ECT The Last Eight Chapters Of Ezekiel
- Thread starter revpete
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The Temple is an integral aspect of God's kingdom.
I doubt that Ezekiel is speaking of literally fishing in a river.
Eze 47:1 Afterward he brought me again unto the door of the house; and, behold, waters issued out from under the threshold of the house eastward: for the forefront of the house stood toward the east, and the waters came down from under from the right side of the house, at the south side of the altar.
Eze 47:2 Then brought he me out of the way of the gate northward, and led me about the way without unto the utter gate by the way that looketh eastward; and, behold, there ran out waters on the right side.
Eze 47:3 And when the man that had the line in his hand went forth eastward, he measured a thousand cubits, and he brought me through the waters; the waters were to the ankles.
Eze 47:4 Again he measured a thousand, and brought me through the waters; the waters were to the knees. Again he measured a thousand, and brought me through; the waters were to the loins.
Eze 47:5 Afterward he measured a thousand; and it was a river that I could not pass over: for the waters were risen, waters to swim in, a river that could not be passed over.
Eze 47:6 And he said unto me, Son of man, hast thou seen this? Then he brought me, and caused me to return to the brink of the river.
Eze 47:7 Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
Eze 47:8 Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.
Eze 47:9 And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
Eze 47:10 And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
Eze 47:11 But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.
Eze 47:12 And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.
Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Rev 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
Mat 4:19 And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
LA
revpete
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Ok, but then you have a reintroduced sacrificial system when our Lord's sacrifice was once and for ever Heb 10:12. How does that work?
Pete
revpete
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So, if it's not literal, what does it mean. I ask this question because opinion is divided and I have never found a satisfactory answer that harmonises with scripture.
Pete
Do you or do you not interpret these chapters literally? If you do then the temple has to be rebuilt and if not then what does it mean?
Pete
Literal.
Do you believe most Jews accept Jesus as the Passover lamb?
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
Literal. God is communicating real things for people to learn, even all the details clearly of literal concepts and objects of, for instance, the temple, or explicit geographical references. To think otherwise is, actually, ridiculous, would mean the Lord is providing us something for people to assign their own values to. This would be to say it's a bunch of confusion to tack your own error on, not even communication, at all. "God is not the author of confusion."
A general rule of interpretation: When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense; therefore take every word at its primary, ordinary, usual, literal meaning, unless the facts of the immediate context, studied in the light of related passages and axiomatic and fundamental truths, indicate clearly otherwise. I don't believe the Lord is interested in anybody writing their own theology, because He is unable to express Himself clearly. Sort of defeats the point of even trying to communicate anything. You don't go to a restaurant and place an order in symbols and expect to get anything you wish. Lastly, most people who try to allegorize the Bible have an agenda, to try and support errors they want to believe, which aren't in scripture in the first place. Cults just love those allegories, always translates to, "I just don't understand the Bible."
A general rule of interpretation: When the plain sense of Scripture makes common sense, seek no other sense; therefore take every word at its primary, ordinary, usual, literal meaning, unless the facts of the immediate context, studied in the light of related passages and axiomatic and fundamental truths, indicate clearly otherwise. I don't believe the Lord is interested in anybody writing their own theology, because He is unable to express Himself clearly. Sort of defeats the point of even trying to communicate anything. You don't go to a restaurant and place an order in symbols and expect to get anything you wish. Lastly, most people who try to allegorize the Bible have an agenda, to try and support errors they want to believe, which aren't in scripture in the first place. Cults just love those allegories, always translates to, "I just don't understand the Bible."
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
Who'd of thought? It boggles the mind how many posts you see, endless disputing, trying to prove the Bible doesn't say what it says. I often wonder when some maverick is going to resort to actually reading the verse. I wonder if these same people read the driver's manual as symbolic, before taking their test?
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
Ok, but then you have a reintroduced sacrificial system when our Lord's sacrifice was once and for ever Heb 10:12. How does that work?
Pete
Something to ponder of the Jews going into the millennium is that they have not actually believed the gospel of Jesus Christ of grace by faith, rather see Him at His second coming and mourn their error (Zechariah 12:10). The time of the Gentiles and the tribulation, the time of Jacob's trouble, are over. These people actually missed the covenant of grace by faith that has made the saints immortal at this time. Flesh people of the millennium still die. The circumstances are not at all the same as the circumstances, as we speak. You can't really call it the faith God demands, to be subject to believing by sight and rule by rod of iron. The millennium is actually most about Israel, the Lord fulfilling His promises to Israel. Just something to think about.
revpete
New member
Yes you're right, it is something to think about. There seems to be a lot second chances going on there though. If some enter the millennium in unbelief, where does that leave the sheep and goats judgement? Also If some die during the reign of our Lord then death has not been totally defeated even though He is on the throne. Don't seem right or in keeping with The Lord's ministry, His character or the promises of scripture.
Some say that the sacrifices are reintroduced as a reminder but then why would anyone need reminding when there would be five everlasting wounds to gaze at? For me these chapters are among the most confusing in The Bible.
Pete
revpete
New member
The natural Jews today reject the NT. How would you expect them to honor Jesus Christ?
They do not have to be confusing if you realize that NT truths were given in the OT in OT terms, and not explained in the OT so that those who think they see are so often blind.
Paul spoke of sacrifices of sheep and many other sacrifices under the new covenant which were given in the law of the OT.
Rom 8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
These are the daily sheep sacrifices. the word "daily" (tamiyd) is in the OT used to indicate that the abomination of desolation is the ending of such sacrifice for the nations as is the daily light ended.
The apostasy of the church first established among the nations by the early elect, will occur to begin the ending of this age.
Dan 12:8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things?
Dan 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.
Dan 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
Dan 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.
Another glaring lesson from EZ which men so easily ignore is that of following the doctrines of their dead church leaders, instead of following the living Christ, shown in this type---
Eze 43:7 And he said unto me, Son of man, the place of my throne, and the place of the soles of my feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel for ever, and my holy name, shall the house of Israel no more defile, neither they, nor their kings, by their whoredom, nor by the carcases of their kings in their high places.
Eze 43:8 In their setting of their threshold by my thresholds, and their post by my posts, and the wall between me and them, they have even defiled my holy name by their abominations that they have committed: wherefore I have consumed them in mine anger.
Eze 43:9 Now let them put away their whoredom, and the carcases of their kings, far from me, and I will dwell in the midst of them for ever.
LA
revpete
New member
You have interesting thoughts on this one this one LA. Thanks for your time.
Pete
revpete
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WonderfulLordJesus
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Revelation states death isn't ended until after the millennium (Rev. 20:14), with respect to millennial mortality. The millennium isn't touted as absolute perfection in the Bible, no heaven on earth of the new Jerusalem, yet. Think of the Satanic Gog Magog deception, rebellion of hoards, after Christ has reigned 1,000 years. As to the sheep and goats, I have no idea who's what, with respect to the Jewish people, just that Zechariah prophesies that Israel will believe by sight, when He returns. For reasons stated, I can make sense of the sacrifices now, the reason for the post, but, as you point out, Ezekiel can be a bear to get your mind around, I've found the most complicated part of the Old Testament to understand, some things I suppose we'll never know, on this side.
revpete
New member
Yes it is a bit of a bear. I am a Pre-millennialist but the position is not without its problems I think because whatever way you interpret there are difficulties.
Pete