Christian Kids in the Public School

[The Barbarian]

(regarding antiChristian claim about public school employees)

Barbarian observes:
I know quite a number of committed Christians who work for various public school systems. And I must say, they are generally much better imitations of Christ than you have so far shown us.

That's because you don't know Christ very well.

You don't know who is imitating Him better or not.

He left us specific instructions. It's in a book called the "Bible." Read it and learn.

Barbarian observes:
If that's your attempt to follow Him, I would have to say that you don't have a clue about Him. He didn't hide from the world; He went out into it and let His light shine in the darkness. This is one of the reasons why Christians don't hide from the world.

Christ would have been appalled at Christians sending their children to be indoctrinated in whatever the gov't tried to mold them as.

The Bible does not tell us to rebell against the government, but in this case, it's a school board elected by the community. If you don't like the values in your community, why would you live there?

Barbarian observes:
If you haven't trained them by school age, you are indeed "throwing them to the wolves", even if you keep them home.

You think kids can be strong in their convictions by 5 years old?

Mine were. They were around all sorts of people, and they remained faithful to Him.

You really are an idiot.

Sorry about your kids. I did say that you had to raise them right, if you were going to make them able to resist the world.

Barbarian observes:
And you don't have to be afraid of it. Study after study shows that one's children, for all the rebellion they show still look to parents for their assumptions and beliefs. Even if they go to public school.

And that's why they leave the church over 80% of the time after high school?

Barbarian observes:
If their parents haven't given them adequate grounding in God and His plans for us. The figure is way too high, but if you've done a poor job then your kids might reject your beliefs. Mine didn't.

Thanks for admitting that without the parent's constant attention, the kids will turn from them.

"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.

That's all we need to know about what direction this gov't wants to take your kids in.

Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.

I noticed you mentioned that one of your children turned atheist for a while.

He flirted with the idea. Now he's strong in the Lord. Many other great Christians have had that experience.

My kids won't even do that. Your kids were not as grounded as you thought they were.

We know mine were, because they are all Christians. It's yours we don't know about, yet.

Barbarian observes:
You give the opposite impression. You seem to think your beliefs are too fragile to be allowed outside in the sun.

I take my beliefs to the public all the time. My kids will do the same when they are ready.

Sounds like you're not very secure in what you believe, then.

Yes, children are not strong enough to battle with adults and win. I don't know where you get the idea they are.

You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.

Barbarian observes:
My kids had a robust Christian faith, which wasn't shaken when they met others who had weak faith or none at all. I feel sorry for those who didn't raise their kids that way.

Except when they got to college, right? And you think the professors in college were more intent on molding your kids in a way you did not want more than grade-school teachers?

Some were. But they lost out to God. I hope, against all the evidence, He'll keep your kids in His fold.

Barbarian observes:
They are orthodox trinitarian Christians. You're not the only person who claims we're "muddled." But you're the first one who claims to be a Christian.

Well, I'm glad finally someone loved you enough to warn you about your muddled beliefs.

Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?

Barbarian on raising children.
I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

Age 5.

Yep. Worked just fine. They all have their Christian faith.

You're not just an idiot, you are cruel as well.

You seem deeply offended that they were stronger than you think your kids are. Did you know that scripture has something to say about this?
Proverbs 22:6 Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it.

Follow God, not your own desires, and it will work out right.

BTW, you make nice use of the figure "locked in the basement".

Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

This statement doesn't include at least 1 figure of speech?

Unfortunately, it's literally true in many cases.

Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian, I just thought I would give you heads up. ^_^ I do plan on continuing this discussion with you, but I'm very busy today, and I have an overnight orientation, and then I'm busy on Monday. So if you could wait until Tuesday or Wednesday, I'll have a reply ready for you. ^_^

No problem. You know, your dad can't be too far off the path, if he raised a kid like you.

 

[PKevman]

(regarding antiChristian claim about public school employees)

Barbarian observes:
I know quite a number of committed Christians who work for various public school systems. And I must say, they are generally much better imitations of Christ than you have so far shown us.



He left us specific instructions. It's in a book called the "Bible." Read it and learn.

Barbarian observes:
If that's your attempt to follow Him, I would have to say that you don't have a clue about Him. He didn't hide from the world; He went out into it and let His light shine in the darkness. This is one of the reasons why Christians don't hide from the world.



The Bible does not tell us to rebell against the government, but in this case, it's a school board elected by the community. If you don't like the values in your community, why would you live there?

Barbarian observes:
If you haven't trained them by school age, you are indeed "throwing them to the wolves", even if you keep them home.



Mine were. They were around all sorts of people, and they remained faithful to Him.



Sorry about your kids. I did say that you had to raise them right, if you were going to make them able to resist the world.

Barbarian observes:
And you don't have to be afraid of it. Study after study shows that one's children, for all the rebellion they show still look to parents for their assumptions and beliefs. Even if they go to public school.



Barbarian observes:
If their parents haven't given them adequate grounding in God and His plans for us. The figure is way too high, but if you've done a poor job then your kids might reject your beliefs. Mine didn't.



"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.



Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.



He flirted with the idea. Now he's strong in the Lord. Many other great Christians have had that experience.



We know mine were, because they are all Christians. It's yours we don't know about, yet.

Barbarian observes:
You give the opposite impression. You seem to think your beliefs are too fragile to be allowed outside in the sun.



Sounds like you're not very secure in what you believe, then.



You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.

Barbarian observes:
My kids had a robust Christian faith, which wasn't shaken when they met others who had weak faith or none at all. I feel sorry for those who didn't raise their kids that way.



Some were. But they lost out to God. I hope, against all the evidence, He'll keep your kids in His fold.

Barbarian observes:
They are orthodox trinitarian Christians. You're not the only person who claims we're "muddled." But you're the first one who claims to be a Christian.



Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?

Barbarian on raising children.
I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.



Yep. Worked just fine. They all have their Christian faith.



You seem deeply offended that they were stronger than you think your kids are. Did you know that scripture has something to say about this?
Proverbs 22:6 Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it.

Follow God, not your own desires, and it will work out right.



Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.



Unfortunately, it's literally true in many cases.

Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.

Barbarian, your posts would be a little easier to follow and more readable if you would learn to use the quote system for your own PAST quotes as well. This makes it easier to split apart what you said with what you are currently saying, and then also quote the person you are talking to.

Thanks for considering this, just a little constructive criticism to help you out.

 

[Layla]

How about the fact that we've been in Iraq for 4 years now, and 60% of 18-24yr olds can't even find it on the map. Actually, ask any U.S. kid where George Washington was born and I doubt they could tell you on the spot.

How does this prove that people who criticize public school have dumb kids? :idunno:

 

[Layla]

What in the world does that have to do with homeschooling? 60% of 18-24 year olds didn't homeschool. And, the ones who did can find Iraq on the map and, chances are, do know where George Washington was born.

Didn't see this. Good reply. :up:

 

[Yorzhik]

Mine were. They were around all sorts of people, and they remained faithful to Him.

My kids are around all kinds of people from the day they are born. But I don't send them to battle their worldview at age 5 like they would have to in public school. That you think children are ready for this at age 5 is enough to know you are, at best, fooling yourself.

"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.

Constant, regular, whatever. The point is you know you are putting your kids into a battle of worldviews. There simply isn't a need for it.

Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.

I'm no more paranoid than you admit in the second sentence.

You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.

If you are using "atheists" as an all encompassing term to refer to any form of trying to overturn the parents authority or Christian worldview, then it isn't crazy. In fact it's only agreeing with your many statements in the dialog that good parenting can overcome it.

Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?

This isn't defamation as much as warning you so you can have the truth. Not only would I like you to have the truth, but I'm sure if you were wrong you would prefer that I point it out to you. That's all I'm doing.

You seem deeply offended that they were stronger than you think your kids are.

You're assessment is wrong. I'm sorry for you that you think your kids at age 5 were ready for battling ideas with adults. You can claim they were strong enough, but your own statements say what you know to be the truth but are unwilling to admit directly.

Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

And you think this is normal enough to make a general statement about it? This statement doesn't include 2 figures in it?: "I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life."

Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.

Thanks for being patronizing, it is a revelation into your soul. But just so you know, I'm not embarrassed or angry. And I've been calling you names, calmly, I think at least by the second post we exchanged. But they aren't names as much as labels on the kind of person you are. I realize my help will probably go unheeded, but it's the best I can do for you.

Oh, and one more thing. It's my imitation of Christ that leads me to call you names. So you see, I'm taking your good advice. You should take my good advice and stop promoting sending 5 year olds to the battlefield of ideas we call public schools when the opposition is sending not only adults, but setting the terms as well.

 

[Lighthouse]

Barbarian observes:
The smartest people I've every met came out of public schools systems. And I've spent a lot of years in universities, with a lot of really smart people.

And there are many promiscuous and drug using people who were not from public school systems. But without verifiable numbers, it means very little. The key is, we both might be right. Public school is where you find some kids who don't want to be there, and don't do well. It's also where most of our Nobel Prize winners went to school. What's the difference? Parents. The children of good parents will thrive and succeed in public schools. Those with indifferent or poor parents, not so much. Act accordingly with your own kids.

How many home-schooled Nobel winners are there? It could happen, not long ago, a home-schooled kid won a major academic prize. But his parents were PhDs, who were secular in outlook.

(and now an example of a well-reasoned homeschooler argument)



:crackup:

That just goes to show how ignorant you are. I wasn't homeschooled.

 

[The Barbarian]

(Barbarian points out facts)

Lighthouse comes up with a typical homeschooler argument:
"You're an idiot."

(Barbarian laughs)

That just goes to show how ignorant you are. I wasn't homeschooled

But you do homeschool your kids, don't you? You certainly argue like a homeschooler. :rotfl:

 

[The Barbarian]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian
Mine were. They were around all sorts of people, and they remained faithful to Him.

My kids are around all kinds of people from the day they are born. But I don't send them to battle their worldview at age 5 like they would have to in public school.

If you think kindergarten is like that in a public school, I think I see the problem. You can't live in fear and suspicion like that, if you want your to have a chance to grow up to be productive adults.

That you think children are ready for this at age 5 is enough to know you are, at best, fooling yourself.

If you don't think 5 YOs are ready for kindergarten, I'd say you had a tenuous grasp on reality at best.

Barbarian observes:
"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.

Constant, regular, whatever.

I used to teach 12-YO kids. I wish I had a nickle for everytime I heard that one in the halls. It's what passes for cleverness among 6th graders.

The point is you know you are putting your kids into a battle of worldviews.

Nope. In fact one teacher was a religious education teacher at my church. Maybe it's the kind of community in which you live.

Barbarian suggests:
Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.

I'm no more paranoid than you admit in the second sentence.

I read the denial, but then your behavior is more persuasive.

Barbarian laughs
You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.

If you are using "atheists" as an all encompassing term to refer to any form of trying to overturn the parents authority or Christian worldview, then it isn't crazy.

If you want to go that far, then it's paranoid and crazy. Do you honest to God believe that?

In fact it's only agreeing with your many statements in the dialog that good parenting can overcome it.

I'd be pretty upset if a teacher tried to do "parenting." In my district, they get fired for that.

Barbarian asks:
Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?

This isn't defamation as much as warning you so you can have the truth.

I don't think you and truth have been in hailing distance for some time.

Barbarian on his kids:
You seem deeply offended that they were stronger than you think your kids are.

You're assessment is wrong. I'm sorry for you that you think your kids at age 5 were ready for battling ideas with adults.

You think that's what kindergarten is? No wonder you act that way.

You can claim they were strong enough, but your own statements say what you know to be the truth but are unwilling to admit directly.

I think you're starting to imagine things, again.

Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

And you think this is normal enough to make a general statement about it?

A lot more common than school boards deciding to turn kids into atheists. You can't come up with one example of that, but you believe it. On the other hand, there are numerous such cases every year of parents locking their kids in and refusing to let them leave the house even for school.

Barbarian suggests:
Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.

Thanks for being patronizing,

I'm quite sincere. You need to get your priorities in line with God. And acting like that is not the way to do it.

And I've been calling you names, calmly, I think at least by the second post we exchanged.

I bet you scream calmly, too... :rotfl:

Oh, and one more thing. It's my imitation of Christ that leads me to call you names.

I think we all understand where you're coming from, now. :kookoo:

 

[PKevman]

(Barbarian points out facts)

Lighthouse comes up with a typical homeschooler argument:
"You're an idiot."

(Barbarian laughs)



But you do homeschool your kids, don't you? You certainly argue like a homeschooler. :rotfl:

TB. Lighthouse doesn't have any kids. Just thought I'd help ya out there. :rotfl:

 

[PKevman]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian
Mine were. They were around all sorts of people, and they remained faithful to Him.



If you think kindergarten is like that in a public school, I think I see the problem. You can't live in fear and suspicion like that, if you want your to have a chance to grow up to be productive adults.



If you don't think 5 YOs are ready for kindergarten, I'd say you had a tenuous grasp on reality at best.

Barbarian observes:
"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.



I used to teach 12-YO kids. I wish I had a nickle for everytime I heard that one in the halls. It's what passes for cleverness among 6th graders.



Nope. In fact one teacher was a religious education teacher at my church. Maybe it's the kind of community in which you live.

Barbarian suggests:
Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.



I read the denial, but then your behavior is more persuasive.

Barbarian laughs
You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.



If you want to go that far, then it's paranoid and crazy. Do you honest to God believe that?



I'd be pretty upset if a teacher tried to do "parenting." In my district, they get fired for that.

Barbarian asks:
Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?



I don't think you and truth have been in hailing distance for some time.

Barbarian on his kids:
You seem deeply offended that they were stronger than you think your kids are.



You think that's what kindergarten is? No wonder you act that way.



I think you're starting to imagine things, again.

Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.



A lot more common than school boards deciding to turn kids into atheists. You can't come up with one example of that, but you believe it. On the other hand, there are numerous such cases every year of parents locking their kids in and refusing to let them leave the house even for school.

Barbarian suggests:
Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.



I'm quite sincere. You need to get your priorities in line with God. And acting like that is not the way to do it.



I bet you scream calmly, too... :rotfl:



I think we all understand where you're coming from, now. :kookoo:

Barbarian, I hate to seem as if I'm nitpicking you, but it would make it so much easier to read your posts if you format them a bit differently. Just something to think about. It's hard to tell often what you are currently saying and what you had said in previous posts. I would like to encourage you to use the quotes for yourself as well as the person you are quoting when you are quoting things you said previously.

You can ignore this if you want, but it is just a friendly suggestion.

 

[Ktoyou]

Barbarian, are you saying a five-year-old is too young to start kindergarten?

I started first grade at age 5 and was the second youngest, turning six after a few months, the younger one turned six later in the same month, we both were top students in our class, despite him being a cut-up of a boy. I always liked him; he played the donkey in the Christmas pageant in the second grade. Funny I can remember that?

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian, are you saying a five-year-old is too young to start kindergarten?

No, of course not. Lighthouse seems to think so.

I started first grade at age 5 and was the second youngest, turning six after a few months, the younger one turned six later in the same month, we both were top students in our class, despite him being a cut-up of a boy. I always liked him; he played the donkey in the Christmas pageant in the second grade. Funny I can remember that?

Some of my best memories are from that time.

Don't tell Lighthouse; he thinks that if you go to kindergarten, you will have to struggle with adults who will try to make you an atheist.:shocked:

 

[The Barbarian]

Barbarian, I hate to seem as if I'm nitpicking you, but it would make it so much easier to read your posts if you format them a bit differently. Just something to think about. It's hard to tell often what you are currently saying and what you had said in previous posts. I would like to encourage you to use the quotes for yourself as well as the person you are quoting when you are quoting things you said previously.

Because there is no way in the TO system to keep track of multiple posters in one post, the quotes system can be confusing. Here's a more effective way:

1. What you write currently, leave plain.
2. Use quotes for the person to whom you are responding
3. Use bolded text for others, or for cites from other places.
4. Use italics for titles of cited work.

This came about from a long time on Usenet, where UBcode wasn't available. I think if you try it, you'll find that it works much better.

And confusion will be minimized. I don't mind doing what you suggest, but I'm just pointing out that there is a better way.

But I'm fighting a very long and deeply ingrained habit.

 

[Ktoyou]

Oh ok, yes, those childhood memories stay with one throughout life it seems. All I know about Lighthouse is he thinks he is more conservative than I am and maybe he is.

 

[The Barbarian]

"Conservative" isn't a synomym for "paranoid." It hardly needs to be said that anyone who thinks kids go to kindergarten only to struggle with adults trying to make them atheist, is not "conservative" in any dictionary definition.

 

[ebenz47037]

Because there is no way in the TO system to keep track of multiple posters in one post, the quotes system can be confusing.

Yes there is. TOL now has the "multi-quote" feature. If you look down at the lower right corner of each post, there's a button that looks like it has two pieces of paper on it. Click that button on each post that you want to quote. When you get to the last one, click "Quote" and you will have a message with all of the quotes from the board that you want to answer (with the tags). All you have to do is add your comments between each quote.

 

[Yorzhik]

Originally Posted by The Barbarian
If you think kindergarten is like that in a public school, I think I see the problem. You can't live in fear and suspicion like that, if you want your to have a chance to grow up to be productive adults.

I like your debate style. It's engaging the topic without having to dig into an issue.

But let's see if we can dig just a little bit just for fun.

I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life.

Why for life? Why not make them wolf-proof and then let them out?

I did. If they aren't ready to be in public by age 5, you blew it.

You were trapped by the logical conclusions of your own claims that said if kids are ready for the public school system, they are ready for it at the start. And that's what you started to say in the final quote of this series. But that was untenable on it's face so you changed the subject. Suddenly you didn't want to support having kids ready for the public school system at the beginning of their public school career, rather you preferred to limit the entire career of public school and change it to kindergarten only.

So, I propose we get off the straw man of whether 5 year olds can handle kindergarten, and get back on the topic. You can start again here:

Why for life? Why not make them wolf-proof and then let them out?

If you don't think 5 YOs are ready for kindergarten, I'd say you had a tenuous grasp on reality at best.

I would have included this with the quote above, but I'd just like to help you with your hypocrisy. This insult is not very Christ-like. So you can either stop being insulting, or you can stop saying that the descriptions I use for you (like "idiot") are not Christ-like.

Barbarian observes:
"Constant?" Nope. Just regularly. That's all it takes. You only need to be concerned if you neglected to do that.

Constant, regular, whatever.

I used to teach 12-YO kids. I wish I had a nickle for everytime I heard that one in the halls. It's what passes for cleverness among 6th graders.

Oh, you thought I was trying to be clever? How imperceptive of you. I was merely pointing out that constant attention and regular attention make no difference in the context of this conversation.

Oops, I'm wrong for accusing you of imperceptiveness when it is probably more likely you deliberately changed what was being talked about. You realized again that you were trapped by the logical conclusion of your argument. The conclusion to your argument being that attention, either as little as regular or as much as constant, shows that you know there is a battle that you have to engage in against the public school system.

And by the way, that's another nice insult. Do you ever apologize when you are wrong?

The point is you know you are putting your kids into a battle of worldviews.

Nope. In fact one teacher was a religious education teacher at my church. Maybe it's the kind of community in which you live.

One teacher? That was your best response? This response can be used to correctly identify you as an idiot. Again, you see how the logical conclusion to your argument traps you and so you need to change "the public school system" to "one teacher". Likewise, if you knew about this subject, you would realize that the teachers that make the system seem good when it isn't. Overall, the public school system requires either constant or regular attention by parents to correct the worldview errors that are introduced by the vast majority of teachers in the system, regardless of the community one is in.

The Barbarian continues with the insults, this time expanding his insults to my community. Will this continue?

Barbarian suggests:
Sounds like you're more than a little paranoid about the goverment. I think the government is usually the problem, but in this case, they aren't competent enough to win out over good parenting. Bad parenting, maybe.

No, really, if you are having your kids raised by a system that is founded on incompetents, it will affect your children.

Bad parenting... I think that qualifies again as an insult.

I'm no more paranoid than you admit in the second sentence.

I read the denial, but then your behavior is more persuasive.

No, my paranoia is only as great as what you've admitted. Can you show what behavior is beyond that?

Barbarian laughs
You think adults in public school try to make kids into atheists? That's a truly crazy idea.

If you are using "atheists" as an all encompassing term to refer to any form of trying to overturn the parents authority or Christian worldview, then it isn't crazy.

If you want to go that far, then it's paranoid and crazy. Do you honest to God believe that?

It depends. How are you using the word "atheist"? I notice you didn't explain yourself, but I realize you again trapped yourself with the logical conclusions of your claims. You want to change the terms of "opposing worldview" which could be a number of -ism's that you would rather your children not be indoctrinated with to "atheism only". And yes, if it were atheism only then you are talking about a strawman that we aren't discussing and I would be crazy to try and fit that discussion into this one.

I'd also like to get your take on how people are Christ-like or not in their name-calling. Is it only certain insults?

In fact it's only agreeing with your many statements in the dialog that good parenting can overcome it.

I'd be pretty upset if a teacher tried to do "parenting." In my district, they get fired for that.

The antecedent to "it" at the end of my quote was not "parenting". Try to answer the question again.

I'm curious, why do you have "parenting" in quotes? What do you think "parenting" is?

I was beginning to respect your debate style, but I'm realizing that you cannot defend your ideas. I'm certainly impressed with your ability to insult.

Barbarian asks:
Christians have been called worse than "muddled." That's your best attempt at defaming us?

This isn't defamation as much as warning you so you can have the truth.

I don't think you and truth have been in hailing distance for some time.

You're making a liar out of me. I just get done complementing you on your ability to insult and your next insulting quote is decidedly lacking wit.

But as far as my comment goes; I try to help people and all I get back is this? You should be more open minded.

You think that's what kindergarten is? No wonder you act that way.

reference above

You can claim they were strong enough, but your own statements say what you know to be the truth but are unwilling to admit directly.

I think you're starting to imagine things, again.

No. Statements like parents needing to regularly correct what they learn in school, or statements that one teacher is a good Christian, statements like your son dallied in atheism when he should be an adult, statements that avoid talking about the logic conclusions of starting kids off at the age of 5 in a system that will try to mold them into something that you don't want.

Barbarian observes:
I wish it was. Every year we read about people who think their kids are going to be corrupted by the world, and lock them in the house.

And you think this is normal enough to make a general statement about it?

A lot more common than school boards deciding to turn kids into atheists. You can't come up with one example of that, but you believe it. On the other hand, there are numerous such cases every year of parents locking their kids in and refusing to let them leave the house even for school.

So, how normal is it? 10 cases a year? How many cases in the last 20 years and how many kids were raised in the last generation? Do you think it's important enough to discuss in this conversation? Remember, you brought it up. I'll bet you have some weird need to avoid saying this was a figure of speech:"I believe in making them wolf-proof. Works better. Unless you plan on keeping them locked in the basement for life."

Barbarian suggests:
Look, you're embarassed and upset, and calling names. That won't make things better for you. If you read the Bible, do the right thing by your kids, and try to make your life an imitation of Christ, it will all work out right.

Getting angry and verbally abusive won't help. Think about it and try a little harder.

If you had any substance to your arguments, I might be inclined to listen to this advice. But you have neither support for your claims nor do you put together statements logically.

I'm quite sincere. You need to get your priorities in line with God. And acting like that is not the way to do it.

Acting like what? Calling an idiot an idiot? Wouldn't you agree that God would be happy with that?

Let me ask you this: is it wrong to judge?

I bet you scream calmly, too... :rotfl:

What's this? As your arguments get less effective your wit disappears as well? I know you can do better than this.

I think we all understand where you're coming from, now. :kookoo:

Another Christ-like insult?

 

[One Post Wonder]

"Conservative" isn't a synomym for "paranoid." It hardly needs to be said that anyone who thinks kids go to kindergarten only to struggle with adults trying to make them atheist, is not "conservative" in any dictionary definition.

My mommy and daddy aren't paranoid. They just think it's safer for me at home than it is in public school. But, every once in a while, I get to go stand outside in the back yard and see what the sun and the trees and the grass look like. And, I really like it when the....What's it called?...:idea: Oh yeah! The wind blows across my face in the summer time.

 

[PKevman]

Yorzhik in post #658 effectively formats his post, and in the process annihlates Barbarian to smithereenies! Way to go brother! :up: