Creation vs. Evolution

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MichaelCadry

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I do not see "personal snipes" as a negative necessarily, because all of us are using our understanding to determine "truth". And I do agree with this quote from Untellectual. Because I pray for the same thing, only I call it "understanding". My point regarding Untellectuals stance is that if humans are just parroting what the Bible says and do not sincerely understand it's application to reality. Then they are doing themselves and all others a disservice, and the argument that they have "truth" is self-defeating. Because they do not really "have truth" if they are parroting something they were taught which cannot be accurately applied to reality. I am sorry you think such a valid criticism is a "personal snipe". I do not see it as such. I see the statement that "I have God's truth, though I am personally incapable of clearly understanding its application to reality." as a copout, and a bit cowardly.

Wonderful Post, noguru!! Just at the right time and in the right instances. I do get upset sometimes. Even Jesus got upset when he overturned the moneychangers tables and said 'this is a house for prayer, and you have turned it into a den of thieves.' When I'm not quoting from the Bible word from word, I don't use quotes. I use half-quotes (apostrophes). Thank you again, buddy!!

May God Overfill Your Cup With His Good Spirit. You are the Cup/vessel!!

Michael
 

MichaelCadry

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Dear Untellectual,

My guardian angel is acting on behalf of the Lord. The angel reports to the Lord if there is something he cannot do, or something is wrong. God is like a corporation. He has servants and angels helping Him. He's not going to go to each separate person and guide you through every second of your life. Don't worry, you're in good hands. I know you don't agree with me, so don't write back with that. I've got to go and get something to eat.

Much Love To You Untellectual,

Michael
 

Jacob

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Dear Untellectual,

My guardian angel is acting on behalf of the Lord. The angel reports to the Lord if there is something he cannot do, or something is wrong. God is like a corporation. He has servants and angels helping Him. He's not going to go to each separate person and guide you through every second of your life. Don't worry, you're in good hands. I know you don't agree with me, so don't write back with that. I've got to go and get something to eat.

Much Love To You Untellectual,

Michael
I don't think you or I know who my guardian angel is. Certainly not a human.
 

Jacob

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Just so you are aware, Michael says some of his angels are really good cooks. On their days off they moonlight at the grill at McDonalds.
Huh?

I don't even know what it means to moonlight. And why would this be an angel or a cook? And why McDonalds?
 

DavisBJ

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I do not see "personal snipes" as a negative necessarily, because all of us are using our understanding to determine "truth"…..

I realize that on the issue of trusting science, you and I are pretty much in lock step. But I would like to see “our side” engage in a whole lot less of what can best be called “poisoning the well” – trying to portray the opponent as someone not to be trusted, rather than focusing on their arguments. A sample of the ways you referred to untellectual and his posts:

“YEC's … chose to belittle or ignore any intellectual ideas which seem to contradict their theological convictions by choosing names like "Untellectual”

“Your screen name is becoming more and more appropriate”

“I doubt you have any valuable discipline to offer. I think your views are based on a loose cannon type approach to the world. That coupled with sloppy thinking is a recipe for disaster”

“godly discipline … you lack that. You may try to compensate for that by trying to attach yourself to "Biblical" principles”

“you might want to add simple logic to your list of weaknesses”

“judging from the current bent you are on, I certainly will not be intimidated by your empty threats of losing my salvation”

“why are you even trying?”

“stop posting Biblical verses to try an bolster your illogic”

“Is this just a platform from which you can broadcast your theological views under the guise of science (though you admittedly know little about the subject”

“Do you think I am stupid?”

“Your logic is faulty, your knowledge is horrendous, and I think you ought to refrain from using poor logic when it is clear you are. Yet, even after all this you will not admit to what you are doing. You will simply slink away mumbling "But I am just trying to point people towards scripture."

“You fail miserably in lots of ways”

“any further discussion with you would be a waste of time and effort. Keep moving on, please”

“you cannot simply hide the evidence by claiming "I do not believe". You are a fool”

“You are getting increasingly slippery … Do you know what that usually signifies?

“trotting out your empty bluster.”

“Your ideas are as clear as a brook right after a sudden intense summer rain. That part is transparent”

“A person who is incompetent eventually shows their true colors.”

“Will you answer these questions squarely? I doubt it. It serves your purpose to conceal the weaknesses of your argument, because it has no strengths. And you think that claims of divine authority can rescue you from that fate.”

“you try to conceal your non-scientific claims with fancy sounding "science" talk.”

“because you are trying to deceive us.”

“You still have not escaped the reality of empiricism, as much as you are trying to wiggle out of it.”

“Untellectual, you certainly are a slippery fellow. I do not trust you as far as I can throw you.”

The list goes on and on. In every single case the put-down could have been replaced by a respectful response. But what is more important is when you go back and read all of those exchanges, almost without exception untellectual responded civilly and with no trace of resorting to impugning your motives or ideas. Judging by the conduct shown, there was only one Christian participating in those exchanges.

As to my objection to focusing on philosophy, first let me quote a few extracts:

“what objective criteria have you used to determine that?” (This phrase appears over and over.)

“So you do accept empiricism as a way to verify/falsify claims for some things?
What percentage?
What objective criteria do you use to determine when we cannot use empiricism?”

“Is this correspondence subjected to any objective criteria…”

“what would you call a "subjective truth" that is not an accurate representation of the "objective truth"?

This list also could go on and on.

In decades of involvement in science, including thousands of planning meetings, untold hours in the lab, and numerous intense discussions with scientists, I can’t recall a single time when we agonized over the understandings of what was meant by “subjective truth”, “objective criteria”, or “objective truth”. We always used simple straightforward English to define our objective and discuss what we actually concluded.

And, if you two pick up that silliness where you left it months ago, and try to continue it, then all bets are off on my part.
 
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alwight

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I was meaning to have a discussion about truth, and I believe God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and the Bible are legitimate sources of truth.
Fair enough but Michael has angels who help with the cooking apparently, but personally I'm not totally convinced of the truth of that.
 

Jacob

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Fair enough but Michael has angels who help with the cooking apparently, but personally I'm not totally convinced of the truth of that.
I think you mean to talk about the Michael on TOL I was just conversing with?

The Bible talks about the devil and his angels.

I know that Michael in the Bible is the archangel, if we can use that term. A prince really?

Jude refers to Michael as well.

But my point was that I don't think Michael on TOL knows anything about my guardian angel.

Does the Bible speak of guardian angels? That would be my source of truth.
 

Jacob

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Moonlighting - The Free Dictionary

To work at another job, often at night …

You will have to ask Michael that one.

Maybe they see an opportunity to put a blessing on each hamburger?
I see no problem with praying at work. I don't know what you mean by a blessing.
 

alwight

New member
I think you mean to talk about the Michael on TOL I was just conversing with?

The Bible talks about the devil and his angels.

I know that Michael in the Bible is the archangel, if we can use that term. A prince really?

Jude refers to Michael as well.

But my point was that I don't think Michael on TOL knows anything about my guardian angel.

Does the Bible speak of guardian angels? That would be my source of truth.
You seem like very ethereal person. :)
 

Mark SeaSigh

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33774ab.jpg


Note how this Modern House Fly, which Was trapped in Amber, Supposedly, 12 Million Years ago, has not Changed at all Anatomically.

Please Feel Free to Explain, how in 12 Million Years this House Fly has not Changed Anatomically, When you consider that Man is Supposed to have Changed Anatomically in 3.2 Million Years, From an Ape Like Being?


=M=

Evolution is a Lie;

Now Watch, another Funny Evol;

For Your Entertainment, Today; OH the Funny Things you Evols Say;


YEC Debates 3 Atheists, if you have the Time, it's Pretty Great


If the TOE Was True, Man would be one of the Oldest Modern Living Creatures, We are the Most Advanced.

We Shouldn't be, The ONLY Living Creature, who are Supposed to Have Speciated, in the Past 10 Million Years.

Sorry, that Makes No Sense. Which is Why I call it Nonsense.
 

DavisBJ

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I was meaning to have a discussion about truth, and I believe God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and the Bible are legitimate sources of truth.
Let me try a different tack from the one noguru tried months ago.

In Genesis, it specifies what type of life forms God brought forth on each day. Do you accept the Genesis account as an accurate and literal description of the order in which life appeared on the earth?
 

Jacob

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Let me try a different tack from the one noguru tried months ago.

In Genesis, it specifies what type of life forms God brought forth on each day. Do you accept the Genesis account as an accurate and literal description of the order in which life appeared on the earth?
I accept the Biblical account of creation as recorded in scripture.

As for truth, you would be addressing science and the Bible or religion (I am guessing).

I am talking about the word of God, the word of truth, that converts that soul and brings a person salvation.
 
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