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  • #91
    Originally posted by Guyver View Post
    What do you mean the Bible doesn’t have faults?
    the bible doesn't have faults to those who recognize it for what it is - the Word of God


    to those who reject God, like you, it's a curious artifact that is chock-full of error

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by ok doser View Post
      the bible doesn't have faults to those who recognize it for what it is - the Word of God


      to those who reject God, like you, it's a curious artifact that is chock-full of error
      Right. Well, since I don’t reject God you are incorrect on that point. So, you missed on two out of three and got one right. The Bible is a curious artifact for certain. So, you got one part right.

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by Guyver View Post
        Right. Well, since I don’t reject God you are incorrect on that point. So, you missed on two out of three and got one right. The Bible is a curious artifact for certain. So, you got one part right.
        You reject the God of the Bible. Don't try to deny it.

        You reject that He made man with the ability to love, which by definition includes the ability to hate.

        Those who love God will be with Him for eternity.

        God will not force those who hate Him to live with Him for eternity, but he cannot allow injustice to continue for eternity. Therefore those who reject Him must be separated from Him and from others, so that they cannot harm anyone else.

        That's the God of the Bible that you reject.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Guyver View Post
          ... I don’t reject God ..
          you don't reject your own made-up version of God

          no different from animists, mooslims, hindoos

          and you're all headed for the same destination

          Comment


          • #95
            [MENTION=20598]Bee1[/MENTION] - still waiting for you to take a crack at these:
            Originally posted by ok doser View Post
            let's say that you were really interested in finding evidence of the exodus (and not just trolling on the internet)

            where would you look?
            the sinai peninsula is 23,166 square miles

            what would you look for?
            from 3400 +/- years ago, what would you expect to find from a nomadic people traversing the desert, living in tents?


            how would you look for it?
            satellite imagery? random excavations? metal detector sweeps?


            how would you know you'd found it?
            do you expect to find evidence of human presence with a tag attached that says "property of the jews who left egypt in 1446 BC"?

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Bee1 View Post
              Since the time of Moses to now, not much has change in the Middle East geographically speaking. No violence volcanoes or ground changing earthquakes. From the Libya/Eygtian border to Red sea to Israel is about 750 miles. Average walking speed is 4 miles a day so about 175 hours non-stop. So let's slow that down to 1 mile a day = 4×175=700 hours. Let's rest 1 day for every mile (2 million plus people) that's 750 days + 700 hours. The Israelites did not travel in a straight line so let double the distant to 1,500 miles and travel 1/2 mile every 2 days, not even close to 40 years. I know there are some who think that I am being facetious but 40 years to walk 1,500 miles ? And leave no trace of passage?

              Sent from my SM-J700P using Tapatalk
              Watch the Documentary Patterns of Evidence, trailer....https://youtu.be/2assFIyLInE

              I liked it so much I bought it....and I have blogs on how God created the universe over 13.7 billion years, so I keep things real, you will appreciate this, one man was just searching for facts and he met an agostic who told him the dates are all wrong, thus the evidence they say isn't there is just in a different era of time than they are looking or, thus if they just look for all the patterns of evidence, they all line up in a proper time frame of reference, but the Egyptian dates {which they dated referencing Ramses via the bible LOL,} is all wrong, because Ramses was built on top of the original city, and when you look 300 or so years before you actually find the Semite city. Likewise Jericho was inhabited at this time period, etc. etc.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by Rondonmonson View Post
                how God created the universe over 13.7 billion years
                Wrong!

                Comment


                • #98
                  Is that human years or dog years?

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by ok doser View Post
                    nope, not using "science fact"

                    just asking questions - four of them


                    if you were really interested in finding evidence of the exodus (and not just trolling on the internet)

                    1. where would you look?
                    the sinai peninsula is 23,166 square miles

                    2. what would you look for?
                    from 3400 +/- years ago, what would you expect to find from a nomadic people traversing the desert, living in tents?


                    3. how would you look for it?
                    satellite imagery? random excavations? metal detector sweeps?


                    4. how would you know you'd found it?
                    do you expect to find evidence of human presence with a tag attached that says "property of the jews who left egypt in 1446 BC"?
                    This can be done by means of an archaeological survey of the area. Even ancient nomads leave traces- and one should realize that these "nomads" did not move around every day, but stayed in some of the encampments for quite a while.

                    I am familiar with one survey of this type, done in Israel by Adam Zertal's group. Adam has since died, but as far as I know, the group is continuing with his work. They have identified many sites associated with early Israelite settlements. There are dating methods based on pottery types, and even the occasional Egyptian scarab. Adam, by the way, was convinced of the historicity of the Israelite settlement of Canaan in the 12th century BC, but equally convinced that the numbers reported in Exodus were not realistic. The promised land could not support that many people, and as a result of the survey and excavations, once can estimate how many people lived in the area at the time. About an order of magnitude less than what Exodus claims.

                    We are used to a world where tens of millions live in single cities, and it is hard for us to imagine a world where an important city might have 5,000 or 10,000 people in it.

                    Chair

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by JudgeRightly View Post
                      Wrong!
                      That's not the subject here, so I don't want to walk all over his thread.....but that is a fact, the universe is 13.7 billion years old, and I am preacher of over 30 years who has a blog on this subject, so I am referencing that to show I am not prone to just go with the flow, the Documentary is excellent. Thus there is plenty of "evidence" of the Exodus, but one has to look in the right places of course.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by chair View Post
                        ... it is hard for us to imagine a world where an important city might have 5,000 or 10,000 people in it.

                        Chair

                        I live in northern New York state, adjacent to the largest county in the state (by area), St Lawrence County. The county seat - the place where the county government is sited, is Canton, population 6487.

                        So yeah, i get it

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Rondonmonson View Post
                          .... that is a fact, the universe is 13.7 billion years old....

                          no, not a fact


                          a theory, based on extrapolations and interpretations of existing phenomena

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by chair View Post
                            This can be done by means of an archaeological survey of the area. Even ancient nomads leave traces- and one should realize that these "nomads" did not move around every day, but stayed in some of the encampments for quite a while.

                            I am familiar with one survey of this type, done in Israel by Adam Zertal's group. Adam has since died, but as far as I know, the group is continuing with his work. They have identified many sites associated with early Israelite settlements. There are dating methods based on pottery types, and even the occasional Egyptian scarab. Adam, by the way, was convinced of the historicity of the Israelite settlement of Canaan in the 12th century BC, but equally convinced that the numbers reported in Exodus were not realistic. The promised land could not support that many people, and as a result of the survey and excavations, once can estimate how many people lived in the area at the time. About an order of magnitude less than what Exodus claims.

                            We are used to a world where tens of millions live in single cities, and it is hard for us to imagine a world where an important city might have 5,000 or 10,000 people in it.

                            Chair
                            Correct, but you can't look in the wrong time-frame and find the evidence. Ramses II was not the Pharaoh of the Exodus, so looking in that time period will yield no information about the Exodus. It seems Dedumose II was the Pharaoh of the Exodus. Looking in the right time period is a must when one is using archaeology.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by ok doser View Post
                              no, not a fact


                              a theory, based on extrapolations and interpretations of existing phenomena
                              It's not really even a debate, we have light coming from stars, and we know how fast light travels. You young earth brothers have to change the Laws of Nature God gave us....that doesn't work with me brother, I can't go down that road. God Bless, we can't all agree on all things, that is what makes us all unique.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Rondonmonson View Post
                                Correct, but you can't look in the wrong time-frame and find the evidence. Ramses II was not the Pharaoh of the Exodus, so looking in that time period will yield no information about the Exodus. It seems Dedumose II was the Pharaoh of the Exodus. Looking in the right time period is a must when one is using archaeology.
                                In a survey of where nomads have been, most finds aren't buried in layers, like in a city. You just walk slowly over the entire area, looking for pottery shards and the like. You don't look in a particular period.

                                Trying to match the Exodus to the Egyptian historical record is an interesting exercise, but one which doesn't appeal to me much. I am Jewish, and view the Exodus story in the Bible as our ancient tradition. I don't need to "prove" it to myself or to anybody else.

                                Comment

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