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  • #16
    Originally posted by DAN P View Post

    Hi Jerry and how then was Adam then SAVED , by WORKS or by GRACE trough FAITH ?
    No one has ever been saved by his works or by his deeds. In order to be saved in that way a person must "continue" in well doing and that means that person cannot sin:

    "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).






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    • #17
      Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

      No one has ever been saved by his works or by his deeds. In order to be saved in that way a person must "continue" in well doing and that means that person cannot sin:

      "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).





      Hi Jerry so you can not explain how Adam was saved ?

      In Heb 11:4 it say By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice , WAS THAT , SACRIFICE , WORKS or FAITH ?

      Are you saying that ADAM was LOST or SAVED ?

      dan p

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      • #18
        Originally posted by DAN P View Post

        Hi Jerry so you can not explain how Adam was saved ?
        Dan, please tell me what verses from the Scriptures tell you whether Adam was saved or lost?

        Besides that, did you read what I wrote in regard to salvation by works?

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

          Dan, please tell me what verses from the Scriptures tell you whether Adam was saved or lost?

          Besides that, did you read what I wrote in regard to salvation by works?
          Hi Jerry , read Gen 3:7-10 and also Gen 3:21 !!!!

          dan p

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          • #20
            Originally posted by DAN P View Post

            Hi Jerry , read Gen 3:7-10 and also Gen 3:21 !!!!

            dan p
            Please quote the verse which support your ideas.

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

              Please quote the verse which support your ideas.
              Hi Jerry and I wrote them in post 20 ,Gen 3:7-10 and Gen 3:21 !!

              If you are not understanding these 2 verses , say so and will be glad to EXPLAIN THEM !

              At least try ?

              dan p

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by DAN P View Post

                Hi Jerry and I wrote them in post 20 ,Gen 3:7-10 and Gen 3:21 !!

                If you are not understanding these 2 verses , say so and will be glad to EXPLAIN THEM !

                At least try ?

                dan p
                So you think that those two passages teach that both Adam and Eve were saved? OK, were they saved by works or grace?

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

                  So you think that those two passages teach that both Adam and Eve were saved? OK, were they saved by works or grace?
                  Hi Jerry and the reason Adam is NOT found in Heb 11:4 and it because the walked by FAITH and believed and did what God told them to do , WORKS !!

                  Please notice that in Gen 3:8 Christ spoke to them in the COOL OF THE DAY !

                  #1 This means that Adam and Eve walked by SIGHT and did not walk by FAITH !

                  So how were Adam and Eve saved ?

                  Gen 3:L21 which you refused to read , what do you see , the LORD made COATS of skins and CLOTHED THM !

                  Notice that in the begining , verse 7 , Adam and Eve made sewed fig leaves and made aprons to cover there SIN and all people do today !

                  Christ did the FIRST SACRIFICE for man >

                  This the first time , and should be called an ATONEMENT !

                  This how Adam and Eve were SAVED !!

                  So this is the GOSPEL of SACRIFICE !

                  Remember what Hebrews say , without the SHEDDING OF BLOOD THERE IS NO REMISSION OF SIN !

                  dan p

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by DAN P View Post

                    Hi Jerry and the reason Adam is NOT found in Heb 11:4 and it because the walked by FAITH and believed and did what God told them to do , WORKS !!
                    No one has ever been saved by his works or by his deeds. In order to be saved in that way a person must "continue" in well doing and that means that person cannot sin:

                    "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).

                    Both Adam and Eve sinned.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

                      No one has ever been saved by his works or by his deeds. In order to be saved in that way a person must "continue" in well doing and that means that person cannot sin:

                      "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).


                      Both Adam and Eve sinned.
                      Hi Jerry and they sinned , so what ? Are you better than them ?

                      If you studied the Heb text and Gen 3:21 you will notice that Jehovah made SKINS and clothed both Adam and Eve and the Heb word MAKE / ASAH is in the STEM , Qal and in the ASPECT , IMPERFECT TENSE !

                      #1 And the Heb word CLOTHED THEM / is in the Heb STEM , is in HIPHIL and the ASPECT also in the IMPERFECT TENSE and that means ATONEMENT would continue .

                      #2 This means that Adam and Eve were both saved !

                      prints #3 God told Noah to BUILD an ARK and Noah WORKED and built one BUT GOD , did not provide on , ONLY the blueprints !!

                      Faith produced WORKS , OPEN YOUR EYES !!

                      dan p
                      Last edited by DAN P; September 19, 2020, 11:21 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by DAN P View Post

                        Hi Jerry and they sinned , so what ? Are you better than them ?
                        Dan, if Adam and Eve gained eternal life by their "works" then the had to "continue" in good works or deeds:

                        "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).

                        When they sinned they didn't continue in well doing and so it is impossible that they were saved by works.



                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

                          Dan, if Adam and Eve gained eternal life by their "works" then the had to "continue" in good works or deeds:

                          "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile" (Ro.2:5-9).

                          When they sinned they didn't continue in well doing and so it is impossible that they were saved by works.


                          Hi Jerry , and the Greek ATONEMENT HAS TO UNDERSTOOD as in Gen 3:21 God provided the blood sacrifice ,

                          In Heb 11: 8 Abraham obeyed

                          in verse , 24 , Moses m refused to be called the son of Pharaoh

                          in verse 28 Moses kept the PASSOVER

                          dan p

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by DAN P View Post

                            Hi Jerry , and the Greek ATONEMENT HAS TO UNDERSTOOD as in Gen 3:21 God provided the blood sacrifice ,

                            In Heb 11: 8 Abraham obeyed

                            in verse , 24 , Moses m refused to be called the son of Pharaoh

                            in verse 28 Moses kept the PASSOVER

                            dan p
                            What's your point, Dan?

                            Are you saying that Abraham was saved by works because he obeyed?

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Jerry Shugart View Post

                              What's your point, Dan?

                              Are you saying that Abraham was saved by works because he obeyed?
                              Hi Jerry , you got , IT !

                              dan p

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by DAN P View Post

                                Hi Jerry and how then was Adam then SAVED , by WORKS or by GRACE trough FAITH ?

                                dan p
                                Dan, if Adam was saved he was saved by faith through grace. No one has ever been saved by his works.

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