ECT A Preterist Time Chart

[Wick Stick]

What is "proof" after 40 years of reading the material in normal, obvious sense? When you tell people you know not to get married because the end is near, and no one has figured out how to get married 4 "ages" from now, you--Wick--sound silly. I Cor 7.

When you tell people whose country is being torched and ransacked that in just a little while , if they hold fast, they will gain the world to come, then "proof" about waiting for 4 "ages" is stupid, and would not be the same admonition, and would not help them (those people in Hebrews letter), etc.

Did you read it? Your response makes it seem like you didn't.

It was not a Biblical book I linked, so if you're going "from memory," that probably didn't work.

 

[Interplanner]

I did. I reread it. I don't see much worth using, and certainly nothing along the lines of Dan 9. With the logical questions asked above, which you quoted, what would be your point? The belief that the current generation was meant to be the last is everywhere in the NT.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

The belief that the current generation was meant to be the last is everywhere in the NT.

Sorry, but you made this up.

 

[Interplanner]

Sorry, but you made this up.

You are as ridiculous as unaware. And think of all the time you wasted by not writing 'made up.'

Read the 2 questions above (marriage and Hebrews 'land') and really think about Lk 23:30 and what it would take to say that and connect it to 'Fall on us' (= end our lives, it's so hopeless, Hosea) as Luke (Paul) did.

 

[Danoh]

...The belief that the current generation was meant to be the last is everywhere in the NT.

Sorry, but you made this up.

Actually, STP, he is right.

But the Mystery he is so clueless of had interrupted said generation from ending up the last one...

Absent of that; there'd've been no Romans 9 thru 11; nor 2 Thessalonians 2, etc.

Acts 17:11, 12.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Actually, STP, he is right.

I disagree. Those that understood prophecy knew that Jerusalem was to be destroyed, Israel scattered, and then regathered for the final week.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

You are as ridiculous as unaware. And think of all the time you wasted by not writing 'made up.'

Read the 2 questions above (marriage and Hebrews 'land') and really think about Lk 23:30 and what it would take to say that and connect it to 'Fall on us' (= end our lives, it's so hopeless, Hosea) as Luke (Paul) did.

Danoh has offered an answer, when will you answer why Paul uses ENDS of the world?

 

[Danoh]

I disagree. Those that understood prophecy knew that Jerusalem was to be destroyed, Israel scattered, and then regathered for the final week.

Within their lifetime, Luke 1 and 2; Acts 1 thru 3, etc.

They'd been only one remaining week away.

But not for the Mystery's interruption, what took place in 70AD would have been the sum up of said 70 years.

Instead, what Josephus reports of the prayers of such for deliverance, that bookworms such as IP conclude had been in keeping with what had been Prophesied, had been prayers for a Prophesied delivery that had been post-poned by the Mystery.

The clock had kept on ticking towards 70AD, but outside of the Prophetic context, no longer proceeding within its' Prophesied course.

The unProphesied age of the Mystery now rolling right along, in its place...for now.

Rom. 5:8.

 

[Danoh]

Delete...

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

But not for the Mystery's interruption, what took place in 70AD would have been the sum up of said 70 years.

There would still need to be a regathering, and the final week.

 

[Interplanner]

There would still need to be a regathering, and the final week.

The regathering is in Christ and is all believers, Rom 11:30. The final week was Christ and the counter-Christ of the rebellion.

 

[Interplanner]

Actually, STP, he is right.

But the Mystery he is so clueless of had interrupted said generation from ending up the last one...

Absent of that; there'd've been no Romans 9 thru 11; nor 2 Thessalonians 2, etc.

Acts 17:11, 12.

There would have been Rom 9-11 because of the question driving it. It is about whether God is done with 'his people'. It turns out, that depends on what 'done' means, on what 'his people' means. And on the mission needed Jews because of their background, if they would take it on.

 

[Interplanner]

I disagree. Those that understood prophecy knew that Jerusalem was to be destroyed, Israel scattered, and then regathered for the final week.

A sentence cannot have two nouns at once.

 

[Interplanner]

Danoh has offered an answer, when will you answer why Paul uses ENDS of the world?

Where does he do that?

 

[Interplanner]

My understanding of that is based on the following, from it's passages...based on two principles.

Looking up those words in the original language; along with the application of the principle I'll post, in a moment...

The word "world" there is also plural, and refers to "ages" - "the ends (plural) of the ages" (plural) is the intended sense.

What ends of the ages is he referring to, is then much more easier to solve for.

And the sense is that those things that happened in those past ages had each ended up in resulting wisdom thru their example as ends (end results) highly useful in learning from, towards the application of their lessons, in the here and now.

They had each ended up being examples, one might do well to attempt learn some applicable wisdom from, towards applying, in the here and now.

That is based on another guiding principle, which is the simple principle of asking oneself the question "what was Paul talking about, when he then added to that what he then added to it, after it?"

1 Corinthians 10:1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;

10:5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.

10:6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

Could you repeat that, please...

10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

Okay; got it. In other words, one can learn from said past results.

10:12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

For as said past events as examples had repeatedly proven....

10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

10:14 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.

10:15 I speak as to wise men; judge ye what I say.

Telos is fulfillment. Everything was fulfilled in Christ. Funny how STP wants singular in Acts 13 about what was promised, and plural when the text is singular: fulfillment.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Telos is fulfillment. Everything was fulfilled in Christ. Funny how STP wants singular in Acts 13 about what was promised, and plural when the text is singular: fulfillment.

100% made up.

 

[john w]

Everything was fulfilled in Christ.

That "Everything was fulfilled in Christ" scam can be used to answer any question, on any topic.

Con artist, scam artist.

 

[Danoh]

I don't do Danoh, but I may have something relevant to the thread:

my time frame:
Mt 24A to v29 was about 1st century Judea.
After that is about the worldwide judgement of God, which was expected right after, but God delayed.

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

 

[Interplanner]

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

So what? They are partially hardened because he explained that he hardens people all through time. They will be that way to the end, when all those who are believers who are Gentiles will have come in. It does not 'go back' to Israel at the point. That is the end. The next thing is the swift destruction of this world and evil, and then the NHNE. No Judaic details whatsoever.

 

[JudgeRightly]

So what? They are partially hardened because he explained that he hardens people all through time. They will be that way to the end, when all those who are believers who are Gentiles will have come in. It does not 'go back' to Israel at the point. That is the end. The next thing is the swift destruction of this world and evil, and then the NHNE. No Judaic details whatsoever.

God is not 'returning to Israel and grafting her back in' People who believe are grafted back in. He wasn't talking about Israel. he was talking about who would be in the tree (of faith). And saying that those with the background of Israel (then, not necessarily now) would have an advantage of understanding and of effectiveness when they ministered in the mission.

So you reject the entirety of Romans 11?

Spoiler

I say then, has God cast away His people? Certainly not! For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel, saying,“L ord, they have killed Your prophets and torn down Your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life” ?But what does the divine response say to him? “I have reserved for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.”Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace.And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace. But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work.What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded.Just as it is written: “God has given them a spirit of stupor, Eyes that they should not see And ears that they should not hear, To this very day.”And David says: “Let their table become a snare and a trap, A stumbling block and a recompense to them.Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see, And bow down their back always.”I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles.Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry,if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them.For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?For if the firstfruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches.And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree,do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.”Well said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear.For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins.”Concerning the gospel they are enemies for your sake, but concerning the election they are beloved for the sake of the fathers.For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience,even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy.For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and His ways past finding out!“For who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has become His counselor?”“Or who has first given to Him And it shall be repaid to him?”For of Him and through Him and to Him are all things, to whom be glory forever. Amen. - Romans 11:1-36 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans11:1-36&version=NKJV