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Both gospels promise rebirth and eternal security

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  • surrender
    replied
    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    1 Cor 11:25 , where you see " New Testament " is the Greek word DIATHEKE
    Yep. New Testament.

    DIATHEKE , can be translated by the following English word :

    #4 ,Testament
    Yep. New Testament.

    If you translate it as NEW TESTAMENT than you are talking about the NEW COVENANT ,
    Yep. New Testament.

    #6, This New Arrangement has to with a remeberance THAT Christ has with the Body of Christ and NOT the New DIATHEKE /TESTAMENT that Jesus has with Israel's PASSOVER in Matt 26:28 , which is the NEW COVENANT !!
    Matthew 26:28 and 1 Cor. 11:25. Yep. New Testament. Those in the Body partake in the New Testament.

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are partakers in the New Testament/New Covenant.

    God has a covenant relationship with the Body of Christ. “He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant (cf. 1 Cor. 11:25)—not of the letter but of the Spirit” (2 Cor. 3:6).

    “But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read” (2 Cor. 3:14). In other words, if there is an “old” covenant, there is a “new” covenant.

    “…remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from the citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise…but now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. ...so then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and are of God’s household” (Ephesians 2:12-19).

    Those “in Christ” (in the body of Christ) are no longer strangers to the covenants. In other words, we enjoy the covenant promises and are fellow partakers in God’s household because of it.

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are “born again from above.” The expression Paul uses in Titus 3:5 is the noun palingennesia, which literally translates as “again-birth.” The meaning of this word is so identical to the verbal expressions in John (John 3:3-7) and Peter (1 Peter 1:3,23), it’s not possible to conclude the realities so described are not the same.

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are assured of eternal security. Those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” are told that knowing God = having eternal life (John 17:3). They are told they possess eternal life (1 John 5:11, 13) and that the one who believes in Christ has passed from death into life (John 5:24). If you have life and then you lose it, it wasn’t eternal.

    Paul tells those saved according to the “gospel of grace” that they are alive from the dead (Romans 6:13).

    Leave a comment:


  • DAN P
    replied
    Originally posted by surrender;God may not have had a covenant relationship with anyone but the nation of Israel [I
    before[/I], but God has a covenant relationship with the Body of Christ now. “He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant (cf. 1 Cor. 11:25)—not of the letter but of the Spirit” (2 Cor. 3:6).


    Hi and Eph 2:12 means no Covenant ever , like He had with Israel >

    1 Cor 11:25 , where you see " New Testament " is the Greek word DIATHEKE .

    DIATHEKE , can be translated by the following English word :

    #1 , Contract

    #2 , Agreement

    #3 , Arrangement

    #4 ,Testament

    #5, Will

    If you translate it as NEW TESTAMENT than you are talking about the NEW COVENANT ,

    #6, This New Arrangement has to with a remeberance THAT Christ has with the Body of Christ and NOT the New DIATHEKE /TESTAMENT that Jesus has with Israel's PASSOVER in Matt 26:28 , which is the NEW COVENANT !!

    What you have written is MOOT !!

    DAN P

    Leave a comment:


  • surrender
    replied
    Originally posted by DAN P View Post
    #3 , You may say that they are similar , but are NOT !!
    There is no debate. The meaning of the word, which is “again-birth,” is identical to “born again” (John 3:3-7) and “born again” (1 Peter 1:3, 23). To say it’s not is to deny the meaning of the word.

    Those in the Body of Christ are a New Creation and Eph 2:15 , calls the Body of Christ a NEW MAN !!
    “New birth” and “new creation” should be taken synonymously. Paul connects the new creation (Eph. 2:10 we are “created in Christ Jesus”) with being made alive in Christ (Eph. 2:5). I also learned that the rabbis taught that Abraham became a “new creation” at his circumcision. So, Paul was using a known Pharisaic description of Abraham entering the covenant of circumcision and applying it to all of us who are in Christ, which was really clever of Paul considering his main theme was that we are made new regardless of circumcision.

    God always had a Covenant Relationship with Israel BUT no Covenant with the Body of Christ as is written in Eph. 2:12
    God may not have had a covenant relationship with anyone but the nation of Israel before, but God has a covenant relationship with the Body of Christ now. “He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant (cf. 1 Cor. 11:25)—not of the letter but of the Spirit” (2 Cor. 3:6).

    “But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read” (2 Cor. 3:14). In other words, if there is an “old” covenant, there is a “new” covenant.

    “…remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from the citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise…but now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. ...so then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and are of God’s household” (Ephesians 2:12-19).

    Those “in Christ” (in the body of Christ) are no longer strangers to the covenants. In other words, we enjoy the covenant promises and are fellow partakers in God’s household because of it.

    Leave a comment:


  • DAN P
    replied
    Originally posted by surrender View Post
    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are “born again from above.” The expression Paul uses in Titus 3:5 is the noun palingennesia, which literally translates as “again-birth.” The meaning of this word is so identical to the verbal expressions in John (John 3:3-7) and Peter (1 Peter 1:3, 23), it’s not possible to conclude the realities so described are not the same.

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are assured of eternal security. Those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” are told that knowing God = having eternal life (John 17:3). They are told they possess eternal life (1 John 5:11, 13) and that the one who believes in Christ has passed from death into life (John 5:24). If you have life and then you lose it, it wasn’t eternal.

    Paul tells those saved according to the “gospel of grace” that they are alive from the dead (Romans 6:13).

    If both groups are born again and can’t lose their salvation, what’s the difference between the supposed two gospels?

    Hi , and here is the difference :

    #1 , " Be born " is GENNAO in John 3:3-7 !!

    #2 , In Titus the Greek word is PALIGGENEISI , where there are many definitions , like Regeneration , New birth .

    #3 , You may say that they are similar , but are NOT !!

    Isarel is the one that will be born in ONE DAY , Isa 66;8 and Matt 24:29-31 , with Christ coming for His elect , the Jews

    So , Israel will be " Born Again " .

    Those in the Body of Christ are a New Creation and Eph 2:15 , calls the Body of Christ a NEW MAN !!

    No where is Israel called a New Man , BUT A NATION !!

    God always had a Covenant Relationship with Israel BUT no Covenant with the Body of Christ as is written in Eph 2:12 !!

    dan p

    Leave a comment:


  • Both gospels promise rebirth and eternal security

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are “born again from above.” The expression Paul uses in Titus 3:5 is the noun palingennesia, which literally translates as “again-birth.” The meaning of this word is so identical to the verbal expressions in John (John 3:3-7) and Peter (1 Peter 1:3, 23), it’s not possible to conclude the realities so described are not the same.

    Both those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” and those saved according to the “gospel of grace” are assured of eternal security. Those saved according to the “gospel of the kingdom” are told that knowing God = having eternal life (John 17:3). They are told they possess eternal life (1 John 5:11, 13) and that the one who believes in Christ has passed from death into life (John 5:24). If you have life and then you lose it, it wasn’t eternal.

    Paul tells those saved according to the “gospel of grace” that they are alive from the dead (Romans 6:13).

    If both groups are born again and can’t lose their salvation, what’s the difference between the supposed two gospels?
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