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  • #46
    Stipe writes:
    You said Christians run their lives based on the notion that God would punish them over their beliefs, but everyone will face judgement to the same extent for what they have done regardless of what they believe.
    Originally Posted by Jonahdog View Post
    His original comment clearly indicated that what you "did" in life would count on Judgment Day.
    Stipe denies:
    No, it didn't.
    Welcome to Stipeworld, where all chairs are orange and no chairs are orange.
    This message is hidden because ...

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Stripe View Post
      No, it didn't.

      Really, then please explain this:
      Stripe wrote "You said Christians run their lives based on the notion that God would punish them over their beliefs, but everyone will face judgement to the same extent for what they have done regardless of what they believe."
      Especially the underlined part.

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Jonahdog View Post
        Really, then please explain this:
        Stripe wrote "You said Christians run their lives based on the notion that God would punish them over their beliefs, but everyone will face judgement to the same extent for what they have done regardless of what they believe."
        Especially the underlined part.
        What's to explain?

        I tried to write something you would agree with: Everybody — to the same extent — will give an account for what they have done.

        So if one person has to account for everything he has done, everybody will be doing the same. However, you probably believe that nobody will face judgement.
        Where is the evidence for a global flood?
        E≈mc2
        "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

        "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
        -Bob B.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Stripe View Post
          What's to explain?

          I tried to write something you would agree with: Everybody — to the same extent — will give an account for what they have done.

          So if one person has to account for everything he has done, everybody will be doing the same. However, you probably believe that nobody will face judgement.
          If the issue is faith vs. works then why would anyone need to account for their deeds. If you are "born again" you have salvation, what else is necessary? If simple belief and faith is not enough then you need to account for your good works.
          That dichotomy seems at the base of a major split within Christianity. Which do you believe it is? Based on your comments it would appear that faith alone is not enough. That is all I am trying to clear up.

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Jonahdog View Post
            If the issue is faith vs. works then why would anyone need to account for their deeds.
            Because the issue of faith versus works deals with salvation, while the accounting deals with justice.

            If you are "born again" you have salvation, what else is necessary?
            Nothing.

            If simple belief and faith is not enough then you need to account for your good works.
            Confessing Jesus Christ as risen Lord and savior is the only thing that counts toward salvation. To claim that this means Christians are excused from other things is just plain silly. It'd be like if you said: Breathing is enough for life, therefore people who breath do not have to walk.

            That dichotomy seems at the base of a major split within Christianity. Which do you believe it is? Based on your comments it would appear that faith alone is not enough. That is all I am trying to clear up.
            There is no "major split." A Christian necessarily believes that their confession of Jesus Christ is the only thing they do that plays any part in their salvation.
            Where is the evidence for a global flood?
            E≈mc2
            "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

            "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
            -Bob B.

            Comment


            • #51
              So Stripe, if you are saved what matters works? Are there levels in heaven depending on how "good" you were on earth?

              Comment


              • #52
                There is no "major split." A Christian necessarily believes that their confession of Jesus Christ is the only thing they do that plays any part in their salvation.
                Let's see what Jesus says:


                Matthew 25:31 And when the Son of man shall come in his majesty, and all the angels with him, then shall he sit upon the seat of his majesty. [32] And all nations shall be gathered together before him, and he shall separate them one from another, as the shepherd separateth the sheep from the goats: [33] And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on his left. [34] Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. [35] For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink; I was a stranger, and you took me in:

                [36] Naked, and you covered me: sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me. [37] Then shall the just answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, and fed thee; thirsty, and gave thee drink? [38] And when did we see thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and covered thee? [39] Or when did we see thee sick or in prison, and came to thee? [40] And the king answering, shall say to them: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it to one of these my least brethren, you did it to me.

                [41] Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. [42] For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. [43] I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. [44] Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? [45] Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me.

                [46] And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.


                Looks like Stipe is correcting God, again.
                This message is hidden because ...

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Jonahdog View Post
                  So Stripe, if you are saved what matters works?
                  What?

                  Are there levels in heaven depending on how "good" you were on earth?
                  Kinda.

                  You don't have to worry about that though.
                  Where is the evidence for a global flood?
                  E≈mc2
                  "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

                  "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
                  -Bob B.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Jonahdog asks:
                    Are there levels in heaven depending on how "good" you were on earth?
                    Stipe replies:
                    Kinda.
                    This "kinda."

                    [34]Then shall the king say to them that shall be on his right hand: Come, ye blessed of my Father, possess you the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. [35] For I was hungry, and you gave me to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me to drink; I was a stranger, and you took me in:

                    [36] Naked, and you covered me: sick, and you visited me: I was in prison, and you came to me...

                    [41] Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. [42] For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. [43] I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me...

                    [46]And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.


                    That's some kinda "kinda."
                    This message is hidden because ...

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Stripe View Post



                      Kinda.

                      You don't have to worry about that though.
                      Really, different levels of heaven based on how good you were on earth. Hunh, got some verses that support that? Sounds suspiciously like a bit of Catholic Purgatory.
                      And how do you know how to get to that highest level? Sounds like a multilevel marketing deal to me.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Jonahdog View Post
                        Really, different levels of heaven based on how good you were on earth. Hunh, got some verses that support that? Sounds suspiciously like a bit of Catholic Purgatory.
                        And how do you know how to get to that highest level? Sounds like a multilevel marketing deal to me.
                        You should study up on the different levels of hell. Who knows, with some effort, you might be able to stay nearer the top of the bottomless pit.
                        Where is the evidence for a global flood?
                        E≈mc2
                        "the best maths don't need no stinkin' numbers"

                        "The waters under the 'expanse' were under the crust."
                        -Bob B.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Angel4Truth View Post
                          I was taught the things in school that he complains about not being taught.

                          Consumer math for instance was a required course in my high school, just so we would all be prepared for adulthood. I assumed it was taught in all of them.
                          You're also older than he is. It seems every year that more and more necessary information is being left out of public school curriculum.

                          Originally posted by Daniel1611 View Post
                          I used to date a girl that had a 9 year old daughter, and I helped her with her homework. The garbage they sent her home with was infuriating. I called the school at least once and they had no good answer for it.
                          My girlfriend's daughter just graduated from 3rd grade and she had "or" as a spelling word this year. That was just the first example of the ignorance of government funded education these days that I was subjected to this year.
                          sigpic

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
                            You're also older than he is. It seems every year that more and more necessary information is being left out of public school curriculum.


                            My girlfriend's daughter just graduated from 3rd grade and she had "or" as a spelling word this year. That was just the first example of the ignorance of government funded education these days that I was subjected to this year.
                            Wow. Well, this 9 year old brought home a book to read. She struggles with reading still so I would try to help. This book was called like Alkahrbaadjkah Helps Mommy Make Dinner. "First AlkHrbaadjkah gets out the bljsyhkilm and some krighnithjk and they mix it together."

                            The books got all these weird foreign words. The kids trying to learn to read English. I can't even tell her how to say this gibberish. I asked the school why they would use such books, especially for children who are just learning to read.

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                            • #59
                              Welcome to America. If you feel bad, remember, that there were idiots making the same complaints as Dutch, German, Irish, Italian, etc. immigrants came here, and became part of our culture.


                              "You're in the wrong place, sucker!"
                              This message is hidden because ...

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Stripe View Post
                                You should study up on the different levels of hell. Who knows, with some effort, you might be able to stay nearer the top of the bottomless pit.
                                Well your suggestion was the different levels of heaven. Just trying to clear that up first, then if you wish we can discuss the levels of hell. Best I can recall you suggested that the works you did, once you were saved of course, determined what level of heaven you went to. Please explain.

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