reasons for losing his faith or yours?

I'm discussing the issue of loss of faith in general. It's granite's thread, though, and if he feels my comments are inappropriate, I'll withdraw.

 

[cattyfan]

Ex-Christians pose a problem: either they WERE "saved" somehow and left the faith, or, they were never saved to begin with. Which means anybody at any time can take a walk.

not all Christians have this point of view. I was raised to believe you can reject the Lord at anytime...you are saved at the time of your baptism, but if you choose to turn your back on the Lord later, then you are no longer His.

It's like He's given you a gift, and at some point in your life you decide you don't want it, so you return it to Him without unwrapping it.

The good news is, He will always accept and welcome you should you decide to return...and He will gladly give you the gift again.

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by cattyfan

great...now I'm hearing that 70s Robbie Burnett song in my head...:freak:

 

[cattyfan]

The song "Tired of Toeing the Line"

Rocky Burnett, son of legendary rockabilly artist Johnny Burnett, charted in 1980. It hit number 8 and was on the chart for months. Sorry...I identified him as "Robbie" and in the late 70s...too much useless info in my head.

 

[Granite]

Originally posted by cattyfan

not all Christians have this point of view. I was raised to believe you can reject the Lord at anytime...you are saved at the time of your baptism, but if you choose to turn your back on the Lord later, then you are no longer His.

It's like He's given you a gift, and at some point in your life you decide you don't want it, so you return it to Him without unwrapping it.

The good news is, He will always accept and welcome you should you decide to return...and He will gladly give you the gift again.

If it is a gift, it's the most strings-attached gift I've ever heard of.

Let's see...accept my generosity, or, I'll burn you alive for the rest of eternity. More like the Godfather as opposed to God the Father. Talk about an offer you can't refuse...

 

[cattyfan]

unconditional love...really threatening stuff.

 

[Granite]

But it is conditional. Very much so.

 

[wickwoman]

No, really Granite, give me some scriptures where Jesus talked about Hell. I'm not saying it's not in the Bible. I just want to see them.

Revelations doesn't count.

 

[Zakath]

Originally posted by cattyfan

The song "Tired of Toeing the Line"

Rocky Burnett, son of legendary rockabilly artist Johnny Burnett, charted in 1980. It hit number 8 and was on the chart for months. Sorry...I identified him as "Robbie" and in the late 70s...too much useless info in my head.

:ha:

I was wondering if it might have been Rocky, not Robbie, but I didn't remember the song...