Just because God doesn't know what one might do tomorrow doesn't mean He doesn't know whehter they are saved or not. And if we are saved, His mind is made up. He doesn't change His mind when it's made up.elected4ever said:
ARCHIVE: Open Theism part 1
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elected4ever
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How do you know if God changes His mind? :dizzy:Lighthouse said:
Well, in the Bible He said that He changed His mind.:duh:
elected4ever
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No, God was acting according to His preordained plan set from the foundation of the world. God foreknew everything from the foundation of the world. God knows and we do not know until we are told and people think that humans are sooooo smart. What a joke.Lighthouse said:
So you are a Calvinist. I should have known.
elected4ever
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No, I believe in free choice. It does not bother me to know that God already knew what choice i would make. It just fills me with the wonder of it all.Lighthouse said:
It was the word "preordained" in e4e's post that led me to make that comment.Mr. 5020 said:
Then how is it a choice? If it was known before you even had the chance to make it, how can you say you chose it?elected4ever said:
Lighthouse said:
This idea confuses me more than Calvinism. I can't reconcile God knowing the entire future, with free will. Did He create "the script" randomly somehow, then peek ahead? To me, if God can see the future, He must have planned it in the same act of creating it. At least with Calvinism it is logical that God would know the future.
elected4ever
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My wife ask me if I wonted clam chowder for supper or not. I said yes. and I got clam chowder. At the preaching of the word the Holy Spirit said that i needed a savior and would I trust Jesus to save me and I said yes and He saved me. I did not know until I was saved that I would be saved that night. How was I supposed to choose Jesus when I didn't even know who He was. It was my decision to make. No one twisted my arm. No one! Not even God. Even though He knew what my decision would be, He did not force me to believe.Lighthouse said:
Calvinists will either affirm or deny free will, depending on what they think you mean. You keep insisting that you aren't a Calvinist but have yet to say one word that they would disagree with. I'm sure you probably consider yourself Arminian but if so, you're the most Calvinistic Arminian I've ever heard of.elected4ever said:
It makes little difference though, whether God predestined your choices from the foundation of the world, which you proclaimed in the case of Judas just a couple of posts ago, or He simply foreknows everything in advance, which you proclaimed here, the end result as far as your free choice is concerned is the same, it doesn't exist. Freedom of choice requires that you have the ability to do otherwise and you couldn't have done otherwise in either of these cases.
Resting in Him,
Clete
Apples and Oranges, E4e.elected4ever said:
Your wife did not know that you would pick clam chowder in the same sense that you are suggesting that God knows your future actions. Correct me if I'm wrong but you think that God could not possibly be wrong about what He knows your future actions will be but that cannot be said of your wife. In the strictest sense of the word, the best your wife could do is reliably predict your choice. Is that not correct?
Resting in Him,
Clete
Exactly!Vaquero45 said:
If God knew you would say yes, then that means you could not have said no, doesn't it?elected4ever said:
elected4ever
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Then so be it. I could care less what you call me. I have been called worse with a lot more colorful language. It just bothers me that you have made God such a puny little god and assigned to Him the fallen human traits. God is the creator , not the created. he makes us as he wills not as you wish he would. This one thing I know for sure, God will get glory from the believer and the non believer because all things were created for his pleasure and not yours.Clete said:
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