Did Christ die for all men?

[heir]

You have already been shown that Paul preached the Gospel to Jews. Why is this such an issue?

LOL I know what Paul preached and I know what Peter preached (and didn't preach) and to whom.

At Pentecost (a Jewish holy day) Peter preached:

Acts 2:38 KJV Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Paul preached:

1 Corinthians 15:3 KJV For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

Peter preached that Jesus Christ was raised from the dead to sit on David’s throne:

Acts 2:30 KJV Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;

Paul preached that Jesus Christ was delivered for our offences and raised again for our justification:

Romans 4:25 KJV Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.


Peter preached the blotting out of sins at the second coming of the Lord

Acts 3:19-20 KJV Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; 20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

Paul writes that we have NOW received the atonement:

Romans 5:11 KJV And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

Peter said it was spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began:

Acts 3:21 KJV Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Paul says it was a secret since the world began

Romans 16:25 KJV Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,


Peter said to Cornelius:

Acts 10:35 KJV But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

Paul writes:

Titus 3:5 KJV Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

 

[heir]

Peter didn't know the gospel of Christ at the time of Acts 10! That gospel was committed to the apostle Paul!

Galatians 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

...

1 Corinthians 9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

Paul's gospel was before a mystery and he tells us why!

1 Corinthians 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

1 Corinthians 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

1 Corinthians 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

 

[heir]

James, Cephas (Peter) and John did not know the gospel Paul preached before they heard it directly from him at the time of Acts 15. Paul had to go up by revelation (meaning he was sent) and communicate "that gospel" which he preached among the Gentiles unto them. It was THEN (not before) "when they saw" that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto Paul. It was THEN (not before) that they “perceived the grace” that was given unto Paul!

Galatians 2:1 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also. 2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.

Galatians 2:6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man's person for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:

They added nothing to Paul?! If they had been preaching the "same gospel" (as the religious, denominational man hides the truth by saying), surely THEY must have added something to Paul. According to the scriptures they DIDN'T! In fact,

BUT CONTRARIWISE,…!

Galatians 2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter; 8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles 9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

 

[csuguy]

Peter preached,


Acts 10:35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.


which is contrary to what Paul preached

And here is your problem: you don't like what Peter says, it disagrees with your interpretation of things, SO you assert that it must not apply to you. That's the heart of the Dispensationalist Theology: pick out all the nice things and apply them to yourself, take anything that you consider undesireable and say that it must have been meant for the Jews alone. But your refusal to accept the facts presented in the scriptures is not the same thing as an argument.

As for works, Paul maintains the necessity of works as much as the rest of the scriptures. But you need to study everything Paul says and not just cherry-pick those things that you like.

Romans 2:6-11 [God] “will render to each one according to his deeds”:[a] 7 eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; 8 but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, 9 tribulation and anguish, on every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek; 10 but glory, honor, and peace to everyone who works what is good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 11 For there is no partiality with God.​

In this verse not only does Paul assert that eternal life is a reward for doing good - both for Jew and Gentile - he also asserts that there is no partiality with God. Those who do good - Jew or Gentile - recieve the same reward. Those who do bad - Jew or Gentile - are punished. But your theology would give all the gifts and rewards to the Gentiles for doing nothing, while all the requirements of doing the Lord's will, of doing good works, are placed solely on the Jews. You would have God show partiality - which is a sin, and thus your Dispensationalist Theology is fundamentally flawed.

 

[heir]

And here is your problem: you don't like what Peter says, it disagrees with your interpretation of things, SO you assert that it must not apply to you.

Liar. You say something is preached by someone when it can't be found in the scriptures. You said Peter preached the gospel of Christ to Cornelius, but it's not there and the scriptures show it's not there. You can step off your slanderous reports about me when you can't even prove what you say by the scriptures!

 

[csuguy]

Peter didn't know the gospel of Christ at the time of Acts 10! That gospel was committed to the apostle Paul!

Because all that time he spent as his disciple, all that time he was taught in person by Christ - I'm sure that had nothing to do with the Gospel of Christ. And that Holy Spirit they were given, and that descended upon others when they preached to them - by your teaching that must be ANOTHER Holy Spirit, the Jewish Holy Spirit. Right?

 

[heir]

As for works, Paul maintains the necessity of works as much as the rest of the scriptures.

Never for salvation as you would have us to believe, but for reward (1 Corinthians 3:10-15 KJV), fool!

 

[csuguy]

It is there. He teaches in that passage everything Paul taught in your referenced passage: Christ's death and resurrection from the dead on the 3rd day, his appointment as Judge of the living and the dead, and the forgiveness of sins

Again - work on your reading comprehension

 

[heir]

Because all that time he spent as his disciple, all that time he taught in person by Christ - I'm sure that had nothing to do with the Gospel of Christ.

This is why, but you can't be taught.

1 Corinthians 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

1 Corinthians 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

1 Corinthians 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

 

[csuguy]

Never for salvation as you would have us to believe, but for reward (1 Corinthians 3:10-15 KJV), fool!

The reward of eternal life. Or do you think salvation and eternal life are distinct?

 

[heir]

It is there. He teaches in that passage everything Paul taught in your referenced passage: Christ's death and resurrection from the dead on the 3rd day, his appointment as Judge of the living and the dead, and the
forgiveness of sins

Again - working on your reading comprehension

Peter preached remission looking forward to the blotting out of sins (Acts 3:19-21 KJV). That is not the WHY of the cross (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV)!

 

[csuguy]

This is why, but you can't be taught.

1 Corinthians 2:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:

1 Corinthians 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

1 Corinthians 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

Are you asserting that the disciples crucified the Lord? While Jesus didn't go about making it clear to the WORLD who he was for this reason - he did tell the disciples that he would die. And when he resurrected, he gave them the Holy Spirit and told them to go make disciples of all nations.

 

[csuguy]

EDIT: Duplicate post. Ignore

 

[heir]

The reward of eternal life. Or do you think salvation and eternal life are distinct?

Salvation is the gift of God (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV). A believer's work will be judged as to what sort it is. That which is built upon the foundation Paul laid will receive reward. That which isn't will burn up (suffer loss). Simple stuff for the Bible believer!

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.

1 Corinthians 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

1 Corinthians 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

1 Corinthians 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

 

[heir]

Are you asserting that the disciples crucified the Lord? While Jesus didn't go about making it clear to the WORLD who he was for this reason - he did tell the disciples that he would die. And when he resurrected, he gave them the Holy Spirit and told them to go make disciples of all nations.

He told them when His death was imminent that He would die. He did NOT tell them why! The why was a mystery and it is the hidden wisdom of God in a mystery that just so happens to be the gospel of our salvation!

 

[csuguy]

Peter preached remission looking forward to the blotting out of sins (Acts 3:19-21 KJV). That is not the WHY of the cross (1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV)!

Acts 3:19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord

This is fully in agreement with Paul's theology. It also doesn't change what was preached in Acts 10. You are making much to do about nothing.

 

[csuguy]

He told them when His death was imminent that He would die. He did NOT tell them why! The why was a mystery and it is the hidden wisdom of God in a mystery that just so happens to be the gospel of our salvation!

They knew he was the Messiah, and from that they knew why. And even if they didn't fully understand prior to his death - they certainly understood after the fact when he was resurrected and gave them their ministry to all nations

It is foolish to assert that Christ trained the 12 disciples only to hide from them his Gospel. It is foolish to assert that they had something other than the Gospel - yet their teachings were accompanied by the baptism of the Holy Spirit. You are simply in denial of these clear truths.

 

[csuguy]

Salvation is the gift of God (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV). A believer's work will be judged as to what sort it is. That which is built upon the foundation Paul laid will receive reward. That which isn't will burn up (suffer loss). Simple stuff for the Bible believer!

You failed to answer my question: is eternal life distinct from salvation? Yes or no? If so, then what would it mean for one to be saved and yet not receive eternal life?

 

[chrysostom]

You failed to answer my question: is eternal life distinct from salvation? Yes or no? If so, then what would it mean for one to be saved and yet not receive eternal life?

good question
-the hell people can't or won't answer it
-no problem here
-saved and eternal life are the same thing
-of course they are

 

[Nang]

It is there. He teaches in that passage everything Paul taught in your referenced passage: Christ's death and resurrection from the dead on the 3rd day, his appointment as Judge of the living and the dead, and the
forgiveness of sins

Again - working on your reading comprehension

Heir has been deluded by the false teachings of Dispensationalism, and has made a mantra out of I Corinthians 15:1-4. According to her, any message other than these exact words repeated (chanted?), is considered another gospel.

She has made herself MAD!