ECT Spiritual bipolar nature of fallen mankind (an evil pole and a good Pole)

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davidgeminden

New member
If just having knowledge of good and evil means that man is fallen and condemned, then why is not God’s nature fallen and condemned also because Gen. 3:22 states that man has become like God knowing good and evil? However, the majority of scripture indicates that God's nature is pure good (holy, righteous and just); therefore, it must not be just mere knowledge of good and evil that condemns fallen mankind since God already told Adam and Eve what was the good thing to do and what the evil thing to do was before they sinned by disobeying God's instructions; therefore, I believe it must be an inherent internal fallen bipolar nature (one pole is good and the other pole is evil) produced by the sin of Adam and Eve when they disobeyed God’s command that condemns fallen man, and this fallen bipolar nature is what internally drives mankind to do good and evil (at the discretion of their free wills) and gives mankind an inherent internal knowledge of good and evil. Calvinist’s teach that fallen mankind has only an inherent single poled nature of evil that does not move/drive men and women to do good. Many Calvinists teaches that a person has to be indwelt first by the (Holy Spirit) (regenerated, born again) in order to be made to do the good thing of believing in Christ as their savior. All Calvinists teach that man has to have God first perform an effective magical supernatural transformation of a person's will into a believing will (even if they do not call it regeneration, born again) because they believe man's internal single evil poled nature does not have any internal drive to do good, especially the good of making a free will decision to accept Jesus as their savior.

In the book of Romans, Paul gave evidence that mankind has a bipolar nature having two poles (one pole is good and the other pole is evil). In Rom. 2:15 the Holy Spirit states through the Apostle Paul that the gentiles have the law written in their hearts which I believe is biblical evidence of the good spiritual pole of the bipolar nature of fallen mankind. In Rom. 7:23 the Holy Spirit has the Apostle Paul state that a law of sin dwells in his members which I believe is biblical evidence of the evil spiritual pole of the bipolar nature of fallen mankind.

I believe humans are born corrupted bipolar sinners [The unsaved old man (Rom. 6:6; Eph.4:22; Col. 3:9)] having bipolar hearts/natures (“the heart is deceitful above all things….” – Jer. 17:9) with two spiritual poles (good and evil) because of Adam's and Eve's sin; that is, fallen/corrupted/sinful mankind has a spiritually bipolar nature, a good pole and an evil pole (Gen. 2:16-17; Gen. 3:1-7; Rom. 1:19, Rom. 2:14-15, Rom. 7:15-25), internally pulling on our free wills, rather than just externally pulling on our wills as took place with God’s external commands and instructions and the external temptation of the serpent that took place in the garden of Eden – thus, man knowing good and evil is the result of the fallen bipolar nature received when Adam and Eve sinned by eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Because one pole of man's bipolar fallen nature is evil, it inclines unsaved mankind and saved mankind towards sin and ensures that morally capable people will sin and not be able to live a perfect sinless life. The new man (born again person) is a Christian born again (indwelt by the Holy Spirit and should be willingly walking in/after the Spirit); that is, the new man has a good spiritual pole, an evil spiritual pole and the indwelling Holy Spirit and should be (of his own free will) willingly walking in/after the Spirit (Eph. 3:16, Eph. 4:24; Col. 3:10; 2 Cor. 5:17; Rom. 7:24-8:26; Gal. 5:16-25).

I refer to myself as an "inherent-free-willer" Christian, which means I believe in the inherent ability of fallen unsaved mankind to accept/believe or reject God's call/drawing/convicting/convincing/persuading teaching work using the creation, the Word of God, and the Holy Spirit (Rom. 1:18-20; Rom. 10:8-17; 1Thess. 2:13; Heb. 4:12; Luke 8:21; Jn. 15:26, 16:13; 2 Thess. 2:13).

My limited knowledge of early Christian history led me to conclude that when the early Christians concluded that fallen mankind had only one nature that was evil, the door was opened for pagan unconditional determinism/predestination to be easily injected into Christianity ultimately resulting in the development of an anemic puppeteering sovereign God concept and the TULIP soteriology.
 
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Danoh

New member
The passage relates they have the WORK of the Law - NOT the Law Itself - written in their hearts.

Meaning, the ability to discern between a right and a wrong.

But it is a right and a wrong absent of God's standard of right and wrong.

God's standard, and in much more specific detail is found in The Law.

In contrast, man's sense of right and wrong functions within each individual's and or within each collective of individual's standard of right and wrong.

The guy ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good AND Evil.

He was now like God in the sense that he was now able to discern good from evil.

BUT being that said discernment was born or came into being within an individual who not only had just recently rationalized breaking God's Law, but had actually followed through on said rationalization; his ability to discern right from wrong was instantly tainted by that, even as it was being born, or coming into existence in him.

The Law only later, made all that obvious - as to how exactly - for doing so, much more specifically is...the work of the Law.

But the work of the Law is basically the awareness of a distinction that there are things that differ that can be classified as a good, and an evil.

In short - a conscience (con or with, and science, or knowledge, or awareness).

Some, out of the various, pertinent passages.

Romans 2:17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, 2:18 And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law; 2:19 And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, 2:20 An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.

Romans 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

7:13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful. 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

Hebrews 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

James 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 1:15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. 2:17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

And so on...

But Rom. 5:6-8.
 
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madmacxiv

New member
1) Humanity Laws! An individual had his testes and foreskin cut off in his home by a criminal. No subpoena or justice for the murdereree. Sophomore year High School.
2) Humanity Laws! The same murdereree from above has had his shoulder plates maliciously removed the 3rd time in his home county dept of corrections. Same county as above and again no justice for the victim who was only suspected of petty theft.
3) same person had his legs cut off and was given prosthesis while asleep in his own apartment.
The above two took kidnap, premeditation, and a cult.
Nothing has been done.

Sent from my SM-J727T1 using Tapatalk
 
genuineoriginal

genuineoriginal

New member
Danoh said:
Never mind Romans 3; Romans 7, and Romans 8.

Rom. 5:6-8
Click to expand...

None of those verses speak of the "original sin" developed by Augustine.
In Augustine's view (termed "Realism"), all of humanity was really present in Adam when he sinned, and therefore all have sinned. Original sin, according to Augustine, consists of the guilt of Adam which all humans inherit. As sinners, humans are utterly depraved in nature, lack the freedom to do good, and cannot respond to the will of God without divine grace. Justo Gonzalez interprets Augustine's teaching that grace is irresistible, results in conversion, and leads to perseverance.
Original_sin: Augustine​

Augustine was wrong and his teaching has damaged Christianity for almost two thousand years.
 
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Gary K

New member
Banned
genuineoriginal said:
None of those verses speak of the "original sin" developed by Augustine.
In Augustine's view (termed "Realism"), all of humanity was really present in Adam when he sinned, and therefore all have sinned. Original sin, according to Augustine, consists of the guilt of Adam which all humans inherit. As sinners, humans are utterly depraved in nature, lack the freedom to do good, and cannot respond to the will of God without divine grace. Justo Gonzalez interprets Augustine's teaching that grace is irresistible, results in conversion, and leads to perseverance.
Original_sin: Augustine
​

Augustine was wrong and his teaching has damaged Christianity for almost two thousand years.
Click to expand...

There are also people who teach that all of humanity was in Christ when He died on the cross in addition to all of humanity being in Adam when he sinned. In other words, they were made sinners because of their existence in Adam, and they are justified because of their existence in Jesus on the cross. The implications of such a teaching are pretty incredible. It implies that we are justified because we died for our own sins. We are our own savior.
 
genuineoriginal

genuineoriginal

New member
ffreeloader said:
There are also people who teach that all of humanity was in Christ when He died on the cross in addition to all of humanity being in Adam when he sinned. In other words, they were made sinners because of their existence in Adam, and they are justified because of their existence in Jesus on the cross. The implications of such a teaching are pretty incredible. It implies that we are justified because we died for our own sins. We are our own savior.
Click to expand...
The implications of such a teaching are pretty non-credible.
 
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