Biblical Flat Enclosed Earth and Firmament

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daqq

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Yeah, I just saw a circle squared or whatever yesterday. I'm just saying it's possible with God with the "line" that daqq was focused on. It COULD also explain the Four Corners of the earth. I'll see if I can find an image. If you can, look at my posts on the last few pages to see what my interpretations are. It would help moving forward, if you want to.

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OnstottS1-Scott-AoM-essay_html_120cbe7d.jpg

Haha, nope, and as a matter of fact, if you want to maintain your "literalness" you now need to switch over to the flat-square model so that you can have four literal corners to the earth. I've already seen a picture or two of that model here somewhere. :)
 

Right Divider

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Possible. Could be the actual heavens. Just like flat earth theory, And the theory of gravity. And refraction theories and various forms of it. There's many more scriptures than that. Are all the scriptures about foundations of earth and heaven figurative or allegorical? All of them? Or that the earth is fixed, immovable, established, etc.? Does God place the earth or set the earth in the firmament at any time in scripture, which is required for a flying rotating ball, obviously? It's only scientific after all.
Fixed and immovable does NOT mean "not moving relative to all of the other things that God created".

And again, from the PERSONS point of view, it appears that the earth is not moving and everything else is. There is no problem with viewing things from the earth as the frame of reference and that is what the Bible generally does.

God can, and according some, DID or probably did the act of stopping the sun and moon for about a day but not the earth or anything else. Never mentions stopping the earth or the sky which to you, seems to always include the firmament. Or according to the Hebrew, you pointed out, I should say. English is no longer enough, never has been enough, right? No I don't know how cameras work or digital, or electronic images work. But if we can't get one UNALTERED picture or image, like a snapshot or a Polaroid Picture type image unaltered in any way, then I can't believe it 100%. You know exactly what I mean but you sidestep it like, many issues. Will you ever admit that a flat earth and firmament that is enclosed, is POSSIBLE? Or is it just plain impossible?
We have UNALTERED pictures from beyond the earth. You just reject them out of hand.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/10/science/An-Image-of-Earth-Every-Ten-Minutes.html
 

daqq

Well-known member
There's a 50/50 chance we're IN the earth as the Bible says

Yeah, I don't know about you but I am indeed IN the earth-land, (eretz), and adamah-soil, (of the heart, parable of the sower). And my earth indeed also has support pillars: and at the base of each pillar are footings: and at the extremity of each footing are five toes, (lol). And around Gan Eden is an enclosure, like a cistern, a solid rakia, and therein is Eretz Havilah, and the gold of that land is good: therein is the manna-bdellium, and the onyx stones of the ephod breastplate of upright judgment like you see in my avatar. And the broad place of the city square is paved with the good gold, the gold like the bright white pure refined gold of Ophir-Uphaz-Light. And a river of life goes forth from there to quaff the garden, and from there it is parted into four heads. And no doubt everyone thinks I am psycho for saying so. Woohoo. :chuckle:
 

patrick jane

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Haha, nope, and as a matter of fact, if you want to maintain your "literalness" you now need to switch over to the flat-square model so that you can have four literal corners to the earth. I've already seen a picture or two of that model here somewhere. :)
It would actually be even easier because BEYOND the ice wall that encircles the flat earth map COULD be thousands upon thousands of miles. In the theory, there's an ice wall completely surrounding all the continents the whole way around and we can only establish bases or camps in certain areas around the perimeter of the circular ice wall. The four corners could be beyond anything we'd ever see or get to. As I explained to RD, maybe we can only get so far and it's a massive land mass around the wall, even a square shaped land mass. See where I'm going? A circle within a square. I can't see how it changes the flat earth map if we don't know how far it is the "edge". The image below shows that somewhat. In the image, ignore the caption that says "other earth ponds" because I believe in one earth only. Looking at the image, imagine how many thousand of miles it COULD extend beyond the wall all the way around the circle flat earth. and nobody can get to the "edge", whatever that is. We can't get there by any means for many reasons including fuel capacity, temps and weather, terrain, safe landing ares and refueling areas, communications problems from being so far away etc. A lot of imagining but still possible imo, and I can't think of a scripture that would go against that theory right this second or a problem with current flat earth theory map. :idunno: Adding the image in a second or two !!!
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patrick jane

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Fixed and immovable does NOT mean "not moving relative to all of the other things that God created".

And again, from the PERSONS point of view, it appears that the earth is not moving and everything else is. There is no problem with viewing things from the earth as the frame of reference and that is what the Bible generally does.


We have UNALTERED pictures from beyond the earth. You just reject them out of hand.
NY Times and a Japanese weather satellite? FAKE. I'd bet my life on it.
 

Wick Stick

Well-known member
I did? Or the image did? I never said a thing about the tower of Babel or why they built it.
The image. The videos. Things you linked.

I mean, don't you think you've created a double standard if you link a bunch of extra-Scriptural stuff, and then demand that everybody use only Scripture?
 

patrick jane

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The image. The videos. Things you linked.

I mean, don't you think you've created a double standard if you link a bunch of extra-Scriptural stuff, and then demand that everybody use only Scripture?
No. I don't think. Do I report people for posting science in one particular thread? No. Do I encourage science in the Bible thread even from me? No. Did I note it when I posted it and said I broke the rule?: Yes. I can't make rules by the way, I can only make requests. You libs are loving on me so much today. Trump wins again !!! I didn't "link a bunch of extra-biblical stuff" unless I was replying to "a bunch of extra-biblical stuff". :wave2:
 

Tambora

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Fixed and immovable does NOT mean "not moving relative to all of the other things that God created".

And again, from the PERSONS point of view, it appears that the earth is not moving and everything else is. There is no problem with viewing things from the earth as the frame of reference and that is what the Bible generally does.


We have UNALTERED pictures from beyond the earth. You just reject them out of hand.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/10/science/An-Image-of-Earth-Every-Ten-Minutes.html
I see clouds spinning about, but not the earth (if that is the earth).
 

patrick jane

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P.S. ATTENTION: The videos
I post from a particular channel that may seem in the first few minutes that it's promoting occult beliefs or end times predictions. He makes no predictions but shares interpretations with scripture most times.The name of that channel is:the truth is stranger than fiction. They're not promoting those type things but rather EXPOSING THEM and informing people of the CURRENT trends and occult activity and how far they go back. The videos often start with crazy preachers and speakers and new age practices of OTHER PEOPLE. Pay attention and the real speaker speaks, who is a Christian, quotes scriptures and offers HIS interpretation, which are very similar to mine. The videos also switch back and forth from EXPOSING EVIL BELIEFS and interpreting. They are informative and educational and uplifting and positive. And short. Those are the ones with strange titles but some others in the thread are other Christians that share my views and beliefs and also show some non-biblical evidence. Most of the time, even that evidence is connected to God or satan in my mind. I also post them in another thread.
 
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patrick jane

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First of all, in Job 9 it's describing God's anger. I interpret that nothing can move the earth EXCEPT GOD ALONE with His perfect Will and ANGER.. There are numerous other scriptures to counter that one verse in Job 9. I see no contradictions at all in Job 9 and 26 and I will bold the key phrases and words according to my interpretation. In Job 26, the first thing that stands out are the words "and how hast thou plentifully declared the thing as it is". I think meaning God chooses the right words and declares it. To me, "He hangeth the earth on nothing" could mean exactly the opposite of what some interpret. It means the earth IS NOT HANGING AND FLYING AND SPINNING THROUGH ENDLESS SPACE. It hangs on nothing, it doesn't hang. (It has foundations, stationary, immovable, fixed per scriptures), if God is saying He DOES hang the earth and it hangs on nothing that would still mean earth is hanging in space but still not flying and spinning. Also, God says the sun has a circuit but never mentions a circuit for earth, again implying that the earth is at the center of and the focus of the whole heavens.

Even "compassed" is circular, it could go either way. NOTE: ANY AND ALL SCRIPTURE OF EARTH MOVING IN ANY WAY OR THE PILLARS OF BOTH HEAVEN AND EARTH (I THINK), WILL PROBABLY BE DESCRIBING GOD'S ANGER AND WRATH IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER). I've shown in a previous post that the sun goes down and it also rises, according to God's command. IMO, that means God commands and CAUSES the SUN to go up and down NOT the earth. No mention of earth spinning to greet the sun or the earth moving in any direction. In fact, just the opposite, as you know. In another post I showed the scriptures of the earth GOD SET as a Taberbnacle FOR the sun. (I hope you've seen those posts and scriptures, I hate to keep re-posting since I'm answering multiple people people instead of one.) KJV definitions and everything.

The only way Job 26:7 KJV - makes sense to me is that the the "north" stretched out over the empty place, it can't mean the earth because the earth is not empty. Earth is not an empty place. The firmament can be although it's NOT empty, but "space"CAN BE. There are also the scriptures of a canopy, tent, and dome, like a garment, spread out and stretched ABOVE THE EARTH. I'm a firm believer that God uses the right words. Also in Job 9:7 KJV - We know that God commands the SUN not to move(Joshua 10). Not the other way around nor does it say God makes the WHOLE HEAVEN STOP. I hope I'm being clear because I have trouble explaining things. I hope somehow you can see my point of view. Also the word Chambers or chamber as used in Job 9:9 KJV - in their place as they have their "circuit" (scripture and definition in previous posts as with "line") Also, in Psalm 19:4-6 KJV - the sun is a "bridegroom"coming out of it's chamber to run his circuit for the earth. Again, we are told that that everything around us is done with the earth at the center, in my interpretation. Earth is the focal point not some other slice of "outer space" 14 billion light years away that is NOT ABOVE THE EARTH. I could go on as I see more everyday lately not even considering the connections to deception in the conspiracy thread. The reason I'm enlarging fonts is because the text looks really small to me on the computer I have and they are key words. There's also several verses about the ends of heavens and/or end of the heaven (which we can't see from earth in a spinning ball scenario, i.e. We do not have the parts of space that are 14 billion light years away and we can't see 99.9999% of the heavens ABOVE US ON EARTH. The heavens are always above earth when God speaks of it, He never says the heavens SURROUNDING EARTH OR THE HEAVENS BELOW THE EARTH Or the distant heavens etc.. Is that because no matter where you are on a ball the heavens are always above, even if you're on the bottom of the ball, and that equates to there being no heavens below? :idunno: There's a lot more when you look. Laying the cornerstone also means stable and fixed in place. Also, the four corners of the earth is not really possible on a globe because east and west have no set points. Four corners of the earth COULD be in a falt enclosed earth and firmament.


Job 26 - KJV -
But Job answered and said,2 How hast thou helped him that is without power? how savest thou the arm that hath no strength?
3 How hast thou counselled him that hath no wisdom? and how hast thou plentifully declared the thing as it is?
4 To whom hast thou uttered words? and whose spirit came from thee?
5 Dead things are formed from under the waters, and the inhabitants thereof.
6 Hell is naked before him, and destruction hath no covering.
7 He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.
8 He bindeth up the waters in his thick clouds; and the cloud is not rent under them.
9 He holdeth back the face of his throne, and spreadeth his cloud upon it.
10 He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end.
11 The pillars of heaven tremble and are astonished at his reproof.
12 He divideth the sea with his power, and by his understanding he smiteth through the proud.
13 By his spirit he hath garnished the heavens; his hand hath formed the crooked serpent.
14 Lo, these are parts of his ways: but how little a portion is heard of him? but the thunder of his power who can understand?

Job 9:1-13 KJV - Then Job answered and said,2 I know it is so of a truth: but how should man be just with God?
3 If he will contend with him, he cannot answer him one of a thousand.
4 He is wise in heart, and mighty in strength: who hath hardened himself against him, and hath prospered?
5 Which removeth the mountains, and they know not: which overturneth them in his anger.
6 Which shaketh the earth out of her place, and the pillars thereof tremble.
7 Which commandeth the sun, and it riseth not; and sealeth up the stars.
8 Which alone spreadeth out the heavens, and treadeth upon the waves of the sea.
9 Which maketh Arcturus, Orion, and Pleiades, and the chambers of the south.
10 Which doeth great things past finding out; yea, and wonders without number.
11 Lo, he goeth by me, and I see him not: he passeth on also, but I perceive him not.
12 Behold, he taketh away, who can hinder him? who will say unto him, What doest thou?
13 If God will not withdraw his anger, the proud helpers do stoop under him.
Psalm 19:4-6 KJV - Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber, and rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

Job 38:4-14 KJV - Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
8 Or who shut up the sea with doors, when it brake forth, as if it had issued out of the womb?
9 When I made the cloud the garment thereof, and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it,
10 And brake up for it my decreed place, and set bars and doors,
11 And said, Hitherto shalt thou come, but no further: and here shall thy proud waves be stayed?
12 Hast thoucommanded the morning since thy days; and caused the dayspring to know his place;
13 That it might take hold of the ends of the earth, that the wicked might be shaken out of it?
14 It is turned as clay to the seal; and they stand as a garment.

Isaiah 40:21-22 KJV -
Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?22It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Psalm 103:11 -
For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him.

Jeremiah 31:35-40 KJV -
Thus saith the Lord, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The Lord of hosts is his name:36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the Lord, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.
37 Thus saith the Lord; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the Lord.
38 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that the city shall be built to the Lord from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.
39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.
40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the Lord; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.

Jeremiah 4:26-28 KJV - I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by his fierce anger.

27 For thus hath the Lord said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.
28 For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black; because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.

Revelation 7:1 KJV - And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
 
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patrick jane

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[h=1]"Excuse me, Dr. Lisle..." [Flat Earth & the Hypocrisy of Mainstream Creationism][/h]
From the video description: A recent interview with Creationist and Astrophysicist Dr. Jason Lisle has joined the list of mainline Creation apologists claiming to have debunked or "destroyed" the Flat Earth by applying the same old flimsy biblical arguments and appeals to the same secular institutions of Scientism which uphold Evolution..

https://youtu.be/pUwMKJ7owmQ - 13 minutes - Click this link for full screen


ATTENTION: The videos
I post from a particular channel that may seem in the first few minutes that it's promoting occult beliefs or end timespredictions. He makes no predictions but shares interpretations with scripture most times.The name of that channel is:the truth is stranger than fiction. They're not promoting those type things but rather EXPOSING THEM and informing people of the CURRENT trends and occult activity and how far they go back. The videos often start with crazy preachers and speakers and new age practices of OTHER PEOPLE. Pay attention and the real speaker speaks, who is a Christian, quotes scriptures and offers HIS interpretation, which are very similar to mine. The videos also switch back and forth from EXPOSING EVIL BELIEFS and interpreting. They are informative and educational and uplifting and positive. And short. Those are the ones with strange titles but some others in the thread are other Christians that share my views and beliefs and also show some non-biblical evidence. Most of the time, even that evidence is connected to God or satan in my mind. I also post them in another thread.
 

patrick jane

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Daniel 12:1-6 KJV - [FONT=&quot]And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders?[/FONT]
 

George Affleck

TOL Subscriber
Fixed and immovable does NOT mean "not moving relative to all of the other things that God created".

And again, from the PERSONS point of view, it appears that the earth is not moving and everything else is. There is no problem with viewing things from the earth as the frame of reference and that is what the Bible generally does.


We have UNALTERED pictures from beyond the earth. You just reject them out of hand.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/10/science/An-Image-of-Earth-Every-Ten-Minutes.html

This video you included intrigues me.

Sunrise comes from the northeast but the sunset line comes from the southeast.
Anybody notice this?
 
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