Pope F: "economic practices [capitalism?] built on exclusion"

republicanchick

New member
Pope F speaks against "economic practices built on exclusion... attitudes that view persons as disposable."

This comes from his encyclical Evangelii Guadium

In Our Sunday Visitor a Catholic newspaper, an article says that Pope Fr's critique of [as practiced?] market capitalism falls squarely within the Church's Tradition of social teaching.

In that enclyclical, the pope deplored "an economy of exclusion..." noting that "such an economy kills." How can it be news that the stock market loses 2 points but not that an old man dies from the cold?


That last is not in quotes, by the way (written by OSV writer [as is much of the following]).

Some of the claims in this work had a frosty reception from some... who argue that the pope is adopting a left-wing view... The pope claims the trickle down theory has not been proven.

But opponents say that as wealth grows, poverty declines. In 3rd world countries poverty has declined from 24% to 12% from 1990 to 2013.

Conservative [I am one!] say the problem is not market capitalism but the lack of it...

The pope says the disparity between rich and poor has increased, but as we who follow the news know, that is the fault of the LEFTIES in charge in the Administration. Median income has declined by $3000/yr in this country (USA). There are almost twice as many people on food stamps now compared to the years b4 Pres O..

The pope says that when money becomes an idol men and women are reduced to mere instruments of a social and economic system... huge numbers [of people]... are cast aside

Who can argue with that?

"Let us seek to build a society where the good of human beings rather than money is at the center."

The pope cannot accept a passive view that the market will resolve of its own accord the challenge of poverty, says that "markets...cannot enjoy an absolute autonomy." He speaks of "programs, mechanisms... geared to a better distribution of resources, to job creation... and to improving the lot of those who are excluded."

This is what causes suspicion [with yours truly as well] that the pope advocates for more state intervention in the economy (hopefully not in the USA??). He speaks of how the environment is affected as well [?] but says that his concern has nothing to do with ideologies that see mankind itself as the problem.

He speaks of 3 examples of trying to destroy nature:

  • nuclear weapons
  • genetic manipulation
  • gender theories that fail to respect the created order

Amen to that

He says

"The gospel does not condemn the rich but the worship of wealth--that idolatry which renders people deaf to the cry of the poor."




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republicanchick

New member
well, this doesn't surprise me one bit:

anti-Catholics complain all day long against the pope and the teachings of the RCC and then when they have a thread that clearly shows what some of those teachings are, they... disregard it

hey, reminds me of that song by Paul Simon et al

a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest..



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Levolor

New member


In that enclyclical, the pope deplored "an economy of exclusion..." noting that "such an economy kills." How can it be news that the stock market loses 2 points but not that an old man dies from the cold?


Yes, indeed? Except by greed and lust for gain without regard for another... any other.

"Let us seek to build a society where the good of human beings rather than money is at the center."

Amen.

He says

"The gospel does not condemn the rich but the worship of wealth--that idolatry which renders people deaf to the cry of the poor."

Yes.
 

Levolor

New member
well, this doesn't surprise me one bit:

anti-Catholics complain all day long against the pope and the teachings of the RCC and then when they have a thread that clearly shows what some of those teachings are, they... disregard it

hey, reminds me of that song by Paul Simon et al

a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest..



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Give people a little more time. Especially for those articles posted on Sunday. I, personally, am involved with our church nearly all day except for a few hours. Literally. (Though we did get home early last night, but that is a rare exception.)

Also, sometimes things are said that seems to be so self-evident that no comment is felt to be stated. I do encourage acknowledgement nevertheless.

God bless.
 

Morpheus

New member
well, this doesn't surprise me one bit:

anti-Catholics complain all day long against the pope and the teachings of the RCC and then when they have a thread that clearly shows what some of those teachings are, they... disregard it

hey, reminds me of that song by Paul Simon et al

a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest..



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Did you forget that it was I who directed you to this subject, and the Evangelii Gaudium, in another thread late last week? Although I have some serious issues with the Catholic Church doctrine, there are many issues (e.g. immigration and social welfare) where the viewpoint of the Catholic Church is more closely aligned with scripture than that of the typical American protestant churches. In fact the Catholic Church frequently leads the way pressuring government on social matters, even though many Catholics apparently either have no idea what their church teaches in these matters, or they blatantly disagree. I tend to think it is largely the former.

Now that you are starting to catch on to the RCC's teachings about Capitalism and economic inequality, I challenge you to find out just what your church teaches about immigration. I know because I have testified before my state's legislative bodies about it alongside Catholic priests and nuns.
 

WizardofOz

New member
Now that you are starting to catch on to the RCC's teachings about Capitalism and economic inequality, I challenge you to find out just what your church teaches about immigration. I know because I have testified before my state's legislative bodies about it alongside Catholic priests and nuns.

I doubt she will. She was only projecting when she posted this: "a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.."
 

republicanchick

New member
Give people a little more time. Especially for those articles posted on Sunday. I, personally, am involved with our church nearly all day except for a few hours. Literally. (Though we did get home early last night, but that is a rare exception.)

Also, sometimes things are said that seems to be so self-evident that no comment is felt to be stated. I do encourage acknowledgement nevertheless.

God bless.

wel, that's true but a lot of Rs seem to think the pope is a leftie or more Left than R... which for all anyone knows..

I will say this: most Rs are or tend to be extremists when it comes to the issue of entittlemnets... but on the other hand, if they were super extremists, they would have gotten rid of all tht when they had the chance (Reagan... )

I sometimes wish they had... b/c we can do better things for the poor w/ all that $$ that is thrown at them..


a lot of money is not spent on the poor so much as WASTED. And many poor fall through the cracks. it seems the neediest of all fall through the cracks.. the system is messed up...



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republicanchick

New member
Now that you are starting to catch on to the RCC's teachings about Capitalism and economic inequality, I challenge you to find out just what your church teaches about immigration. I know because I have testified before my state's legislative bodies about it alongside Catholic priests and nuns.

that last thing means NOTHING to me b/c a lot of "religious" are not what they should be, and go against Church teaching.

that is not to say All, of course

In any case, the Church is not Left. But it is also not as far right as some Rs are... Some Rs, if given their way, would probably cut off all funding to the poor.. But really, I think they are rather rare or else keep such thoughts to themselves and never bring forth bills that even hint of such.. I don't know, but there is such a thing as extreme right-ism that says that everyone can pick himself up and ... become rich if he chooses. Well, I know that not all people are cut out for that kind of thing... and some people are just so damaged by what they've been through, they can barely function. I am not making excuses. What a person goes through makes that person who is to a huge extent. I have fought a few demons of my own only to find out they will probably go with me to the grave.. demons both figurative and not so figurative (probably). You can't just wave a magic wand and say "I'm not going to be me anymore"... doesn't work, unless maybe you have help...




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Morpheus

New member
wel, that's true but a lot of Rs seem to think the pope is a leftie or more Left than R... which for all anyone knows..

I will say this: most Rs are or tend to be extremists when it comes to the issue of entittlemnets... but on the other hand, if they were super extremists, they would have gotten rid of all tht when they had the chance (Reagan... )

I sometimes wish they had... b/c we can do better things for the poor w/ all that $$ that is thrown at them..


a lot of money is not spent on the poor so much as WASTED. And many poor fall through the cracks. it seems the neediest of all fall through the cracks.. the system is messed up...



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Since the subject is vampire capitalism, the culture of the day, many people in America get outraged when a minority game the welfare system, but when the richest minority of us game the economic and political system for extreme personal gain at the expense of the majority of us they make them heroes. You won't see someone on welfare on the cover of Forbes. If someone doesn't believe me about the bias toward the rich in the system just read about it in the Labor section of any newspaper.
 

republicanchick

New member
Since the subject is vampire capitalism, the culture of the day, many people in America get outraged when a minority game the welfare system, but when the richest minority of us game the economic and political system for extreme personal gain at the expense of the majority of us they make them heroes. You won't see someone on welfare on the cover of Forbes. If someone doesn't believe me about the bias toward the rich in the system just read about it in the Labor section of any newspaper.

I have "always" seen this bias against the rich. I mean, it doesn't take a magnifying glass to see it. We see it from the time we are children to the day we die... ubiquitous favoritism shown to the wealthy. They can buy anything, go anywhere they want and pretty much DO what they want. But some day, if they neglect the poor, they will pay for their "consolation in this life" as the Word puts it... meaning that may be the only consolation they ever have.

So again, we cannot envy the wealthy, who as the Lord said, have a harder time making it to Heaven... eye of the needle, etc..

I do not usually envy them.. although I sometimes wish I had more money so I could do more good in the world...

Blessed are the poor, for the kingdom of Heaven is theirs



:plain:
 
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