Is M.A.D. a dangerous heresy? It demands much scripture to be ignored

[Clete]

MAD follows a false narrative of scripture.

False.

Through it, whole books of the New Testament have been written off as "not for our dispensation".

False. Extreme overgeneralization / intentional mischaracterization.

Through it, New Testament scripture is not looked at as a whole complementary revelation, but instead it is looked at as contradictory to itself.

It isn't "looked at" it is simply read. One of the major distinctions and strongest arguments in favor of Mid-Acts Dispensationalism is that it insists on a plain reading of the text while simply acknowledging its context (including both the author and it's intended audience). The result is a New Testament WITHOUT contradictions.

Through it the Apostle Paul's actions have been misconstrued in such a way it changes their meaning.

False to the point of stupidity.

Through it the door is opened to take ANY scripture and say "that was just for the Corinthians", or "that was just for...".

This is not only false but simpltonman knew it was false when he posted it. That makes it a lie.

I say it is an extremely dangerous heresy!

Why should anyone care what you say?

Resting in Him,
Clete

 

[SimpleMan77]

Romans 16:26 (KJV)

How to obey the gospel

Find me one single example of faith in the OT or NT, where faith would have been faith without active obedience.

One?

Read Hebrews 11, and subtract "obedience through active faith" from any testimony, and the name wouldn't have been included.

Faith cannot be faith without obedience. It's like saying remove the O from H2O to make the water more pure. It stops being water.

If I say "drink water to survive", and you say "wait, he didn't say anything about oxygen, so we can't drink anything with oxygen..." you'd be twisting my words, yet some say "Paul couldn't have been including obedience when he said to believe".

If you want to talk about Abraham believing for a son, if he would have refused to have sexual relations with his wife, God would have said "you really didn't believe me, did you".

Again, name me one example of faith where that faith wouldn't have been termed "unbelief" if the person wouldn't have obeyed. I'll wait, but it doesn't exist.

Obedience springs out of faith, but faith dies without it.


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[SaulToPaul 2]

Find me one single example of faith in the OT or NT, where faith would have been faith without active obedience.

One?

Read Hebrews 11, and subtract "obedience through active faith" from any testimony, and the name wouldn't have been included.

Faith cannot be faith without obedience. It's like saying remove the O from H2O to make the water more pure. It stops being water.

If I say "drink water to survive", and you say "wait, he didn't say anything about oxygen, so we can't drink anything with oxygen..." you'd be twisting my words, yet some say "Paul couldn't have been including obedience when he said to believe".

If you want to talk about Abraham believing for a son, if he would have refused to have sexual relations with his wife, God would have said "you really didn't believe me, did you".

Again, name me one example of faith where that faith wouldn't have been termed "unbelief" if the person wouldn't have obeyed. I'll wait, but it doesn't exist.

Obedience springs out of faith, but faith dies without it.


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:chuckle:

What does 1 Cor 15:1-4 (KJV) require of YOU?

 

[patrick jane]

Only dangerous to those who embrace it. There have always been heresy, and that is by design. Indeed Paul said "For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you" (1 Corinthians 11:19).

My comment is designed to make those who are involved think. If we can carve out commands of New Testament scripture as "not being for us", we can do that with any part we don't want to obey.


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YOU are a heresy Simpleton

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

YOU are a heresy Simpleton

As far as I can tell, he is another works salvationist who is doomed and damned.

 

[SimpleMan77]

YOU are a heresy Simpleton

Perfect answer if you're wanting to show readers you have no scriptural answers to scriptures that contradict your theology.

We all naturally know who's winning when the best one side can do is resort to calling names.

I'm fine with your response.


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[SimpleMan77]

:chuckle:

What does 1 Cor 15:1-4 (KJV) require of YOU?

I asked a question, which you refuse to answer because you can't.

I'll answer yours though. Paul said repentance was a command of God. Paul taught and performed baptism. Paul taught the essentiality of receiving the Holy Ghost, AFTER believing ("SINCE ye believed")

Acts 19:2
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

Paul taught OBEDIENCE to the Gospel. Death, burial, resurrection. Repentance, baptism, Holy Ghost.


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[SaulToPaul 2]

I asked a question, which you refuse to answer because you can't.

I'll answer yours though. Paul said repentance was a command of God. Paul taught and performed baptism. Paul taught the essentiality of receiving the Holy Ghost, AFTER believing ("SINCE ye believed")

Acts 19:2
He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.

Paul taught OBEDIENCE to the Gospel. Death, burial, resurrection. Repentance, baptism, Holy Ghost.


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Poor lost soul.

 

[SimpleMan77]

Poor lost soul.

Why did Paul baptize people, and even re-baptize those who were not baptized in Jesus' name?

Why was it so important that he baptized the Philippian jailer in the middle of the night?


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[Zeke]

Yet the kingdom STP is used in scripture as a metaphor/figurative story that isn't about the Divine dwelling in brick and mortar, nor national boundaries, mere types and shadows that tradition taught as literal events to keep people in ignorance and dependence, fighting over allegorical shadows and symbols that are elementary teaching tools for the child of the Divine, not the awakened Son. Galatians/Eph shows that neither Jew nor Gentile, male or female exist once you are awakened to the application and intent of the stories, precept upon precept, knock knock, The letter kills maturity if you never go beyond that state of literal application, What would you call a 50 year old who still believed in the Santa tale? same thing with Biblical stories. Galatians 4:3, those temporal milk elements/symbols used to teach children should progress to Galatians 4:24, Luke 17:20-21, 1Cor 3:16, Acts 17:24, ect........That's the only Division in scripture from child to maturity 2Cor 3:6. Mad/pick a denomintion is still based on the elements that cause division on the play ground.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Yet the kingdom STP is used in scripture as a metaphor/figurative story that isn't about the Divine dwelling in brick and mortar, nor national boundaries, mere types and shadows that tradition taught as literal event to keep people in ignorance and dependence, fighting over allegorical shadows and symbols that are elementary teaching tools for the child of the Divine, not the awakened Son. Galatians/Eph shows that neither Jew nor Gentile, male or female exist once you are awakened to the application and intent of the stories, precept upon precept, knock knock, The letter kills maturity if you never go beyond that state of literal application, What would you call a 50 year old who still believed in the Santa tale? same thing with Biblical stories. Galatians 4:3, those temporal milk elements/symbols used to teach children should progress to Galatians 4:24, Luke 17:20-21, 1Cor 3:16, Acts 17:24, ect........That's the only Division in scripture from child to maturity 2Cor 3:6. Mad/pick a denomintion is still based on the elements that cause division on the play ground.

:wave2:

zeke!

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Why did Paul baptize people, and even re-baptize those who were not baptized in Jesus' name?

Why was it so important that he baptized the Philippian jailer in the middle of the night?


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Why did Paul shave his head and take a vow?
Same reason.

 

[Zeke]

Why did Paul shave his head and take a vow?
Same reason.

1Cor 9:19-23, if we are staying in the literal/physical observable kingdom mode, Paul is teaching the Abraham Covenant nothing else Galatians 3:8, You become the One New Man when you grasped the letter is milk, allegories Galatians 4:24 stuck in time Hebrews 6:1-3.

 

[SimpleMan77]

Why did Paul shave his head and take a vow?
Same reason.

You said "same reason". What is that reason?


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[patrick jane]

You said "same reason". What is that reason?


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He was a jew - he was just trying to be a good boy

 

[SimpleMan77]

He was a jew

So he lived as a Jew, baptized the Philippian jailer (a Gentile) because he was a Jew...

so we shouldn't take anything he said or did as to the general Gentile world unless he prefaced it by saying "this is for Gentiles in general"?


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[Zeke]

MAD follows a false narrative of scripture.

Through it, whole books of the New Testament have been written off as "not for our dispensation".

Through it, New Testament scripture is not looked at as a whole complementary revelation, but instead it is looked at as contradictory to itself.

Through it the Apostle Paul's actions have been misconstrued in such a way it changes their meaning.

Through it the door is opened to take ANY scripture and say "that was just for the Corinthians", or "that was just for...".

I say it is an extremely dangerous heresy!



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No more so than any other dog in the letter is reality fight, The spirit is quite able to deal with every belief system man has invented 1Cor 13:1-13 is the only way 1Cor 12:31 that goes beyond the intellectual ability to comprehend all things are one when Christ is awake in you.

 

[Clete]

Find me one single example of faith in the OT or NT, where faith would have been faith without active obedience.

One?

Romans 4: 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works​

Prediction: The fact that this passage directly contradicts your position, not to mention being in contradiction the gospel according to Jesus and the Twelve and Moses and everyone else prior to Paul, won't move you an inch.

 

[jamie]

...just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works​

And David would know, some of his works will blow you away. Wow!

 

[SimpleMan77]

Romans 4: 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,
6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works​

Prediction: The fact that this passage directly contradicts your position, not to mention being in contradiction the gospel according to Jesus and the Twelve and Moses and everyone else prior to Paul, won't move you an inch.

I do want to make sure you understand what I'm saying and what I'm asking for.

I'm saying that righteousness is imputed the moment there is faith, but if faith doesn't produce obedience it dies, and does no good.

There is not a single example in scripture where you can take obedience away and it leaves faith still existent.

Are you saying David qualifies for that? If he would have refused to come when Samuel called, he would have never been highlighted as a man of faith. David realized that his obedience did not earn him anything, but that without it he would be just as lost as Saul.

I fully agree that the split second a person believes the Gospel there is righteousness imputed. I just say that faith dies when it is not allowed to breathe. Faith cannot exist outside of obedience.


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