Don't you know that your doctrine is the doctrine of a man. You need to do better.
ECT Are all our righteousnesses filthy rags or not?
- Thread starter genuineoriginal
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Don't you know that your doctrine is the doctrine of a man. You need to do better.
And this comes from one that believes in the ritual of water baptism for remission.
Edit: You workers for remission of sins always need to condemn others. That's the only way workers can excuse themselves.
genuineoriginal
New member
Whenever Paul quotes the scriptures, it is wise to find out where the quote comes from.
Psalm 14:2-5 2 The Lord looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God. 3 They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one. 4 Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the Lord. 5 There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous. |
If there are none that does good, then who are the righteous that are mentioned two verses later?
genuineoriginal
New member
The second "we" are saved, the first "we" are not.
There is a change of status from sinner to saved.
The process to change that status is called repentance.
This translation contrasts those "who gladly do right" with those who "continued to sin".
Only the righteousnesses of the people who "continued to sin" are called filthy rags.
The righteousnesses of the people "who gladly do right" are not filthy rags, and repentance is the way the scriptures tell us to overcome sin.
Luke 15:10 10 [JESUS]Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.[/JESUS] |
genuineoriginal
New member
Romans 1:17 CSB 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith, just as it is written: The righteous will live by faith. |
If there are none righteousness, not even one, then who are the righteous that live by faith that Paul mentioned earlier?
You lump is still a lump.
Tell me what I must do for remission of sins, can I refuse water baptism and still receive remission? Can I declare myself righteous without water?
genuineoriginal
New member
Your mistake comes from you not knowing scripture.
Ezekiel 18:1,20-22,24,26-28 1 The word of the Lord came unto me again, saying, 20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. 21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. 24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die. 26 When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die. 27 Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive. 28 Because he considereth, and turneth away from all his transgressions that he hath committed, he shall surely live, he shall not die. |
The scriptures say that there are righteous and there are wicked.
These are categories that God Himself puts people into.
Your mistake is thinking that there are no righteous and that there are only wicked.
If there are only wicked and there are no righteous, then God would be a liar.
But, God is not a liar, so there are both righteous and wicked.
The idea is for you to respond to the opening post, not for you to ignore the argument made in the opening post and throw out your unsunstanciated personal opinions hoping to bait the author of the OP to engage you on your terms.
Since you clearly have no interest in engaging the opening post, what are you doing on this thread?
What you try to escape is that you are still a sinner, if not tell me how you are not.
genuineoriginal
New member
I am not the one condemning others by claiming that there are none righteous, that was you.
Paul told Timothy to use the Old Testament for instruction in righteousness.
2 Timothy 3:16 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: |
John the immerser preached repentance.
Matthew 3:1-2 1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea, 2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. |
Peter preached repentance.
Acts 2:38 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. |
Paul preached repentance.
Acts 17:30 30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: |
Why are you teaching people that repentance is useless?
genuineoriginal
New member
That is what you have been doing.
I guess I am trying to bait you in, that is more of an interest to me at this time and will be in my opinion a better thread as soon as you address self righteousness.
The OP is more than capable to address me on his own.
genuineoriginal
New member
Why do you refuse to hear the words of the Lord?
Ezekiel 21-22 21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. |
You missed what I have been saying. I am not righteous, "no not one", but it is clear you profess to be through a ritual of water baptism which is a work.
Repentance is useless because....
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
The law condemns man now, no righteousness of men will work in this dispensation under a new testament for sin remission. What is life worth if it is not eternal? Man's righteous works are now filthy rags.
Edit:
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
There is no water needed for remission.
The old testament pointed to the new testament for righteousness and sin remission, so your assumption that righteousness or remission is in the old testament of the letter (works) is false. Paul said all scripture not just the old. Here is the new testament..
2Co_3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
Heb_9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
At hand not seen yet and not received. John also said in regards to remission....
Joh 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
Joh 3:31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
Joh 3:32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
Joh 3:33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
Paul on the new testament for remission and pay attention there is no water.
Co_11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.
2Co_3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co_3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
Heb_7:22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
Heb_9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
Heb_9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
Heb_9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
That would be one repentance for salvation and after that one repentance there is no more..
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
If you believed (repented) and are saved there is no more forgiveness for you, which is what you are pushing. Christ died for all sins plural if you truly believe what he paid, all not just some at a certain time and Christ will not go back to the cross for sin. Only some that believe in their righteous works needs to repent for forgiveness of their sin. Do you believe in the lie of Catholicism concerning continual repentance?
If you respond substantively to the argument made in the OP, consider me baited.
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
The words say "OUR righteousness are as filthy rags," which is speaking of a person's personal righteousness.
The righteousness which is imputed to believers is a righteousness which is of God. In the following passage Paul contrasts his own righteousness with the righteousness which is of God:
"And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith" (Phil.3:9).
It can be said that "our" righteousness (the personal righteousness of all people) are as filthy rags but believers no longer will be judged according to their own righteousness because they have received the imputed righteousness which is of God.
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The OP believes in his works of righteousness, one is water baptismal regeneration does he not? His argument is based on self righteousness and I responded to his premise. All that a man can work or do is nothing more than filthy rags. Would you agree that any righteous work belongs to Christ and only Christ should get the credit?
If righteousness is imputed then do you believe we must declare it so as in there is/was no righteous man but one who is Jesus Christ?