A belief in God is the foundation of any successful society

Gary K

New member
Banned
Jordan Peterson's thoughts on this subject is the best answer I have heard as to why socialism is such a failure and why it must fail. I believe his thoughts are Biblical on this subject even though there is much he and I disagree on in spiritual matters. I love his close but it can't be truly understood outside the context of the entire interview.

He's an amazing guy and I love his depth of thought.

 

PureX

Well-known member
Hmmm, ... he makes some very astute observations in the particulars, for sure. But he also really slides off the rails when he tries to over-generalize.

I don't trust his over-view. He goes a bit 'crack-pot' when he tries to over-generalize. But I do appreciate the precision and detail of his specific observations. They are sharp, and it seems to me, quite accurate. I also agree with his basic premise: that humans need a sense of the "transcendent" to think and behave sanely and effectively in the world as both individuals and as a society.
 

Gary K

New member
Banned
Hmmm, ... he makes some very astute observations in the particulars, for sure. But he also really slides off the rails when he tries to over-generalize.

I don't trust his over-view. He goes a bit 'crack-pot' when he tries to over-generalize. But I do appreciate the precision and detail of his specific observations. They are sharp, and it seems to me, quite accurate. I also agree with his basic premise: that humans need a sense of the "transcendent" to think and behave sanely and effectively in the world as both individuals and as a society.
Peterson obviously is not a committed Christian, but he does recognize the need in our lives of the principles of life of the Bible. It's interesting how he arrives at that point but he is far from the first non-Christian to come to this conclusion. Friedrich Hayek came to the same conclusions during his lifetime and he gave no consideration to creation at all.

What I find fascinating about Peterson is that he has come to his conclusions based on his love for his fellow man, About the only way a person comes to his love for his fellow man is the influence of the Holy Spirit for his love for his fellow man does not arise from a heart that is not influenced by God.
 

PureX

Well-known member
Peterson obviously is not a committed Christian, but he does recognize the need in our lives of the principles of life of the Bible. It's interesting how he arrives at that point but he is far from the first non-Christian to come to this conclusion. Friedrich Hayek came to the same conclusions during his lifetime and he gave no consideration to creation at all.

What I find fascinating about Peterson is that he has come to his conclusions based on his love for his fellow man, About the only way a person comes to his love for his fellow man is the influence of the Holy Spirit for his love for his fellow man does not arise from a heart that is not influenced by God.
I like that he tries to stick to reason and logic and practical observation to support his premise. The "believers" will believe, regardless. It's the skeptics that need to see/hear some support. And because what's being presented, here, is essentially a vision of the truth, that support is there. It's there for the skeptic to see and understand as well as the 'believers', in terms they can understand and accept.

I, personally, see 'God' as a self-evident existential truth. And so have the vast majority of humans throughout history, and today. But there has always been a great deal of confusion and bias when it comes to defining that self-evident existential truth, for ourselves, and figuring out how it applies to our lives. And that has led to a lot of confusion and doubt in people. And fear. So for the sake of the skeptics, I appreciate that Peterson is providing them with the means to clear away some of that confusion and doubt by using intellectual methodologies that they can understand and relate to.

As to his accusations about the Canadian Prime Minister, and liberals in general, however, I think he becomes a bit of a 'crack-pot'. It's not that his observations about liberalism becoming an excuse for forced compliance are wrong, because they aren't. But it's because that exact same phenomenon can be observed across the gamut of social and political ideology. All humans, regardless of their political or social bent, will try to control their own fate by controlling everything and everyone around them when they are living in fear of the power of that 'fate' to harm them. As is the case when we have no faith in the benevolence of that existential power that is greater and more ethical than ourselves (God). When we cannot trust in God, we try to become our own god. And this is so whether we are conservative, liberal, anarchist, or whatever. We start trying to control our world (and our fate within it) by controlling everything and everyone around us.

Yes, this is motivating a lot of 'liberal' methodology these days. But is it also motivating a lot of conservative methodology, too. And not understanding this is why Peterson falls off the rails when he tries to generalize about liberals and conservatives. There are plenty of liberals motivated by their love for their fellow humans and their trust in God, just as there are conservatives. But there are also plenty of conservatives motivated by their desire to 'play god' because they have no faith is the real one, as there are liberals. And that goes for professing Christians, too. Plenty of them are trying to use their religion as a means to force the world to comply with their own personal will as there are atheists trying to use 'scientism' to do the same.

When people don't really recognize and trust in God, they start trying to become their own gods: liberals, conservatives, atheists and theists, alike.
 
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