Different Gospel
- Thread starter Cntrysner
- Start date
Hello
The twelve apostles and Jesus preached the gospel of the kingdom (Matthew 4:23). The gospel of the kingdom was that the prophetic Davidic kingdom on earth was at hand.
Peter preached that Israel was to repent and be baptized for the remission of sins and receive the Holy Ghost to enter the kingdom (Acts 2:38).
They had to believe on the name of Jesus; that he was the Messiah, the Son of God.
Today we are to believe the gospel of the grace of God preached by Paul. Paul preached that all are justified freely by believing that Christ died for our sins and rose again for our justification.
So you're saying true salvation was not possible to be receive until Paul revealed his message and therefore not possible anyone before Paul.
Would you answer my question...So you're saying true salvation was not possible to be receive until Paul revealed his message and therefore not possible anyone before Paul.????
Hello
I was not saying that salvation was only through Paul. Salvation has always been by faith, by believing God, always by grace. Those who believed the gospel preached by Peter and the disciples were saved unto eternal life by believing on Jesus as Messiah, the Son of God (John 20:31)
That is not our gospel in this dispensation. We are to believe that Christ died for our sins and rose again for our justification unto eternal life (Romans 4:25 1 Corinthians 15:3-4).
Bradley D
Well-known member
No. Salvation was already avaiable through apostles and their disciples. But Jesus decided to use Paul, a person who was out to destroy Christianity, to carry the message even further into other countries. When Paul went back to Jerusalem the Apostles there decided to send Paul out on that mission.
Right Divider
Body part
That is silly tradition talking. That is NOT what the Bible teaches.
Paul was NOT under the authority of the twelve. Paul makes that crystal clear thought out his epistles.
To a certain extent. It's a difference between eye-witnesses and a reporter/journalist. In terms of reporting an incident, the eyewitnesses don't need to be professionals. A reporter/journalist does such a job. The eyewitnesses just need to sincerely tell what they witnessed. The professional journalist may theorized the situation in accordance to his expertise. Of course, the eyewitnesses can also write down their own testimonies if they are professional enough to develop a theory behind the scene.
Paul is a Pharisee who is very much familiar with Jewish laws. He has the advantage in developing a theory theologically from the perspective of laws and covenants.
Right Divider
Body part
Your explanation makes no sense on multiple levels.
Paul says that he is the apostle of the gentiles... so why do the gentiles need to know about "laws and covenants"? (HINT: They don't).
They have to, as most of the churches under Paul's ministry are a mixture of both Jews and gentiles. Paul is the one responsible for spreading the gospel to Europe. That's why he's the one said to be the apostle sent for the gentiles.
Back then, the most influential apostles were Peter and James. They both were in Jerusalem (till Peter went to Rome). The next would be Paul and Apollo. Apollo has a lesser effect in terms of Christianity thus he has not formally a book included in the Bible.
Law and covenant are not just for the Jews. They both are necessary parts to make the Bible whole. So your comment on "only NT is needed for gentiles" doesn't make much sense at all. You sound as if the OT should only be read by the Jews and NT for only gentiles.
Right Divider
Body part
And yet the 12 were already sent to "all nations".
The calling of Paul marked a change and not just "business as usual".
They stayed in Jerusalem as instructed. That was were the kingdom's capital is and where they were to start. But since Israel rejected them and their message, it never really got off the ground.
There is NO record of Peter going to Rome. That is mythology and not fact.
You're quite the story teller. Too bad the story is not true.
Now you try to put words in my mouth. The NT is the NC, which is between the same two parties... God and Israel.
Bradley D
Well-known member
"The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:
Greetings.
We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul— men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.
Farewell" (Acts 15:23-29)
Right Divider
Body part
I guess that you think that this proves something?
I guess that you think that the apostle of the gentiles needs someone's permission to go to the gentiles?
1Co 3:10-11 KJV According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. (11) For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
Paul is a wise masterbuilder. Guess who a masterbuilder is... the one that gives everyone else orders.
Paul says that HE laid the foundation.
Until you understand the dispensations of God, this will remain a mystery to you.
k0de
Active member
Agree! And this mystery is from the Master himself.
Acts 9: 15. But the Lord said to Ananias, "Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel.
16. I will show him how much he must suffer for my name."
Any question or opposition to these claims?
The words of both Jesus and Paul are instructive in the context of the question in this thread.
Whose gospel would be preached unto all nations for a witness and then the end would come? The teachings of Jesus. It would be taught until the end of time.
Christ broke down the partition wall between Jew and Gentile and made of the two one new man. The Gentiles who had at one time been strangers were now fellow citizens and members of the household of God which is built upon "the apostles and prophets" with Jesus Christ being the cornerstone of the building. Jews and Gentiles were made a temple unto God and were builded together for the habitation of God through the Holy Spirit.
Paul also said that there is no more Jew nor Greek(Gentile) in Jesus Christ.
So, this idea that there is a separation between believing Jews and believing Gentiles is a false distinction. Both Jesus and Paul made that clear in the passages I've quoted above. All are taught the same thing as it all comes from the same foundation of the apostles and the prophets (NT and OT) with Jesus being the cornerstone. There is only one foundation. There is no second foundation. There is no second gospel for Jesus said His gospel would be preached to the end. which means that Paul's and Jesus' gospel is one and the same.
Whose gospel would be preached unto all nations for a witness and then the end would come? The teachings of Jesus. It would be taught until the end of time.
Christ broke down the partition wall between Jew and Gentile and made of the two one new man. The Gentiles who had at one time been strangers were now fellow citizens and members of the household of God which is built upon "the apostles and prophets" with Jesus Christ being the cornerstone of the building. Jews and Gentiles were made a temple unto God and were builded together for the habitation of God through the Holy Spirit.
Paul also said that there is no more Jew nor Greek(Gentile) in Jesus Christ.
So, this idea that there is a separation between believing Jews and believing Gentiles is a false distinction. Both Jesus and Paul made that clear in the passages I've quoted above. All are taught the same thing as it all comes from the same foundation of the apostles and the prophets (NT and OT) with Jesus being the cornerstone. There is only one foundation. There is no second foundation. There is no second gospel for Jesus said His gospel would be preached to the end. which means that Paul's and Jesus' gospel is one and the same.
Right Divider
Body part
This is exactly the kind of confusion created by lack of right division.
Paul say that HE "laid the foundation". So just exactly how can HE lay the foundation? Since Jesus had already chosen and sent the TWELVE. Was not the foundation already laid by the time that Paul came into the picture?
Notice any difference at all between sending TWELVE apostles that will sit on TWELVE thrones judging the TWELVE tribes of Israel and sending ONE man that preaches the ONE new man wherein there is neither Jew nor Greek? Probably you don't.