Christians worship Christ; JW's do not!

[popsthebuilder]

Um, nooo, I'm pretty sure it says "each one's work"... Not the individual himself.

Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw,each one’s work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one’s work, of what sort it is.If anyone’s work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward.If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire. - 1 Corinthians 3:12-15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1Corinthians3:12-15&version=NKJV

1 Corinthians 3: 9. Apollos and I are simply fellow workers for and with God, and you are *God's* field-- *God's* building. 10. In discharge of the task which God graciously entrusted to me, I--like a competent master-builder--have laid a foundation, and others are building upon it. But let every one be careful how and what he builds. 11. For no one can lay any other foundation in addition to that which is already laid, namely Jesus Christ. 12. And whether the building which any one is erecting on that foundation be of gold or silver or costly stones, of timber or hay or straw-- 13. the true character of each individual's work will become manifest. For the day of Christ will disclose it, because that day is soon to come upon us clothed in fire, and as for the quality of every one's work-- the fire is the thing which will test it. 14. If any one's work--the building which he has erected--stands the test, he will be rewarded. 15. If any one's work is burnt up, he will suffer the loss of it; yet he will himself be rescued, but only, as it were, by passing through the fire. 16. Do you not know that you are God's Sanctuary, and that the Spirit of God has His home within you? 17. If any one is marring the Sanctuary of God,

him will God mar;

for the Sanctuary of God is holy, which you all are. 18. Let no one deceive himself. If any man imagines that he is wise, compared with the rest of you, with the wisdom of the present age, let him become "foolish" so that he may be wise. 19. This world's wisdom is "foolishness" in God's sight; for it is written, <"He snares the wise with their own cunning."> 20. And again, <"The Lord takes knowledge of the reasonings of the wise--how useless they are.">

( I never meant an actual believer would be eternally destroyed; an actual believer would inhearently be good, being the temple and all)

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[popsthebuilder]

10Whoever believes in the Son of God accepts this testimony. Whoever does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because they have not believed the testimony God has given about his Son.

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God" (1 John 5:10, 13).

"believe" is always present tense....

And "believe" and "commit" are the same word.



Now that's an assumption!

What is the point of the verses you provided?

I'm glad I was wrong, but I did miss your point. What is your argument?

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[drbrumley]

What is the point of the verses you provided?

I'm glad I was wrong, but I did miss your point. What is your argument?

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Post 2077 and 2078..

 

[Tambora]

Let us see your proof?

Will you pay attention this time?

 

[popsthebuilder]

Post 2077 and 2078..

Oh.... great.....now explain what you mean please.

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[KingdomRose]

Then it is in our best interest to show those who read this thread, who are willing to learn, how what she says is not true, and to provide THE ONLY TRUE alternative to her cult, Jesus Christ who is Jehovah God.

Jesus Christ is NOT Jehovah, and anyone who loves the truth can readily discern this. All those who look on will hopefully research this and see for themselves that they are two separate Beings. Can you explain how Jehovah can be talking to Himself at Psalm 110? Can you explain why Jehovah would anoint Himself and send Himself at Isaiah 61:1,2? Or are you just going to call me names again?

 

[KingdomRose]

KR, what is your cults interpretation of Genesis 1:26? "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

We believe that Jehovah was speaking to His Son, Jesus Christ. But you think that Jehovah was talking to Himself, right?

 

[KingdomRose]

Watch this be ignored.

Demand they refute it.

Feel free to repost.

We have refuted it strongly many times! It's not difficult to do. I just asked anyone to explain how Jehovah could be talking to Himself and "anointing" and "sending" Himself (Psalm 110; Isaiah 61), and if you can explain why He would do such a thing, would you do that?

 

[KingdomRose]

Done.

I can take this apart very readily. After you answer my question about Psalm 110 and Isaiah 61.

 

[KingdomRose]

Yup. Works-based salvation and anti-trin usually go together.

We "anti-trins" keep saying over and over that we do not believe we can earn our way to heaven (or paradise Earth). You choose to ignore what we say and keep on spreading lies about what we believe.

 

[KingdomRose]

Response to post # 1998: Good work, Cherub. Do you really think any of them will bother to read it? I think they just want to tear down people that disagree with them and call names. And they say we don't rebut what they say! There is a good rebuttal, but it won't be scrutinized by any of them.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Response to post # 1998: Good work, Cherub. Do you really think any of them will bother to read it? I think they just want to tear down people that disagree with them and call names. And they say we don't rebut what they say! There is a good rebuttal, but it won't be scrutinized by any of them.

It won't be read because it violates TOL's post length rule.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Jesus Christ is NOT Jehovah, and anyone who loves the truth can readily discern this. All those who look on will hopefully research this and see for themselves that they are two separate Beings. Can you explain how Jehovah can be talking to Himself at Psalm 110? Can you explain why Jehovah would anoint Himself and send Himself at Isaiah 61:1,2? Or are you just going to call me names again?

See here.

Nope. God dwells with those who have been made (past tense) righteous, not those who are trying to make themselves righteous.

If the people whom Marhig is describing are truly Christians, then God Christ's righteousness imparted to them, regardless of what they have done.



"Being saved?" You clearly didn't comprehend what I said.

They ARE ALREADY saved, NOTHING they do or can do will separate them from spending the rest of eternity with God.

Their salvation is a done deal. Their sins (all of them, past, present, and future sins) are covered by Christ's blood, past tense, not present tense, not future tense.

Yes, it saddens God that they do those things, and it certainly doesn't bring glory to Him, but that does not and cannot change the fact that, if they are indeed Christians, whenever God looks at them, He doesn't see their sin, He sees the righteousness of His Son, Jesus Christ.



Nope.



*Son of God



And rightly so. By saying Christ is just the son of God, and not God Himself come in the flesh, by denying Christ's deity, you devalue His gift, rendering it unable to save even one person.

Marhig, Is God not the most valuable commodity? Is not God infinitely worth more than any created being? And are the wages of sin death (ie, separation)? If so, how can anyone who sins pay their ransom? Is not one sin enough to condemn someone to eternal separation from God? How then could even one perfect created being pay for even one sin, let alone for every sin ever committed?

Let's say that you never sinned, and will never sin, how could you, a created being, die for every sin ever committed, being committed, and ever will be committed, when your perfect, sinless life would only be enough to pay for one sin? You would need something that is infinitely greater than one created being to pay for all of every created beings' sins. ONLY GOD HIMSELF could pay that price.

And He did, God the Son came as a Man, and paid the price for sin, so that no man would have to pay for his own sin.

This is why a rejection of the deity of Christ means that one is not saved, because if Christ is not God, then the person who rejects the above cannot be saved, because the debt could not have been paid.

Denying Christ's deity is a denial of salvation itself.

That's why it's a salvation issue.

That's why JWs are not saved, because they reject salvation by denying Christ's God-ship.



Scripture says that No man can ransom his life for another, but that only God can save.

Spoiler

None of them can by any means redeem his brother, Nor give to God a ransom for him—For the redemption of their souls is costly, And it shall cease forever—That he should continue to live eternally, And not see the Pit. . . . But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave, For He shall receive me. Selah - Psalm 49:7-9,15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Psalm49:7-9,15&version=NKJV

I'm asking if they were Christians, or were they unbelievers?

As for isaiah 61...

Just reading it plainly, I'm pretty sure Isaiah himself is speaking... So as for God anointing and sending Isaiah, is that so hard to comprehend? Why do you think that this is a problem text for me? My paradigm of beliefs has no problem texts, and not because I just explain the problem texts away, but because there literally are no problem texts. Sure, parts of the text is prefiguring Christ.

Psalm 110...?

Sounds like David is describing God the Father talking to God the Son. I don't see why this is a problem for trinitarians. It would be a problem for non-trinitarians, because it would mean that God is telling a created being to sit at God's right hand, a place of honor no created being is worthy of...

KR, Is God not the most valuable commodity? Is not God infinitely worth more than any created being? And are the wages of sin death (ie, separation)? If so, how can anyone who sins pay their ransom? Is not one sin enough to condemn someone to eternal separation from God? How then could even one perfect created being pay for even one sin, let alone for every sin ever committed?

Let's say that you never sinned, and will never sin, how could you, a created being, die for every sin ever committed, being committed, and ever will be committed, when your perfect, sinless life would only be enough to pay for one sin? You would need something that is infinitely greater than one created being to pay for all of every created beings' sins. ONLY GOD HIMSELF could pay that price.

And He did, God the Son came as a Man, and paid the price for sin, so that no man would have to pay for his own sin.

This is why a rejection of the deity of Christ means that one is not saved, because if Christ is not God, then the person who rejects the above cannot be saved, because the debt could not have been paid.

Denying Christ's deity is a denial of salvation itself.

That's why it's a salvation issue.

That's why JWs are not saved, because they reject salvation by denying Christ's God-ship.

 

[KingdomRose]

Response to post #2093:

Seems like your post is almost as long as CR's.:think: Well anyway, I don't understand why you think GOD has to die for mankind. The Scriptures don't say that anywhere. In fact, Paul brings out that a man comparable to ADAM is what is required of the Ransomer. Not God. Can you provide a scripture that says that God must die for mankind?

"For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous." (Romans 5:19, NIV)

"For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive." (I Corinthians 15:21,22, NIV)


This is not to say that Christ was ONLY a man. He was much more---a perfect man, come from above. But it shows that what was required to die for us was not GOD, but a man, a perfect man that obeyed God and willingly gave up his life for us. If Jesus hadn't done it, any other perfect man could have. Jehovah would have had to send down another angel to become a human on Earth. But Jesus gladly came, and he was faithful to the end of his earthly life.

If he was God, he wouldn't have had to be obedient to ANYBODY, would he? God isn't obedient to anyone else. He has all authority and power. But Jesus was obedient, to his Father. And because of that God GAVE him more power and authority than he had even before he came to Earth.

Jesus humbled himself and became obedient as far as death, and "for this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly GAVE him the name that is above every other name." (Philippians 2:8,9)


Are you going to show us where in Scripture it says that God had to die?

 

[KingdomRose]

BTW, you are wrong about Isaiah being the one that was anointed by Jehovah. Jesus applied Isaiah 61:1,2 to himself, at LUKE 4:17-21.

Peter applied Psalm 110 to Jesus at ACTS 2:34,35.


Anyone who reads this will be able to see my point.

 

[Apple7]

Who knows, maybe next they'll be calling Trinitarians; Nazis and Communists?

And Trump supporters...

 

[Apple7]

We have refuted it strongly many times! It's not difficult to do. I just asked anyone to explain how Jehovah could be talking to Himself and "anointing" and "sending" Himself (Psalm 110; Isaiah 61), and if you can explain why He would do such a thing, would you do that?

Are you so dull that you do not yet know that Yahweh has always conversed with Yahweh in scripture?

 

[Tambora]

Jesus Christ is NOT Jehovah,

He is YHWH, as is the Father and the Holy Spirit.

 

[Tambora]

We believe that Jehovah was speaking to His Son, Jesus Christ. But you think that Jehovah was talking to Himself, right?

GOD is a unity that interacts with and has a relationship with the other members of the unity, not a singular person.

 

[Tambora]

We have refuted it strongly many times! It's not difficult to do. I just asked anyone to explain how Jehovah could be talking to Himself and "anointing" and "sending" Himself (Psalm 110; Isaiah 61), and if you can explain why He would do such a thing, would you do that?

None of the 3 persons of the Godhead do send themself, silly.
Sometimes the Father sends the Son, and sometimes the Son sends the Holy Spirit, but none of them send themself.